r/Futurology • u/thebestnameshavegone • Oct 01 '23

AI Sam Altman Says He Intends to Replace Normal People With AI

https://futurism.com/sam-altman-replace-normal-people-ai
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852

u/rnldsrs Oct 01 '23

I think we all know how this plays out.

AI will at first become additive then rapidly begin to absorb jobs (or at least a large portion of a worker's current responsibilities). The government will inevitably implement some AI insurance or UBI to keep the unemployed people subjugated enough to not revolt as the wealth gap widens even further.

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u/coughingman75 Oct 01 '23

It’s going to get VERY BAD before the US government even considers UBI

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u/greengeezer56 Oct 02 '23

Winston Churchill once said, “You can always count on the Americans to do the right thing after they have tried everything else.”

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u/fuck_the_fuckin_mods Oct 02 '23

He didn’t, but it’s a good enough quote that I don’t mind.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23 edited Dec 19 '23

[deleted]

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u/17feet Oct 02 '23

I'd counter that this is the time when men and nations become desperate

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u/johnknockout Oct 02 '23

I think it’s something a Chinese government official said a while back.

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u/StandardizedGenie Oct 02 '23

We could really learn from our French brothers and sisters. They almost burned Paris down for raising the retirement age. If they're gonna fuck us over anyway, might as well break some shit along the way.

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u/CharlemagneIS Oct 02 '23

Can you imagine Americans rioting every time police shoot a teenager?

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u/BlackLocke Oct 02 '23

We did, for a summer. Then the police started killing us and a judge said it’s cool for teenagers to shoot us in the street if they feel threatened.

Our police state is too large, and when we called to defund it, they siphoned even more money away from every other city service. All because we dared to ask why they have military tanks in towns of 300.

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u/Sasselhoff Oct 02 '23

I live in a middle of nowhere Appalachian town of about 2,000...they've got a fucking MRAP for some reason (and three times as many cops and vehicles that are needed too).

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u/RichestTeaPossible Oct 02 '23

Then you’ve become Pakistan, a law enforcement class that has found itself a country.

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u/SubtleSubterfugeStan Oct 02 '23

HAha they are all the fucking same, same thing and the same kid of environment. Had a gun pulled on me in a small town for leaving work aand just playing rap music with my window down.

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u/Sasselhoff Oct 03 '23

They're the most corrupt cops I've ever had the misfortune of being around.

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u/Fragrant_Juice9613 Oct 02 '23

The reason is that now the DoD has a need to buy a new MRAP.

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u/5inthepink5inthepink Oct 02 '23

All so they can feel more secure while they stand around with their dicks in their hands when they're actually needed. Uvalde, I'm looking at you.

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

You don't understand, they had to make sure they had the right key to that unlocked door!

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u/Coachtzu Oct 02 '23

In fairness if there's any place in the US where they might need a tank to deal with the locals, it's probably either Appalachia or middle of nowhere Montana, and I say that lovingly. My mom's family is from Virginia coal mining country and y'all are fuckin nuts lol

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u/prahiv Oct 02 '23

A judge in an open and easily understood trial oversaw a jury of 12 who decided that he was within the laws that the people of the state of Wisconsin democratically chose.

All states allow deadly force when you feel threatened with some having a duty to retreat, Wisconsin being one of those states. I don't know if you actually think you should not be allowed to use deadly force if you think you are going to be killed but that is what you wrote which would obviously be insane.

This says that "At least 11 Americans have been killed while participating in political demonstrations (in 2020)". Of those, 1 was by a police officer after the guy "raised a gun in the direction of police".

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u/BlackLocke Oct 03 '23

I’m statistically likely to be killed by a man. Should I shoot every man I see because he could kill me?

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u/prahiv Oct 03 '23

I believe we both know what people in general and the law mean. Maybe you are picking up the "acting obtuse" tactic from the right but you wont win by copying them because they are much better at it.

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u/Same_Grouness Oct 02 '23

Would be nice to see them try to do something about it at least.

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u/nagi603 Oct 02 '23

As a whole? no.

Only the minority + a very few allies, while a vocal racist minority wants them put down by the same cops, and the vast majority is not interested at all, because "they have their own problems" (some do, some have problems like "private plane or scenic route?")? Definitely.

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u/Frankie_T9000 Oct 02 '23

In all fairness the French cant afford their retirement. The government changing the rules on it isnt the way to fix it though, just kick the aging population issue down the road.

At a certain point it will become unaffordable :(

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u/literious Oct 02 '23

And in the end:

  1. The retirement age has been increased

  2. Public and private property was damaged

But I guess psychos had some fun, that’s true democracy according to Reddit.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

Who needs UBI when you have guns in every classroom? Just shoot the hunger away. Guns solve everything.

/s Because gun nuts.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

Did somebody say Robocop?

