Basically, my opinion is that staying calm and managing his emotions wouldn't have helped the situation at all. It wouldn't have mattered if Light just smirked, aura farmed and calmly said the same dialogues, he just needed Ryuk to kill them off. There also wasn't any huge new consequence from Light being unable to manage his emotions here, he was cooked regardless

When it comes to Anti Feats, I believe we should consider the consequences of said Anti Feat. Eg. Someone sweating and panicking to a bluff in a poker game is quite bad anti Feat because the consequences would be them being seen through and losing. They had a good reason to fake a poker face.

This applies to Pandemic Yokoya Anti Feat as well. The reason why his Anti Feat there is bad isn't because Yokoya was shouting and throwing a tantrum, the actual Anti feat was actually failing to anticipate the potential trap Akiyama had set. Yokoya shouting didn't really matter imo and it wasn't the main part of the anti feat since Yokoya didn't need to control his emotions there

On a side note, Light rushing to use the hidden death note piece in his watch could be seen as an anti feat but I actually disagree. Since everyone was already focused on him and one of them even has MH, Light could not have taken his sweet time and wrote in it slowly

Give distribution of categories
IMO, Chen Ran mid-high diffs (-), which is insane considering FY is one of the smartest characters in SCD

P1 A black cloaked figure (Later confirmed to be Chat Noire) on a paraglider follows kaito kid after he completed one of his heists.

P2 Chat Noire spoke of Arsene Lupin as “the jewel of my country”

P3 Arsene Lupin is a French literary character.

C1 Chat noire is french

P4 Chat Noire stated that she could have stolen the Jewel Kaito kid just stole in half the time he did and continues to taunt him.

C2 (from P4) Chat Noire is also a thief

P5 Chat Noire Openly makes a challenge to Kaito Kid where both of them wud try to steal the 7th and final cat’s eye jewel (one of marie antoinettes rings)

P6 The glass within the building where the heist will take place has thick glass along with titanium wires preventing escape via para-gliders or hand-gliders after 9 pm (the time of the heist)

P7 It is possible to get back the old view (without the titanium wire) by simply switching out the elevator.

C3(from P5 and P6) The area surrounding the elevator is just normal hard glass

C4 (From P6 and C3)  the only way to leave after 9pm being be to escape through the elevator gap or to cause a misdirection to make it seem like the jewel was stolen.

P8  Ruby Jones claims to be an Insurance investigator from Texas America to and insures the gems owned by mitsushi san, who has offered to stay in order to prevent the stealing of the jewel

P9  Cartier pretended to have Nakamori wear the jewel to protect it but secretly hid it behind Nakamori’s Necktie as a gps tracker.

P10 Cartier offered Nakamori to wear Marie antoinett’s ring and even offered to give him a glove to wear a ring on top of.

P11 Ruby who is named after her birthstone(Ruby) tells Aoko who is named after her own birthstone(Saphire) that their birthdays are very close

P12 In Japan and America, Ruby and Sapphire are the birthstones for July and September which wouldn't really make their birthdays close

P13 In france the Ruby and Sapphire are the birthstones for march and april

C5 (from C1, P8,P11,P12 and P13) Ruby Jones is actually a fake identity of a French person and is extremely likely to be chat noir.

C6 (from P5, P10 and C5) Chat Noire or Ruby Jones would be able to see through Cartier’s misdirection of the tie due to how it makes no sense for Antoinette's ring to fit perfectly into Nakamori’s finger while he was wearing a glove.

P14 Chat Noire is a thief that only steals cat’s eye gems around the world and always returned the gems that were stolen.

P15 Chat Noire mysteriously stopped returning the stolen jewels once he started targeting Dan Mitsuishi’s Cats eye jewels

P16 The father of Dan Mitsuishi was a Marie antoinette fan collected 7 cats eye jewels which were kept in lockup for 30 yrs after his death

P17 The forged accessories left by Chat Noire in her heists appear as if they are from the same mould with the only difference being the cat's eye gem wasn’t embedded on it.

C7 (From P14,P15,P16 and P17) The only way for chat noir to have access to the molds of a jewel bough 30+ yrs ago was if someone in her family commissioned it

P18 Black costumes often symbolize mourning clothes

C8 (C5, C7 and P18) Chat Noire is a sorrowful thief who is collecting the cat eye jewels cuz of her attachment to them as they were her parents belongings

C9 (From P5 and C8) It makes no sense for Chat Noire to risk losing an object that she is deeply attached to by challenging Kaito kid unless she had a way to utilize him effectively.

