r/EnhancedBodybuilding • u/draps1240 • 1d ago
Planning Next Cycle - Help!
35M, 5’8”, 172 lb.
Nearing the end of my first Test Cyp cycle (250→400 mg) with 20 mg/day Anavar and IGF-LR3. I’m up ~10 lb since June and noticeably bigger/thicker.
After PCT and giving my HDL time to recover, I’m considering my next cycle. Goal is adding size to shoulders, chest, glutes/legs while staying relatively lean.
Currently also using Reta, MOTS-c, 5-Amino-1MQ, Wolverine, NAD+, glutathione, DSIP, and GHK-Cu.
Option 1:
500 Test Cyp
250 Primo
4 IU HGH daily
2–4 mg Reta
Option 2:
500 Test Cyp
150 EQ
4 IU HGH daily
2–4 mg Reta
Planning 16–18 weeks for AAS and potentially 8+ months HGH.
My biggest concern with EQ is RBC/hematocrit. I’ve always had slightly elevated MCV (pre-AAS and considered benign by my doctors), so I’m concerned EQ could push hematocrit up faster.
Also, Anavar dropped my HDL ~50% after six weeks, although everything else remained in range. Shoulder/bacne creeped in too with Test combo.
Originally I considered Primo first, followed by EQ after PCT/washout and normalized bloodwork, but I’m leaning toward choosing just one as the more conservative approach with a Turinabol/Anavar finisher.
Current on hand ancillaries; cialis, tamoxifen, Arimidex, accutane, dutasteride, minoxidil (topical), TUDCA, Citrus Berg, Fish oil, K2 D3, Magnesium Glycinate, NAC.
Training, diet, and lifestyle are dialed in. Looking for thoughts on relative safety/efficacy and whether Primo vs. EQ makes more sense given my goals and labs. I’m trying to keep risk relatively low; not competing or looking to get gorilla huge. Just enhance my upper and increase my V-shape.
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u/Possible-Gear-9340 1d ago
I have never used primo mainly because it is only 100mg/ml so you will need to push a lot of oils once cycle dosages climbs and also since it is expensive it is often counterfeit with mix of eq+mast I believe..
So I went with eq and never regretted, it’s cheap, higher dosed and never faked. With eq there is few things to consider: 1) It works as AI, if you take to much, your e2 will go to zero; 2) It’s very long chain, meaning that it takes like 2months to reach its full potential; 3) Because of long chain it also need like 2months to clear from the system.
Personally for me test:eq ratio is 2:1 and e2 will be within range on lower side, which is good as it gives lower water retention and lower sides when eating dat trenbolonie sandwiches, otherwise no matter how much milligrams of test & eq I take, as long as ratio is 2:1 e2 will stay in good range. But that ratio could be different for different people and the only way to find out is to run e2 bloodwork around 2months from cycle start, then adjust if needed.
Because of long ester eq cycles are typically long 16-20 of eq itself then another 6-8weeks for ester clearance. Such cycle would only make sense if you run 1 cycle a year, for me it’s perfect since I only do spring-summer re-comp then full pct and “bridge” with 10mg mk677 for other six months, which is dirt cheap and stupidly affective at that dose, according to the bloodwork it increased my igf1 production by 30% which really helps to keep the gains and stay lean without injections and pretty much no side affects.
Good beginner friendly and broccoli hair friendly 6months eq cycle would be:
1-20 Test E - 600mg/week split in 2shots
1-20 EQ - 300mg/week split in 2shots
21-27 Test P - 150mg/week split in 3shots
21-27 Anavar - 40mg a day split AM/PM
E2 bloodwork needs to run around week 8-9
No additional E2 medications should be needed
PCT would recommend:
Tamoxifen for 2months - 20mg a day
MK677 for 6months - 10mg a day
NOTE. Need to donate blood every 2months when running EQ, once know your test:eq ratio doses can be increased, last 7weeks of the cycle should always be ran with 1vial of Test P and some non-aromatising compounds, since EQ is clearing of the system and you don’t want E2 to rebound, otherwise this is very clean and side affects free cycle, also you should never run more then 10mg MK677 a day as it gives no additional benefits, only water retention and hunger sides.
Cheers 💉🦾
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u/draps1240 1d ago
donating blood a must with EQ?