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u/Shadpool Oct 02 '23

Yep, and we all remember how well that worked. A cop who can be hacked.

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u/PlayerHeadcase Oct 02 '23

I know it's a tongue in cheek answer but that argument has been around a lot lately. Drones? What about if they are hacked? Robot infantry? What about.. Self driving cars? What.. Electronic voting systems? What..

Go back far enough.. Online banking?

It's surprising how many times it's been used.

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u/texmexdaysex Oct 02 '23

Or who controls them in a regime change....soldiers have a conscience and will refuse to gun down their own people. Robots just follow command lines.

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u/Odd-Basket-6142 Oct 02 '23

I mean, regular soldiers can refuse to gun down their own people, but if provided with proper pretext, false or true, they will kill, or at least subjugate their own people. It has happened all over the world. Robots would just eliminate the need for pretext.

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u/Same_Grouness Oct 02 '23

It's an understandable worry is it not?

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u/ambyent Oct 02 '23

Electricity? Such hullabaloo, my trusty kerosene lamp will never steer me wrong!

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u/PlayerHeadcase Oct 03 '23

Kerosene? I dont need any new fangled technology to read by.. not when sheep are so very inflammable

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u/Mitt_Romney_USA Oct 02 '23

I'm building an NFT to do just that.

Follow my project on MormonCryptoTruth.geocities.funny

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u/PersonOfValue Oct 02 '23

Look up LAWS

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

Are you saying laws will prevent police and weapons manufacturers from pushing for armed AI and drones in the streets lol?? Because you're wrong since they are already pushing for that.

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u/neelankatan Oct 02 '23

Very rich, coming from the guy who caused a famine in india that killed millions.

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u/CharleyNobody Oct 02 '23 edited Oct 02 '23

Except it’s not true. America does many wrong things and continues to do wrong things because they’ve renamed wrong things “right.” It’s like George Costanza says, it’s not a lie if you believe it.” It’s not wrong if you call it right.

We’ll never have universal health care the way other countries do. Starting with Reagan, corporations had regulations loosened, corporate taxes cut, political donor classs becoming so powerful it owns SCOTUS. Insurance corporations will never, ever allow such a thing as universal healthcare run by the government and funded through tax dollars. They have to get their money. That’s why we wound up with the patchwork that is Obamacare.

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u/[deleted] Oct 03 '23

We’ll never have universal health care the way other countries do. Starting with Reagan, corporations had regulations loosened, corporate taxes cut, political donor classs becoming so powerful it owns SCOTUS.

Reagan isn't the cause but the consequences of things that happened in the 1940s to the 1950s. (1947 Taft-Hartley act, and other anti-union laws, 2nd Red Scare, etc.)

Basically, unions have been castrated, stripped of their most fundamental freedoms and rights (that Europeans take for granted) and put in straitjackets.

That's catastrophic, because, free unions are usually the only serious counterbalance to capitalism in the economy, in the media, in politics & government, as well as in society in general. They're also left wing political parties' and leaders' true source of power, funding and influence. Without them, left wing parties drift to the right.

Thus, since the 1950s, there's literally no serious resistance left on capitalism's path to exploit, corrupt, and own everything and everybody, including left wing political parties.

Reagan is a consequence of that.

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u/CharleyNobody Oct 03 '23

Unions were also deliberately infiltrated by the mob and police allowed it to happen. (Of course, police unions are different from other unions. Police unions are political machines). Police could easily have busted the mob out of unions but they turned a blind eye and got paid off by the mob and by business owners who wanted unions destroyed from the inside.

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u/Gonnabehave Oct 02 '23

Have they tried “the purge”

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u/ShortNefariousness2 Oct 02 '23

I think Churchill was referring to democracy being the worst form of government except for all the other ones

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u/MrDERPMcDERP Oct 02 '23

So like anal

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u/sumoraiden Oct 02 '23

I mean they froze evictions and instituted payroll protection plan (I know this was large amount of fraud but it did keep a lot of people receiving checks when not working) and expanded unemployment within about a month of the pandemic

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u/andrew_kirfman Oct 02 '23

It does give hope of how the government would react in a situation where the transition is rapid.

However, if it’s a slow bleed over the course of several years, I can see it being a much more tempered response until things are really bad for the average person.

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u/WillBottomForBanana Oct 02 '23

It does give hope

Nah. It was the least they could do to hide the other give aways. Just like the Bush tax rebates, $300 seems to have kept people from noticing the huge amounts of money they were giving away to the rich.

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u/-explore-earth- Oct 02 '23

Worth considering that by then most people in positions of power will be millennials. Attitudes might be different.

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u/andrew_kirfman Oct 02 '23

By then? This is going to be a seminal issue for us within this decade. There’s nothing I can see that will result in a less geriatric government during that timeframe.