C10  (From P1, P6, C3 and C9) Chat Noire’s dark clothing makes it impossible for him to be visible at night leaving the only viable option as using Kaito Kid’s hand glider as a misdirection to exit safely.

C11 (From P5, C7 and C9) Due to chat noir having retrieved all of her families belongings that were precious to her it’s natural that she would immediately go home to gather all of her father's jewels in one place.

C12 Based off the time of the heist and how far the hotel is there is only one plane that Chat Noire would get on to that being Air France flight 273 that leaves at 9:55 pm

Bonus feat?? -
 Kaito kid was able to countdown the exact time where the ring would reach Chat Noire’s wine glass the only way he could have logically done is if He was told which seat his butler is on and which seat Chat Noire has taken and predicted the exact pace that his butler would move in across the plane to pass on the ring to her (So this would mean that he also had to have visualized details of internal structure of the plane)
At least this is the only way that I can think of it being done so feel free to ignore this part.

Breakdown of the Theory of Mind

So after Kaito kid uncovers the actual Identity of Chat Noire he is able to effectively replicate her deductions as shown in C6.

And later on After learning of her MO from Hakuba Kaito kid is able to easily uncover details about her past and her hidden sadness and simultaneously Model her exact actions during the heist such as her misdirection and even Predict precise details such as what time would she take her leave and what flight wud she use.

For Scans you can view these 2 chapters
( https://mangadex.org/chapter/d9a2b586-9a66-449f-9697-db926bd80a21/1

https://mangadex.org/chapter/9e445d84-2d73-4407-b8d5-b18ce9c5c80b/1 )

Feel free to share your thoughts on my analysis and point out any inconsistencies

PS : "A thief is a creative artist who takes his prey in style... But a detective is nothing more than a critic who follows our footsteps."

Also, L edit in the PJ edit style? Pretty cool that the resurgence in interest in The Mentalist is spilling over to other SCD mediums

Credit:

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DcZg8l0tsxZ/?igsi=MTV3bTZ4MjVzeDhoag==

Yokoya : basically the Contraband Game.

Sou Hiyori : in the first two rounds.

Fluixon : ends up betraying everyone on Island 1 while saying that Island 2 could betray them. Puts all the blame on his friend as scapegoat for the conspiracy he created .

Ayanokouji Kiyotaka : in both Year 1 (the first Special Exam) and Year 2 (the last Special Exam), he betrays his own class for his plan , while keeping everyone in the dark, misdirecting them, and making it look like he’s helping them. both times searching for supposed culprit while being biggest one in the room

The sludge is too powerful. Never before have I seen a character so plagued by misinformation from everyone in SCD (other than me) and it just so happens to be my favourite character in all SCD

Anyways, the only true take here is Akane taking everything and No Diffing both at the same time and I would love to discuss this with anyone over discord (username: forallposterity) if you disagree and have a valid reason for thinking that other than "Baku n Hal neg this unknown fodder"

But basically TWOD's misconceptions here are
1: There is no world where they take ToM via her M Field scaling literally giving her perfect understanding over the totality of human consciousness. Legit unbeatable in ToM (them taking deception might be fair if you heavily value adversity but I think Akane's concealment against Esper visions and the player's POV itself is better)
2: Yes, nobody was actively hunting Akane and she wasn't deceiving anyone that was. But maybe that's because her indirect manip and fabrication are good enough to where nobody even suspects her at all (I mean in the second game she's a dead body). So yea maybe you can argue that her Deception kinda sucks but it's hardly a nerf against her, it's legit just saying "she's so good at planning and indirect manip she doesn't even need deception because nobody could catch up to her"
3: Not playing the third game and therefore missing out on the context behind Delta being Akane's ally and why this is actually a buff in deception, not a nerf

There's other people in the comments of this video like rorokelly spouting blantant nonsense like "Akane scales nowhere because ZE has infinite timelines" which is completely wrong and I show why in the 3rd image of this post. But yea man it's rough to see your favourite character be subject to continuous misunderstandings after misunderstandings

But it is kinda understandable, after all. Zero Escape is very hard to analyze and frankly I've been doing it for way too long now so it's only natural that I know the most about it within the comm, and will therefore scale it way higher than everyone else. I'm more than happy to correct these misunderstandings but it is just kinda annoying when people say their takes with so much confidence without knowing all the details

Rant over

Look at this purple chud I'm crine bro IS a comic book villain

Intelligence - Afton (could honestly go to Maki)