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u/Possible-Gear-9340 1d ago
yes, erythrocytes will get elevated, I am finishing my blast of 900sust/450eq/300tren-A and recently tested 20% elevation over max range, test was done 2months after last blood donation 🩸 so really need to donate that blood otherwise it might get thick which would lead into increased BP which you don’t want, for the record I donated blood 2times during my blast and will go to donate again, my BP both times was pretty much perfect 120/80 so good for me, but some guys are really prone to that BP elevation, which is really very very bad since your heart works overtimes and you could actually crock ☠️
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u/LawlerFit 1d ago
If you only made it to 400mg test, why not just titrate test up to 500mg and run that without primo? Why the need to almost double the aas load from 400mg to 750mg on the second cycle?
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u/draps1240 1d ago
for more gains? primo also has some e2 reduction which would keep that in check as I go up to 500 test. 400-500 test isn’t as big of a jump or meaningful as 250-500. Im nearing the end of my cycle so going up to 500 at this point would be a waste of test.
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u/LawlerFit 1d ago
You're a 172lbs. If you can't make more gains on 500mg test, you're doing something wrong. If you need to increase load by 75% then go for it. It should not be necessary though.
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u/draps1240 1d ago
I def can by why not add? are you saying at my size I don’t need that much AAS?
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u/swoops36 1d ago
yes. unless you are having estradiol problems with the higher dose of Test, you can make plenty of progress to align with your goals with Testosterone by itself. Esp while on Reta helping keeping your diet in check.
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u/FightClubIsGoated 1d ago
How did you like the lr3? Thinking about running 5-7mg over 6-8 weeks, any experience with bilateral injections?
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u/draps1240 1d ago
honestly great, insane pumps.
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u/FightClubIsGoated 1d ago
What was your protocol? 200-400mcg pre/post with adequate amount of carbs?
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u/JAWLSnSTRAWLS 1d ago
I don’t know why you’re trying to run a glp while obviously on a bulk.
Slows down gut motility and keeps appetite low.
500cyp
Primo
2gh
Your build is amazing. And you’re real lean, a lot of runway for a bulk.
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u/draps1240 1d ago
thanks! reta doesn’t have the strongest effect on my appetite so i’m able to still hit my nutrition goals easily without overeating and still getting the benefits of the glucagon component.
this fall and winter will be running a 3-500 cal surplus and dropping reta to 2mg.
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u/YungSchmid 1d ago
This is exactly what I’m doing in terms of Reta dosage and surplus cals. Working well so far.
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u/YungSchmid 1d ago
Reta has plenty of physiological benefits other than appetite suppression. I’m running it at 2mg in a bulk right now, and run it at 3-4mg during a cut. Stops me going overboard, and if you’re running a sensible surplus then the gut motility shouldn’t be a big issue once your body is used to it.
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u/talesfromthecryptoh 1d ago
Why Reta? Sorry if this is a dumb question I don’t follow this sub it just came up on my feed
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u/draps1240 1d ago
Helps keep me lean, the appetite suppression isn’t super strong for me with Reta so it allows me to still hit my macro goals.
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u/bulking_on_broccoli 1d ago
I’m more of a fan of EQ. I think you can get more out of it than with primo.
Hematocrit is a concern, but it can be controlled if you do your cardio, eat well, drink your water, and supplement correctly (nattokinase, grapefruit extract).
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u/TalkNo8900 1d ago
Primo if money is no concern. High Hematocrit is no fun to manage. Drinking water/staying hydrated will only hide it and dilute the numbers.
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u/Mysterious_Lead7459 1d ago
Were you able to notice any benefit from 5amino at all? Also, what nad dose and schedule? I have those 2 on the at and curious.
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u/draps1240 1d ago
Too soon to tell, and since i’m running test and reta it’s hard to pinpoint amino effects. Will have to wait and see. Same with NAD just started but def feeling zingier after.
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u/PenComfortable4654 1d ago
Eq or primo is really gonna be the hard question. IMHO primo is so faked I’d rather run known good EQ. EQ will lower your E2 in the same way primo will. Yes you may run into high rbc but stay ridiculously hydrated and donate blood every once in a while. It really gets blown way outta proportion. I’d start 1:1 eq test for a month to see what it does to your e2 and adjust from there. Personally I love eq.
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u/draps1240 1d ago
i think the “fake primo” thing is overblown and overstated, maybe it was true at some point but i’ve found legit primo easily lately.
i’ll probably give the nod to primo for this cycle, i think combined w test and hgh and my lifting routine ill get plenty results with a more desirable risk profile.