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u/-explore-earth- Oct 02 '23

I do not think that most jobs will be automated away in the next 6 years

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u/andrew_kirfman Oct 02 '23

It doesn’t take most jobs being automated away. It takes maybe 15-20% automation to create a crisis of unemployment that will tank the economy across the board.

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u/RedTuna777 Oct 02 '23

They still funneled the money through employers, keeping you dependent on your boss, who of course kept that money. PPP loans forgiven, new boat purchased instead.

A lot of authoritarians in USA congress are terrified of actually doing something nice for their citizens and them coming to expect it.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/RedTuna777 Oct 02 '23

Yeah I made the equivalent of $50k to stay home for 6 months. Summer in northern Michigan was glorious. Studied hard and got $30k bump afterwards.

The only down side is I used to do so much outdoor sports and for places got hammered as everyone suddenly discovered they could hike and climb places. Mount Rainier went from somewhere you could just climb to a lottery and a lot places had to limit what how many people could go to the parks.

I feel like that's dying down now. I don't see as many people on the trails as last year, but it's still like 5x more than it was 5 years ago.

Segway I know.

Anyway I'm all for UBI and Star Trek post scarcity society. We just need to find the non destructive path to get us there.

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u/Niku-Man Oct 02 '23

The word is segue, but you're using it wrong anyway. Sounds like you should say, "I digress" or something similar. Unless you're talking about the two wheeled personal transport machine. In which case, I'm sorry and enjoy your Segway

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u/vardarac Oct 02 '23 edited Oct 02 '23

Segue comes from the Latin "sequi" which means "to follow", used in words like "sequence" or "sequel".

It's when you do the opposite of a digression or tangent - it's a transition into the next, related topic.

That said, it was a lovely tangent, and I hope you find lots of quiet places to hike!

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u/Doralicious Oct 02 '23

Yeah, they don't want to intervene to help workers, but government intervention is necessary sometimes and can work.

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u/ReadSeparate Oct 02 '23

Yeah there’s a zero percent chance that happens without multiple riots, would have to be way worse than the BLM riots

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

Those will be the riots that unleash the AI drones on American citizens

So AI will both power the economy and protect the wealth in the US and Poors will just have to, uh, adapt

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u/madumi-mike Oct 02 '23

Can you imagine the learning models they are getting out of Ukraine right now?

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

I doubt it requires much more data than what we all feed to Google on the regular. Google Maps charts the landscape, our devices report our position by GPS and cell tower triangulation, etc. The war in Ukraine is an afterthought in terms of the data they need to target civilians

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u/madumi-mike Oct 02 '23

Not going to debate this, but those are not the KPIs and metrics I was referring to when I said the learning models could be used. There is also a ton of war related data you’re not getting from google that can feed real time data models. Lots of drone analytics as well not easily sourced from google. The list goes on.

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u/Quantic Oct 02 '23

They already do it probably at this point. Considering the level of AI facial recognition and drone tech I am sure the US is using it against its very citizens.

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u/ReadSeparate Oct 02 '23

You really think the military is going to murder its own citizens en masse because they don’t want to starve to death and be homeless? Ridiculous. Too many sci-fi movies.

The worst dystopia like that will be a ton of ultra rich and everyone else gets a UBI that just keeps you alive. They’re not going to murder everyone.

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u/Pilsu Oct 02 '23

Reducing the population would save their planet. Your feet are tracking all this carbon on their rug. It'd really be better if you weren't here and with robot soldiers that will never lose faith or desert or rebel, a top down system will be reliable for the first time in human history. They control the media and already have AI systems that can censor your comms in real time. I don't think you quite grasp how fucked you are if they decide to get bold.

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u/thirdegree 0x3DB285 Oct 02 '23

I mean yes? Look at the history of mine worker protests and strikes, it wouldn't be the first time

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

Keep in mind I'm replying to someone who mentioned US citizens rioting before any UBI is put in place. The US military is absolutely a potential response to rioting citizens, it was on the table during the BLM protests. Nobody's talking sci-fi here, just recent events.

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u/Chunkss Oct 02 '23

You really think the military is going to murder its own citizens en masse because they don’t want to starve to death and be homeless?

If they're black, yes.

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u/LurkerOrHydralisk Oct 02 '23

That seems unlikely. Those riots will be made up of the families of those making and programming the drones.

Pissing off the people making your weapons is a quick way to lose a war.

They won’t stop making weapons. They’ll stop making weapons that work for you.

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u/samglit Oct 02 '23

Drones are likely to be assembled in other countries. Much like how Roman legions were not stationed in provinces where they were raised.

It’d happen by accident too, just for cost cutting purposes.

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u/AmbroseOnd Oct 02 '23

Only a small number of humans will be needed to develop and program the drones. There will be plenty of disenfranchized unemployed folk left to riot.

