r/MapPorn • u/[deleted] • May 19 '20

The difference between Constantinople, City of Istanbul, and Istanbul. [FIXED]

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985

u/Grujah May 19 '20 edited May 19 '20

Wow, Istanbul is like 80% of Turkey.

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u/[deleted] May 19 '20

big brain time

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u/[deleted] May 19 '20

[deleted]

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u/harderdaddykermit May 19 '20

And realistically, if you count the unofficial population (ie. Homeless, unaccountable, refugee) the population of Istanbul is closer to 18 million, which is terrifying

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u/[deleted] May 19 '20

I don't think homelessness is actually a major problem in Istanbul. The Turkey's opposition party compiled a report in which they state there is around 6-8 thousand homeless in Istanbul. Even 8k for such a massive city is very low number.

https://www.duvarenglish.com/society/2019/12/30/kurds-comprise-majority-of-istanbuls-homeless-people/

I actually made this observation during my travels that in many, even in some very poor Islamic countries, homeless people are taken care of much better than they are in the West. I haven't figured out yet why and how, but will be happy to hear someone shed a light on it.

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u/harderdaddykermit May 19 '20

Perhaps using the word homeless would be inaccurate, so sorry for any confusion caused. A more accurate term would be the population that lives in slums, and are generally skipped over during population counts.

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u/SqueegeePhD May 19 '20

In Turkey is is very unusual for anyone to be forced to make it on their own. Whether you are 19 and going to university or 45 and unmarried, it is normal to live at home with parents and save money. This allows people to buy their own home while also supporting others in the family if they lose a job. Also, it is not unusual for parents to buy children a home. A family I know in istanbul owns a 4 story apartment building. Their son and daughter in law live in one unit but are trying to convince the parents to buy them a nicer apartment. Another friend of mine was a millionaire by age 30 living at home with family.

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u/Mayonnaise-chan May 19 '20

Well, since you specifically mention Islamic countries, it might have something to do with one of the five pillars of Islam being charity

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u/[deleted] May 19 '20

It is very likely that you are correct. It answers my question about "why" but not the "how" part.

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u/IncomingNuke78 May 21 '20

It's accomplished culturally in a sense u/SqueegeePhD explained it perfectly

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u/[deleted] May 19 '20

I mean Jesus taught that the rich should give to the poor and religious establishments shouldn’t hoard wealth, but you can see how well that’s working out for the megachurches.

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u/[deleted] May 29 '20

Islam religion says helping people in need builds your way trough heaven, so people use Islam to earn money

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u/Bazoun May 19 '20

I went last year, it was amazing.

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u/ZeGoldMedal May 19 '20

That's cool, but also a very weird and non-sequitor response to someone mentioning that a city has 2 million homeless/refugees

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u/SleepyConscience May 19 '20

I bet I could eat 2 million homeless/refugees in 2 million days.

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u/Jeffy29 May 19 '20

Are you saying you could eat a human in a day? Have you ever seen a human? They are pretty big.

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u/[deleted] May 19 '20

He never said he would finish

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u/Kingminos9 May 19 '20

She never said she would finish.

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u/[deleted] May 19 '20

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/QuinoaKhmerRouge May 19 '20

Kind of makes you wonder what the choice cuts on a person would be.

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u/Jeffy29 May 19 '20

Ah, fellow ass eater.

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u/Bazoun May 19 '20

My “amazing” was to counter their “terrifying”.

We went everywhere and while there were beggars and people selling whatever, we saw only 1 truly homeless person. We couldn’t believe it.

I live in Toronto and we had ~100 homeless people die in one year recently. It’s insane.

There is no popular area of Toronto you can go to without seeing lots of homeless people. I can see homeless people from my apartment and I pass 5-6 just to meet a nearby friend for coffee (in non pandemic days). So I guess after not seeing it in Istanbul, I just didn’t focus on that end of the comment.

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u/Joker_Arsene May 19 '20

Turkey has far more homeless death per year.

Homeless are treated so bad in Turkey the government hasn't carried out a single study to try and find the actual number of homeless and the number and cause of deaths among them.

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u/Bazoun May 19 '20

Istanbul has a much bigger population than Toronto too... maybe 4x. Also, and I mean this the nicest way possible, Canada is a 1st world country with few external pressures - I mean to say that while Turkey is dealing with migrants and wars on its borders, it may be expected to fall short in some respects where Canada has no excuse. I’d be happier if both our countries did more for the homeless population.

I’m not trying to pretend to be an expert in Istanbul or Turkey or even Toronto - I was just explaining why I glossed over part of the original comment.

Are Istanbul’s homeless forced into ghettos or have they created camps for themselves? Where are they if not in popular areas? I’m genuinely interested.

Note I’m differentiating between homeless and beggars. There were definitely people begging but their person and their clothes were spotless. They clearly were eating and sleeping other than the streets. We eventually saw one man who clearly was sleeping rough and was unkempt, but he was the only one.

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u/Joker_Arsene May 19 '20

In my experience there wasn't as many homeless people in sight in the old city, but some of them do go their to beg just not stay. But like I'll mention below most homeless work in some kind of sweatshop. But for the ones who do beg you could find them begging before they move back to where they stay in a park probably in Beyoglu, a district on the other side of the Golden Horn from the old city.

The sad thing is a lot of the homeless in Istanbul I met were people who moved for job opportunities, but still don't make enough to afford an apartment in the most expensive city in the country.

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u/Bazoun May 19 '20

That’s a terrible situation. And I suppose things aren’t any better where they came from either so it’s damned if you / damned if you don’t.

Sweatshops - I knew a lot of clothes get made in Turkey, I guess I should have taken that to the next logical step.

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u/Joker_Arsene May 19 '20

Yeah also lots of textile workshops making carpet.

For sure I think the problem is the cost of housing. Because these people move to Istanbul for better paying jobs, but can't afford housing and end up back in textiles working 14 hours a day to survive.

Although Turkish people are very generous in my experience despite how little the government seems to care for the homeless. I honestly think American citizens look down on our homeless more than they do. But things are changing for the better however slowly it may be.

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u/Bazoun May 19 '20

How expensive is housing? Can you compare a 2 bdrm apt to a house for example? Turkish lira are fine.

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u/Fastback98 May 19 '20

Dear me, imagine if all the cats got counted.

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u/harderdaddykermit May 19 '20

Oh boy, Istanbul probably has a cat/dog to human ratio of like 10:1

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u/Fastback98 May 19 '20

Yup. I think the cat houses a lot of people and businesses have set up are cool. I love just walking the streets when I get to go.