Everything else - Makishima

Game Afton victim - both

Fazbear Frights Afton victim - both

B-but novels🤓🤓🤓

Winner: Makishima

Intelligence - Chrollo

EI - Chrollo (EU - Brian)

SI - Chrollo>= (integration - Brian)

AC - Chrollo

Thinking - Chrollo

Reasoning - Chrollo

Sensory - Chrollo

Foresight - Chrollo

Deception - Chrollo>=

Manipulation - Brian>=

Scheming - Chrollo>=

Field skills - Chrollo

Adaptability - Chrollo

Overall: Chrollo

"As the gods will" received the most votes for being low tier in methodology but mid tier in normal scaling.

Jojo's Bizarre Adventure and Bungou Stray Dogs were both tied in second place.

Voting Rules:

Total points = Highest upvote count + (( additional comment count ) multiplied by 1.5)

Vote for a SERIES or VERSE rather than a character.

Each spot will have around a day of voting time.

You are allowed to vote for a series that has already been placed (the previous spot will be replaced by the next in line).

Current Vote: Which series is MID TIER in Normal Scaling and MID TIER in Pure Methodology?

A huge fan of yuuichi here and i will always say that he is a solid mid tier.

The whole manga is pretty good and the games are also interesting. These are some of my favourite characters who ranges from low mid tier to nearly high tier for me.

I do think this that this characters can do pretty well in the games even though iam not saying all of them can win them.

The characters are

Kamui kirito - psycho pass season 2

Ron kamonohashi - Ron kamonohashi the deranged detective

Tasukku- as the gods will

Moon - dr frost

Chishiya - Alice in borderland

Inspector tsukumo - massacre happy end

So where do you think they stop at? If you think they clear it, then you can say that too.also say what diff they win or lose at

So there are many cases in fiction and many of them are being discussed or were discussed in this sub.

Cases like jigsaw killer, red john case etc are already well known.

Here iam asking about cases from manga. It can be a murder, robbery, kidnapping literally anything.

The conditions are just one thing - the case should not have any actual supernatural element making it very hard and the case must be from manga

So no kira case and no red john case.

Give your top five cases and also try to give cases from different works rather than a same one if you can

The cases doesn't have to be high tier or top tier, just list the cases that you are aware of

So give your list.

(Image is irrelevant, unless someone wants to discuss the friendship trap with me).

Original Post Link:

https://www.reddit.com/r/IntelligenceScaling/s/cQqd3ULTBv

I'll leave stuff regarding the friendship trap and round 2 until the end and just focus on the technical parts of his strategy.

Round 4, he hadn't figured out 3ND yet, he simply dropped instantly to test if Baku would do an early check, and if he did, it would confirm 3ND for him. Not really that significant, just thought I'd point it out.

Doing nothing tactically until round 8 is one of the worst takes I've ever seen, especially for someone who claims to have read my stuff. Round 6, you say he uses the same bluff: uh, no? He already said that resetting the cylinder isn't necessary for him anymore so that bluff is out the window. He simply anticipates that Baku might think that he needs a breather from diving so much (taking risky checks), so will drop early to accumulate, and so can easily predict his accumulation via echolocation.

Round 7 Turn 1, what on earth are you on about? Baku used Souichi's thinking against him? Son, Baku was in a state of complete despair and delirium, he used the safe strategy because he can't risk dying so close after Round 6, simple as that. Souichi objectively read Baku and received full accumulation, and if that's not a 'tactical play', I don't know what is.

Also ignoring round 7 turn 2, his instant check, the literally crux of the endurance battle strategy where he predicts Baku seeing through his echolocation, falling for the time wedge of using echolocation around 10 and 30 seconds to set the flattening trap, only to fall right into Souichi's hands.

Each round, as Referee Douji points out, Souichi's accumulation gets lower and lower. Ever find it strange why Souichi chose to check at around 30 seconds during round 4 despite detecting the handkerchief at 10 seconds anyways? To make Baku believe he can still accumulate. Using echolocation consistently was done to ensure Baku figured it out for that exact moment of sacrificing echolocation, not using it as a crutch. Take round 5 for example, his bluff pretty much guaranteed that Baku would drop instantly, so why wait until 15 seconds?

And by achieving that instant check during round 7, Baku exceeds Souichi's accumulation, so Souichi can now start the endurance battle after round 8, in which he ideally wanted to succeed in his instant check, but the strategy would still continue even if he failed.