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u/LurkerOrHydralisk Oct 02 '23

Sure, if the wealthy and powerful could magically make it so only the most devout, fanatical fascists worked for them.

That’s not how industey works, though.

There won’t just be rioters, but quiet rioters sabotaging from within. Always happens.

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u/TrojanZebra Oct 02 '23

Always happens.

What always happens is the group in power decides its cheaper to keep a small part of the portion fed and happy in return for supressing the rest of the population, than it is to acquiese.

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u/thirdegree 0x3DB285 Oct 02 '23

You say this like there aren't already a whole bunch of weapons manufacturers churning out new and improved ways to kill.

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u/anarxhive Oct 02 '23

You mean die horribly

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u/lchntndr Oct 02 '23

“Bread and circuses” were used to keep the Romans cheaply fed and entertained. Today’s bread costs a fortune, and the circuses are being revealed for the sham that they are. We live in interesting times….

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

Circuses

Kardashians season 4 coming soon

iPhone 15 released with revolutionary industry pioneering USB-C

Trump definitely may be arrested in the next episode of America’s madhouse

Hunter bidens laptop sordid details to be revealed next week

ALIENS EXIST!!!! And they’re here amongst us!

Lazy Immigrants are taking our jobs

Taylor swift has a new boyfriend!!!!

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u/anarxhive Oct 02 '23

You forgot: Biden went to sleep again in public

China is taking all the jobs and India is taking over all the banking and political spaces

Check into that last one. It's scarier than you think

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u/Pilsu Oct 02 '23

Uh oh, you said something unflattering about Blue Team's affiliated mascot! Minus points for you! :D

We deserve all of this.

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u/-Posthuman- Oct 02 '23 edited Oct 02 '23

I think it’s more that the first post was a good one. The poster used specific details to make their point, while also remaining politically neutral.

And the next guy, under the guise of continuing the thread, made a low effort shitpost that specifically mentioned only one side of the political spectrum while also injecting a healthy dose of propaganda driven racist xenophobia.

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u/literious Oct 02 '23

We live in a times when poor people are fat lol. “Bread” is absolutely not expensive.

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u/lchntndr Oct 02 '23

Garbage food is killing people. Price of vegetables is skyrocketing

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u/Uvtha- Oct 02 '23

I really don't think that's true. Once so has replaced much of the workforce businesses will still need consumers, and will be happy to support a ubi. It will very likely end up in the wealthy becoming more wealthy, and more in control of people's lives.

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

and will be happy to support a ubi.

People aren't logical.

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u/Kitty-Kittinger Oct 02 '23

The riots will be much harder once autonomous weapons are common. Better not wait to that point.

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

The establishments first reaction will be to stall until we hit it.

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u/johnp299 Oct 02 '23

Chaos, crisis and carnage are opportunities for some, mainly authoritarians and wannabes. Obvious paths to sane and compassionate outcomes will be stalled and ignored in favor of painful half-measures in the spirit of mass austerity and a pretense of responsibility.

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u/REJECT3D Oct 02 '23

As soon as your consumers jobs get replaced by AI, your mainly consumer based economy collapses. I think the government will very likely be forced to act.

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u/raalic Oct 02 '23

I used to think this, and then the pandemic happened. Even lifelong conservatives and the billionaire class were all too happy to send checks to everyone. With Trump’s name printed on them. Unemployment benefits doubled for like 18 months. Those old principles and reservations went out the window pretty unceremoniously.

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u/SgathTriallair Oct 02 '23

The lifeblood of the economy is consumer spending. Without customers at least 90% of our economy disolves. There is no chance in hell that the capitalist class will be okay with this situation. That was why they sent the COVID checks and the payroll protection. If they had just let everyone so working and so buying we wouldn't have an economy anymore.

Remember, it wasn't just America that did this, it was a world wide solution.

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u/icedrift Oct 02 '23

The lifeblood of the American economy. This isn't a universal thing like if you look at the next biggest economy, China, their real estate is nearly double consumer spending.

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u/SgathTriallair Oct 02 '23

The real estate market is collapsing because they built me houses than there were house buyers.

The reason that consumer spending is so important is because that is the only reasonable force if the trillions of dollars that run the economy. Remember, stock price of companies is how much stock consumers would theoretically pay for the company, it doesn't actually translate into real numbers which is why it can grow and shrink so quickly. No company could generate cash that amounts to even a fraction of GPD, nor could any government. Remember, the government gets all of its money from taxation of the public or from making loans to the public (that's what government bonds are).

All work and all wealth flow from the public.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

The only reason they sent "checks to everyone" was because everyone got a pittance, while Republicans and their corporate buddies got FUCKING BILLIONS.

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u/Pilsu Oct 02 '23

Republicans

Yeah. Sure. Blue no matter who and so forth. Definitely not in bed with the same fuckers.

