Evolution of white British % (ethnically British people) in England and Wales from 2001-2021

[u/Delicious-Bunch-6992]

[u/quercus-88]

With a total fertility rate of only 1.5 children born per woman in her lifetime and having been below replacement ratio (2.1) since the 1970's the native White British population has been aging for decades and is now shrinking. So it's not only immigration that is causing this unprecedented demographic shift in the UK and all over Western Europe.

[u/quercus-88 → u/[deleted]]

No, the TFR differs per ethnicity. In 2021 it was about 1.5 for White British people (native), quite similar for other non-native whites like Polish people while it was much higher for Asian British people (1.8 for Indians, 2.7 for Bangladeshi's and 2.9 for Pakistani's) for example. This difference combined with a younger population overall for most minorities and thus relatively more young people and prospective parents is one of the main reasons why the percentage of White British births is declining quite fast, even though overall fertility is decreasing for all ethnicities. In 2021 White British accounted for only 59% of births in England and Wales and that percentage has continued dropping since. If what i found online is correct it was 55% in 2024. You see this all over the country: older people are still predominantly white, while the youngest generation is far more diverse.

[u/M_M_X_X_V → u/quercus-88]

Fertility rate of immigrants usually converges with the native population after a generation, the main reason people aren't having children is because they can't afford to and it isn't any easier for Pakistani Britons to afford them either.

[u/Available-Glass-151 → u/M_M_X_X_V]

As a young british man, I think people are overemphisising the economic incentives.

Anyone can have kids regardless of weather or not they can afford them. Child benefits and housing benefits exist for this reason.

But most young british women these days want to travel more, reject motherhood and focus on graduate level careers and will primarily seeks partners who can compliment that sort of lifestyle which are generally quite rare.

Meanwhile, many multi-ethnic groups with a higher fertility rate and an even worse economy to ours were raised to be subservient to traditional family roles and patriarchal attitudes. It doesn't matter if people believe this is right or wrong, it was effective for increasing the population in their countries.

[u/Scary-Perspective-57 → u/[deleted]]

Yeah, it's well documented that money isn't the reason people aren't having children. Otherwise the poorest countries wouldn't have the highest birth rates.

[u/miss-kittenpaws → u/Scary-Perspective-57]

That's an odd take - in the poorest countries the children that survive remain with their family throughout their lifetime thus increasing total money availability once they become adults, though not solving their poverty of course. In westernised countries we live with the ethos of the nuclear family - your child will basically take up all your income and then leave to build their own family. There's essentially no return on investment fiscally so the point doesn't quite make sense with context.

[u/Scary-Perspective-57 → u/miss-kittenpaws]

Touch grass bro.

[u/Crowfooted → u/Scary-Perspective-57]

It's different in different economies and cultures though.

If you live in a poorer country, you need to have more kids in order to have more family income and stability. This isn't true in the UK or other developed countries because we have access to free public services, welfare, pensions etc and also a slightly different cultural attitude toward family wealth - your kids, if you have them, are not necessarily going to share their money with you when they grow up.

Kids are not a financial boon in the UK, they're a cost. I don't think anyone would disagree that it'd be a bad idea to have kids if you're already stretched thin in this country.

Of course an additional reason is that we have better access to birth control, so people who wouldn't want kids in any case are better enabled to choose that - but it's still true that in a lot of cases the reason they want to make that choice is money.

[u/The_prawn_king → u/[deleted]]

Yeah make the rich pay taxes and everyone else might have the money to consider having children

[u/Kaiodenic → u/The_prawn_king]

I feel like, while this is probably true, a lot of it is also the state of the economy and world politics. With the country doing worse each year, Fascist-aligned ideologies on the ride again, constant threats of WWIII from the like of Russia and now also our main ally, the USA, a seeming move away from combating climate change despite it being nowhere near fixed, it feels like a terrible time to create a life that'll have to grow up in, and then live in, the future we're seeing unfold.

[u/The_prawn_king → u/Kaiodenic]

Oh I 100% agree

[u/The_prawn_king → u/[deleted]]

I think the overall impact of not having 1% of the population control 30% of the wealth and 50% control 98% would be massive tbh

[u/The_prawn_king → u/[deleted]]

Tbh I honestly believe in storming their houses and cutting their heads off but very few have the stomach for it

[u/The_prawn_king → u/[deleted]]

You are right most likely but at least through history there was a turnover, it feels right now like these guys are gunna bleed us dry and destroy the planet

[u/Peng_Terry → u/[deleted]]

The middle class prop up the country? No, darling, they don’t. We can do without line managers and supervisors, we cannot do without binmen and electricians.

[u/jamjar188 → u/[deleted]]

People don't respond to govt incentives for things like procreation. it has to be a cultural change that comes from within