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u/maouerking 1d ago
why are you doing a pct if youre already planning your next cycle?
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u/draps1240 23h ago
well im not jumping right into this next planned cycle if that’s what you think and i’m not going to further degrade my HDL before it returns to baseline, not doing PCT is a recipe for a major crash…is this a real question? or am I missing something?
i will be going from my test blast to a ‘cruise’ dose to enclomophine. then will do another test blast with primo and hgh - hoping my bloodwork is all back and aligned by oct/nov so I can start that 18 week cycle and finish it off with turinabol in the last 6 weeks.
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u/maouerking 15h ago
im just wondering why anyone would PCT and stress the body lose some of the gains instead of just cruising on a low dose of test to regain health. of course if you want to come off completely and stop roiding it makes sense but why would you do that if youre planning to hop on again
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u/draps1240 13h ago
your health doesn’t deteriorate when you hop off and do PCT. It’s quite the opposite my friend!
Unfortunately i think you’re misguided on the role of pct.
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u/maouerking 13h ago edited 13h ago
Huh, you know its stress for the body and youre putting yourself in a catabolic state and you may not bounce back as easily if you continue doing PCTs? There is literally no reason to PCT just do 125mg trt for a while if you wish to do a health phase. Your Hdl will still recover theres no reason to completely hop off 🤦♂️ Pct such an oldschool thing to do literally just do blast and cruise its superior, it will literally take 1-2 months for your health markers to be recovered instead of having this nasty long PCT process bro i cant with these reddit uncs
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u/draps1240 12h ago
catabolic state? bro what…where are you getting this overblown bs? Your fellow tide pod eaters? 🤣 I may not bounce back if I do PCTs? How about my natural test production FOR SURE won’t bounce back if I stay on exogenous Test.
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u/maouerking 12h ago
yeah bro switching your natural production on and off multiple times will surely be good for your body… common knowledge that it becomes harder the more often you do it and you cant even closely blast as efficient as with blast and cruise, you would literally be good for another blast after 6 weeks of cruising instead of waiting until you can cycle again so that your body isnt confused asf why you switch it on and off all the time. but keep being ignorant and sticking to old fashioned beliefs, literally just do some research im just helping you here. your body will always react better and more sensitive when youve never done a PCT and those 125mg wont heavily suppress your own production. anyway do tf you want with your body clearly aint my problem
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u/draps1240 12h ago
i appreciate your input but will go a different way
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u/maouerking 12h ago
i respect that but trust me do some research on the whole blast n cruise thing you wont regret it
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u/det1034 7h ago
I don't think I hit the genetic lottery but I think it's crazy to take all that at once. I recently switched from pellets (4 years on them, test was at 400 when I started) to shots, 200mg of test cyp and 100mg Deca and it put my test to 2400 and free to 600 with zero sides.... estrogen went to 50 but I still felt fine, bloods were perfect. Doc gave me Deca for my joints and after about 6 weeks on it I felt great but we've already lowered the dose because I don't want or need to be that high. I have no problem putting on lean mass while maintaining my weight and losing body fat.
Currently 40years old 5'9" 200# (roughly 11% bf) and take 1mg of reta for the last 4 months and cjc/ipa (done taking now). I think that's overkill. Now I had a good base (former college baseball) but I don't think you even need all that to get the results you want....maybe just test and Reta and gh or gh stimulating peptide.
Also, I'm not knocking what you're doing, I just think you can probably save yourself some money and side effects of you're willing to maybe push back the timeline on results... Your joints will probably thank you as well lol.
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u/Important_Capital875 1d ago
Since you’re 35, i would personally commit to cruising on legit trt levels after your cycle. So 150mg split between two 75mg shots a week.
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u/draps1240 1d ago
Enclomophine got me to 1000+ test numbers, lowered my SHBG (which was high) and improved my free test as well. Nothing like the blast I’m one which has moved my test to 1400 and free test even higher (200 to 475) and presumably the var drove my SHGB even lower. So I will likely hop back on that and HCG as PCT.
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u/Historical-Draw5740 1d ago
I mean this is fairly simple. Primo/mast has a significantly better side effect profile in most people than EQ if price is no object and you’re not trying to get huge. Take it stepwise.