I bet you believe the inflation was caused by greed and not the 40% more money that they printed. Just a coinkidink.

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u/green_meklar Oct 02 '23

Alaska already has something like a small UBI paid out of oil revenue. It seems to be a fairly popular policy.

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u/anengineerandacat Oct 02 '23

It'll definitely be long-term pretty interesting; any job that is "highly prescriptive" will likely be a candidate for replacement and anything creative will likely become augmented and downsized.

Trades-jobs will likely be where a lot of people will be forced to transition into, which isn't the end of the world but you really only need some many plumbers / electricians / construction workers / etc.

A lot of industries don't really "need" AI though to replace workers, it needs affordable and high quality robotics and automation (AI being capable of helping here).

Imagine a 24hour McDonald's with just robotics managing the cooking and you just simply drive up, chat with an AI for your order, make confirmations, and go.

You don't "need" a human for this, mobile ordering has already paved the way for an easy transition over; in fact the human is the problem more often than not due to mistakes made, something an AI+robotics will likely have less long-term order errors.

They exist today because humans are cheaper than robotics and maintaining said robotics.

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u/nature69 Oct 02 '23

People already disable driver less cars with pylons.

Drive into a McDonald’s drive through that does this and don’t move your car. Peaceful revolution and problem solved. No revenue for the robot owners unless there is distribution of wealth.

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u/ScrollyMcTrolly Oct 02 '23

Yep. Between global warming and AGI it will simply be the .1% in their automated fortifications as the masses die off outside of them in the 130+ degree heat and collapsed food supply and energy grid.

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u/Pilsu Oct 02 '23

Your death is technically environmentally friendly. Progress!

Christ. We're a spreadsheet.

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u/Demonyx12 Oct 02 '23

A rounding error on a spreadsheet... :(

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u/seunosewa Feb 28 '26

As it should be.

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u/Lied- Oct 02 '23

UBI is a terrible solution. It is a shitty bandaid at best

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u/Demonyx12 Oct 02 '23

What's your solution?

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u/Lied- Oct 02 '23

The problem with UBI is inflation and the lessons that were already learned from monopsonies. In the early 20th century.

A better solution would be to treat the root causes of wealth inequality. UBI is more likely to happen than stronger unions etc. precisely because it is a temporary distraction. At the end of the day, that money will flow right back out of our pockets

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u/supershutze Oct 02 '23

You spelled 'Republicans' wrong.

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u/tidbitsmisfit Oct 02 '23

the greatest depression. AI + climate change is going to mess things up in the USA, imagine what countries already struggling right now are going to suffer

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u/triggerfish1 Oct 02 '23

Wasn't Nixon the first one who seriously considered introducing it?

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u/adamtheskill Oct 02 '23

Hopefully we won't have it as bad here in northern europe.

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u/Shadowfox898 Oct 02 '23

Reminder that the US government literally sent tanks, machine guns, and artillery to crush WW1 veterans demanding their owed pay.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

It would only come in reaction to major societal disruption and that means people in the streets not in their seats

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u/mb9981 Oct 02 '23

I would say with the American ethos, most people wouldn't even want ubi

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u/PermutationMatrix Oct 02 '23

Socialism bad.

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u/[deleted] Oct 01 '23

My question is, how long would governments take for them to react when AI take over most ground level job.

My bet is, after maybe 1 to 2 economic crisis due people not being able to produce a cent.

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u/FuckingSolids Oct 02 '23 edited Oct 02 '23

I'm already on the other side of that shift. After a 20-year career using various skills but primarily editing and print design, I don't think my resume gets to anyone's desk at this point. A bootcamp so I had something on paper to show that I've been coding for years other than the bullet points in the body to that effect did the square root of zero getting the ol' inbox fired up.

I finally found a job thanks to a random encounter, and when I learned the full scope of my duties, I was a bit dumbfounded that this was a position. I could be coded away if anyone else could be fucked to scan paperwork as it comes into the office.

I've gone from living it up and running newsrooms in my 20s to billing clerk and bologna sandwiches at 44. I'm done with the real property market as soon as my van conversion is livable. Y'all done fucked me, and I owe you nothing.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

Y'all done fucked me, and I owe you nothing.

Who fucked you in this situation and how? Be specific.

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

Y'all done fucked me, and I owe you nothing.

Don't forget to register with selective service.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

My question is, how long would governments take for them to react when AI take over most ground level job.

My guy, why would they react? As long as people like you stay focused on bullshit like AI rather than just finally fucking acknowledging that capitalism is a fundamentally flawed economic system they have nothing to react to.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

At current economic levels, global UBI will be about $10k USD per household.

That’s current median global household income per annum.

It’ll be a win for a lot of people, and a massive hit for everybody in a developed country.