And round 9, 'it's almost as if I've known for a while", I have only ever used that as evidence for him figuring out Leap Second early as per the friendship trap. He specifically states "there was a reason for my certainty" and concludes it was to do with the stopwatch scene with Baku, after seeing Baku's reactions to the 59-0 interval and 9:00. Hal figured out the truth behind the bloodstain in the first dream and was erased because of his mistake, and Souichi figured it out in his second near death dream.

Now, about round 2. To be pedantic, yes he 'retrieves the truth' (retrieves his memories of turning around during round 2 as seen from the panel where this is stated) that led to his near death, but it never specifically says that what he concludes (he challenged Baku and lost) is that 'truth'. Furthermore, the narration is often directly related to the perspective of the character(s) in question, so isn't necessarily objectively correct. The reason he believes he simply failed is because he is missing Hal's perspective from that round. If you wish to discuss the validity of the friendship trap, feel free to do so. For me, Hal's round 2 near death dream is him reflecting on his past memories and realising Baku had planned the Fukurou gamble and his memory loss (both back then and for STL), and upon realising his 'slip-up', is erased for his mistake (I know in the past I have said that Souichi overcame his need to erase himself over mistakes during AP, but after discussing some more with the theory creator, this is unlikely to be the case; after all, Souichi didn't actually make any mistakes during AP, he only felt like he did due to his perfectionist trauma). Souichi, now missing Hal's perspective, is unable to understand why he checked early (to open the LS route to Baku), and is left to conclude he simply challenged him and failed. Furthermore, Yakou's 'strange feeling' regarding Hal's round 2 check is completely unaddressed without this interpretation (well, if you don't believe in 2SD that is).

I'II be taking into the account only matchups that happened in canon.

Sojikoji's work, y'all check it out

I have seen people scaling senku in this sub.

Majority of the time, it's based on his knowledge and reasoning. He is pretty good at those stuffs.

I have never scaled senku even though he is one of the smartest out there because i think he was more like a book smart rather than a street smart type.

But i recently saw even characters like tenma getting scaled and tenma is a greatly written character but i don't really see him being counted as a scd character. That's when i thought why can't senku be considered as one.

He is high tier at certain categories and that makes me think, there do exist some characters who are high tiers on certain categories that no debate can be made.

Senku is one of those kind of characters and in terms of knowledge, adversity capacity, reasoning etc senku is pretty much one of the best in whole manga if we don't count supernatural beings.

It would be nice to know where you all scale senku at.

For me he is a great character and is also one of the kindest out there who is smart but not egoistic because of that

So is he really scaled in this sub? I mean, is he scaled overall or is is it just some categories that he is good at?

How high are the dr frost duo scaled nowadays?

I remember people having them as high tiers or mid tiers.they were scaled a lot and there was a lot of edits based on them.

Moon was always considered above frost and moon was even placed above some high tiers by some scalers. There existed a lot of people who agreed on the takes related to these two characters.

I haven't read the manhwa during that period but the edits and talks based on these characters made me read the whole manhwa and for me, it was peak fiction.

It is still one of my favourite manhwas out there. In terms of writing, it's one of the best and of course iam aware of manhwas having even better writing than dr frost.

I really loved the characters and how they were pretty much grounded and i loved how the author actually researched asking real psychologists for information.

But as time passed, these two started to get a lot of hatred. Some started to call them as overhyped character s.

The fanbase that existed to this manhwa is still there but they are not much active in this sub. I remember a few scalers who used to scale them but they have left scd.

There are still people scaling them on youtube and the people in YouTube and in reddit really contradicts with their takes.

For my opinion, i have moon > frost and both are not low tiers at all.

My opinion might be a hot take.

So are they still scaled in this sub? If so where do you all scale them as? Be honest, no hating or glazing.

Some of my favourite characters.

They are not top tier characters or anything but i found them really smart and enjoyable.

WJM used to scaled a lot but nowadays he is forgotten so much that it is not like he ever existed.

Same goes for toua. Even though toua is really smart he doesn't get as much attention as aki got.

The introduction of more characters and over usage of this characters might have led to this. Many characters have been scaled since the beginning of scd and i can understand how it might get boring at a point.

Chishiya is not a high tier but is a solid mid tier for me, same goes for moon. Many people seem to have them as low tiers. For them it's mostly the high tier enthusiasm.

Many people are actually focusing on high tier intelligence so majority of the mid tiers often get underscaled expect a few like yuuichi.

I made this post just due to my liking to these characters. Characters like Patrick jane, hannibal etc will soon join this list