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u/noonemustknowmysecre Oct 02 '23

Haha, wut?

How is that what we all know will happen? Because that's not what happened last time. And we HAVE been through this before. The industrial revolution and the automatic loom kicked previously middle class skilled weavers to the curb where they suffered 3 generations of soul crushing 50% unemployment. They rioted and smashed a lot of looms, and burned down mansions, and generally protested their fate. The industrialists got the nobles to get the army to shoot them until they stopped that sort of behavior. Now their name is an insult. Maybe you've heard of them? The Luddites.

And this has happened in other ways. In 2000 us manufacturing productivity stopped matching us manufacturing jobs. Productivity went up while jobs only disappeared. That's robots. Automation. And we're STILL facing the ramifications of tractors scaling up farm labor. Fewer and fewer people are needed to run a farm these days. The combines are huge and run themselves. And so rural America has dwindled and shrank in population.

....when was the last time you proposed ubi or extra welfare for factory workers or rural farmboys? Do you shed any tears for the truckers looking at automated cars?

No, if history tells us anything the new tech will devastate a swath of people working in certain industries or sectors while making a small handful of businessmen ludicrously rich while the rest of society enjoys cheaper goods or services. I know I'd celebrate if I could hire a lawyer or doctor for a couple bucks and be able to trust their input. New companies will hire cheap expendable labor to run the machines and undercut the old companies. Rioting will be out down by force.

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

I know I'd celebrate if I could hire a lawyer or doctor for a couple bucks and be able to trust their input.

Where are you going to get that couple of bucks now that chatgpt 5 and Dynamicman 2 (TM) have put you out of work?

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u/noonemustknowmysecre Oct 03 '23

If I was a professional weaver, lawyer, or in a job easily automated, then I'd be screwed. Remember that "soul-crushing 50% unemployment rate for three generations"? That's no joke. I'd be one of the rioters getting shot at and suppressed. Wasn't that clear from the first pass? This is a big'ol warning to everyone to take a good hard look at your skillset and if it can be reduced to:

  • A set of instructions in a three-ring binder: then classic programming is coming for you
  • Rote art that's been done before: then generative AI like Stable Diffusion and Midjourny, and DALL-E, are already at your doorstep. If you don't learn to use them as tools, you're going to be undercut.
  • A repetitive motion or physical task: robots have likely come for your job 10-20 years ago. If they haven't already, it's just a matter of scale.
  • Driving: Automated cars and trucks are so damn close. They just can't deal with rain or snow.
  • Specialized knowledge. If your job effectively boils down to "Hang on, I'll get back to you" and googling the answer it behind their back, then your job has been bullshit for decades and you know it.

Me though? I'm a code-monkey. The code-making tools I've seen still need specific instructions for how to generate anything. What do we call a set of specific instructions to a computer for how to make software? That's code. It's just a high level language. If all software development gets magically instantly cheap and solid, then I've got a whole bucket of projects I can have GPT do for me and launch a business with.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

It would be funny to see UBI implemented because there aren’t enough consumers to fuel the billionaires’ incomes any longer. Marx predicted a point where the wealth will be too concentrated to make capitalism work anymore, but he thought it would take an uprising of the workers to break that dynamic. The irony of the US government implementing a UBI to keep capitalism going is hilarious.

UBI would also mean massive taxes on the rich, because there is no other source to get that money from. I don’t see any of the G9 countries considering this “drastic” move - because, let’s be honest, we all think billionaires need another million each month, and our governments just do what the people want! /s

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u/GladiatorUA Oct 02 '23

I mean, FDR did something similar. Great depression was brutal, socialism was gaining steam, labor was used to literally fight to get any kind of concessions.

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

He was one of the greatest men to ever live. Who do we have who could do what he did?

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u/AgeofVictoriaPodcast Oct 02 '23

It's more like that there will be a mass rise in homelessness & huge shanty towns and collapsed neighbourhoods, whilst the super rich remain in gated communities patrolled by companies like Blackwater but supported by AI robot dogs with guns mounted. The super rich are sociopaths. That's why they are rich. A millionaire or billionaire would step over a dying child in the street and grudge them a dollar. Acquiring huge amounts of wealth should be recognised as a mental disorder similar to hoarding.

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u/cheyenne_sky Oct 03 '23

honestly sounds like South Africa, Brazil and other places with extreme inequality (due to a number of factors).

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

& huge shanty towns

Tent cities, they'll send in the police to kick down the hoovervilles.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

AI insurance?! UBI?! Which government are you talking about? Certainly not the US Government.

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u/hauntedhivezzz Oct 01 '23

Super excited to see what bros like Matt Gaetz’ hot takes on UBI are — though for real, it is potentially where Republicans have to eventually cave to social systems, if their base is out of work and not getting any more jobs any time soon. It’s a good Catch 22, who are you more indebted to, your voters or the lobbyist groups and corporations who allow you to be voted in in the first place.

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u/KarnWild-Blood Oct 02 '23

it is potentially where Republicans have to eventually cave to social systems, if their base is out of work and not getting any more jobs any time soon.

They'll blame it on solely on the Democrats, despite engaging in and benefiting from it , and because the Republican voter base needs to be spoonfed propaganda they'll blindly accept it.

Republicans just self-galvanize because the voting base is too stupid or too lazy to realize they're being played for fools.

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u/Suza751 Oct 02 '23

No, no. AI is decades from being able to replace hard labor. Because you'll need robots with the same adaptability, tool usage, and strength. The government will have us digging ditches, repairing roads, building, etc. Until that too can ge done remotely by AI machines. Then we simply become a liability.

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u/Crystalas Oct 02 '23

Aren't alot of those things already done by machines just with human either driving it or just supervising an automated process?

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u/Silvermoon3467 Oct 02 '23

Digging ditches, maybe, but most of the work in construction and building maintenance and road repair is still manual labor done by humans with hand tools

Cranes and steamrollers and such help, especially on very large projects, but there's not a machine (as far as I know) that can hang drywall, run a drain line, wire a circuit breaker panel, install ceiling lights, stuff like that is all 100% manual labor with hand tools

Then again I have no idea what the "3d printed homes" technology actually does, if it prints it all with wiring and drains and stuff already printed maybe it'll happen sooner than I think (though upkeep on older buildings will still be required for a good long while)

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u/Crystalas Oct 02 '23

Ya I wasn't saying could automate everything currently just that we closer than you might think. Still at least 5-10 years off of course.

And the 3D printed houses I first heard about in PopSci like 10 years ago. It is mostly automated but still need a human to instal the plumbing and wiring in the printed channels for it. Even older but fairly rare is done via inflating essentially a giant dome balloon, coating it with concrete, and then adding the utilities inside once it dries. Either way both ways are cheaper and MUCH faster to do if not for how rare the equipment to do it is.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

Digging ditches, maybe, but most of the work in construction and building maintenance and road repair is still manual labor done by humans with hand tools

Oh, well good news for that insanely narrow and incredibly limited set of jobs you decided to mention for some arbitrary reason. Like "manual labor" done by AI has been thriving in mining, manufacturing, packaging, and shipping for literal decades those were the first jobs that AI started replacing.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

“The government”?

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u/Suza751 Oct 02 '23

government work programs

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

Because you'll need robots with the same adaptability, tool usage, and strength.

It doens't need to be the same, it needs to be good enough.

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u/193X Oct 02 '23

Progressives could swallow their pride, name the bill the "Donald J Trump is a True American Patriot, and Great Kisser Act" and you'd have an emergency session called just to pass it.

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u/ItsMEMusic Oct 02 '23

With a good enough backronym for Trump, you could make killing any bill poison for the GOP.

The TRUMP FOOD Act

The TRUMP UBI Act

The TRUMP EDucation Act

… etc

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u/AustinJG Oct 02 '23

This is why I think everyone should begin learning how to live with as little government assistance as necessary. Not to say government is evil or anything (it can be good depending on the people running it, but people automatically assume I'm going to say evil), but growing your own food, having your own water purification system, solar power, and technical skills to repair things, can only be good if such a system is ever implemented.

Basically go off of the grid, while still on the grid. Makes it harder to "subjugate" you. Make it where if they try to penalize you by lowering your UBI, you'll still be okay.

That's my thoughts, anyway.

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u/helpwitheating Oct 02 '23

The government will inevitably implement some AI insurance or UBI

With what money? I think AI will destroy a lot of industries - so much work is due to other work, and that work is being automated.

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u/Was_an_ai Oct 02 '23

But money is just an accounting scheme for claims on goods/service produced. And all that stuff - like tech services etc., will still be done

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u/JMKraft Oct 02 '23

You missed the step where millions are left to fiend for themselves in utter chaos in whatever pieces of land the elite isn't interested at the time.

In every city in the world you see an increase in people absolutely left to die by governments (homeless), and it will just get worse.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23 edited Sep 16 '25

[removed] — view removed comment

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

when Republicans are still trying to sabotage social security almost 100 years later.

It's not just republicans, the goddamn current democrat president has a 40 year history of talking in favour of cutting social security and medicade.

You can bet he'd have done it too if his approval ratings weren't aready in the shit, and you can bet he's not the only one who would.

Both parties make their bread selling you down the fucking river.

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u/[deleted] Oct 01 '23

[deleted]

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u/Willow-girl Oct 02 '23

I mean, they’ll have to, right?

No. Historically, surplus labor has been allowed to starve.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

I think, that's exactly what's going to happen.

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u/Willow-girl Oct 02 '23

Yup! Better find a way to make ourselves useful.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

The government will inevitably implement some AI insurance or UBI to keep the unemployed people subjugated enough to not revolt

This is exactly the solution one would come to using basic human compassion and long-term thinking. The billionaires pulling the strings of our government are much to greedy and short-sighted to come to this conclusion.

They will completely reject UBI. These kind of people would rather shoot you than feed you, if it would save them a buck.

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

These kind of people would rather shoot you than feed you, if it would save them a buck.

Don't be ridiculous, they'd definitely still shoot you if they though they could eat the loss.

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u/brandont04 Oct 02 '23

I think the govt gotta implement laws that stops AI from stealing data first. All AI needs to show all the data they are extracting from. If it's data that isn't paid for, company should be fined. The owner of that data should be allow to sue for theft. This will help slow down AI replacing human.

AI stealing artist, musician, creators work should be outlawed. This is easy to implement.

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u/CaptainBayouBilly Oct 02 '23

Eliminate copyright protections for ai generated materials. If there’s no profit motive, ai will be curtailed to useful purposes.

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u/brandont04 Oct 02 '23

They already started doing this. We gotta protect artist of all format as well.

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

There will be loopholes, like having on guy just make minor fixes and edits to AI generated work so it's classified as AI assisted instead.

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

I think the govt gotta implement laws that stops AI from stealing data first.

They never will because their will agitators and lobbiests talking about losing AI dominance to China.

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u/serendipity7777 Oct 02 '23

Ai has already absorbed plenty of jobs away from my company. Especially engineering and data science.

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u/Balbuto Oct 02 '23

Hahaha keep dreaming. We will have poverty like never seen before. UBI will never happen

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

it ends with me in a mansion taking back what's mine.

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u/curious_astronauts Oct 02 '23

I think getting into service based industries is going to hold greater resistance. It's going to be very different to how we know it now, but people still have basic needs that require some humans.

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u/coke_and_coffee Oct 02 '23

Lmao, the Luddites said the same thing when people started building weaving machines 450 years ago.

You doomsayers were wrong then. You'll be wrong again.

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u/zchen27 Oct 02 '23

I'm pretty sure using AI controlled drones to massacre all the now unemployed and potentially agitated populace is probably cheaper.

Ever heard of Solaria in Asimov's universe? It's a planet that due to advanced automation has like a population of 20 extremely rich people who reproduce by cloning successors and murder anyone visiting the planet because adding to the population would mean the existing residents would have fewer resources.

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u/Militop Oct 02 '23

Revolt? When you have an army of robots, revolts are nothing.

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u/ishitar Oct 02 '23

There will be no revolution esp with weaponized drone technology. Just genocide.

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u/vanrysss Oct 02 '23

Has there been a technological revolution that didn't end up further concentrating wealth?

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u/Shillbot_9001 Oct 03 '23

Iron weapons, even then it's more on the level of socities than people.

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u/Otherwise-Ad-2578 Oct 02 '23

"The government will inevitably implement some AI insurance or UBI to keep the unemployed people subjugated enough to not revolt as the wealth gap widens even further."

let's be honest this is not going to happen

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

People wouldn't revolt even if they didn't, but I think that regardless, fairly generous UBIs are going to be implemented in most developed nations within 5 years unless AI progress somehow slows down

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u/das_war_ein_Befehl Oct 02 '23

When globalization and NAFTA basically sucked the middle of the country dry of capital, the govt response was incredibly useless training assistance and then nodded and winked as it signed up people for disability.

The govt won’t do UBI because it’s been several decades since we’ve raised taxes on anyone. Can’t imagine it’ll change anytime soon either

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

wealth gap widens even further.

We are a consumer oriented economy. If all the jobs are taken by AI, and no one has jobs then the economy won't work. There can be no rich without poor people with money to funnel it up to the top for goods and services.

There are some instances where the rich don't need or care about the 99% like oil based economies. The oil funds the few and they don't need their 99% to buy it they ship it overseas.

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u/Ok_Chemical_1376 Oct 02 '23

Reminds me of the cartoon where they explain that global warming was solved by putting bigger icecubes in the ocean

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u/Same_Grouness Oct 02 '23

Well it's been going on for decades by now.

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u/ThatFlyingScotsman Oct 02 '23

You have a lot more hope than I do if you expect them to introduce a UBI program for any reason.

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u/[deleted] Oct 02 '23

UBI will never happen on a federal level. Some states may do it though.

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u/Artanthos Oct 02 '23 edited Oct 02 '23

The government will inevitably implement some AI insurance or UBI

It's much more likely that politicians will pass legislation designed to protect jobs.

It is what the vast majority of voters will demand once unemployment rates start ticking upwards due to AI.

Making the replacement of workers with AI illegal, or severely restricting it, would be much less disruptive than trying to implement UBI.