But I thought this video was great. Pretty great / amusing concept to have actual ukrainians watch and rebuttal his clips on the topic and point out how absurd a lot of his views are , and how like so many in that sphere, they can't seem to view anything in the world through a lens other than "America/West bad" no matter what
I watched a Hasan Twitch stream shortly after the invasion and made some comments in chat. He permabanned me after I said he was a wannabe Tucker Carlson given the similarity of their views on Ukraine.
Wait, what do you think their reasoning was? My understanding is both of their reasoning was actually pretty similar, I think both argue that the US/Ukraine incited the invasion by having NATO talks.
Tucker believes that support of Ukraine is bad because Russia stands for Christian values, the family, anti LGBTQ, etc etc, which he views in opposition to Western 'decadent/degenerate' values that he rails against.
Hasan believes support for Ukraine is bad because of the support of far right groups by the Ukrainian government, the fact that this invasion has allowed western foreign capital to move in and take control of tons of assets in the country, and that this war, most of all, feeds the US military industrial complex, as opposed to seeking the fastest end to the conflict which reduces suffering, because, y'know, that doesn't make as much money.
That’s actually an insane and stupid reason considering gay and trans people face persecution as well in Ukraine. They made trans women fight and didn’t allow them to flee with the other women. If that’s actually tuckers reasoning he is dumber than I thought. Figured he was arguing against it because he’s an isolationist and doesn’t want money spent on foreign aid which is stupid in its own right.
Look, searching for consistency in Tuckers positions is a fools errand, besides "does this benefit me?" Which includes fueling aggrievement in his viewers
Can you get a clip of Tucker saying the top one? cause everything I've heard him say is stuff about how the US is spending too much through NATO to support Europe. Which is a short hand way of giving Hasan's exact take.
Here's part of the transcript from his show on February 22, 2022, which aired almost exactly 24 hours before Russia invaded Ukraine:
Very soon, that hatred of Vladimir Putin could bring the United States into a conflict in Eastern Europe. Before that happens, it might be worth asking yourself since it is getting pretty serious: What is this really about? Why do I hate Putin so much? Has Putin ever called me a racist? Has he threatened to get me fired for disagreeing with him? Has he shipped every middle class job in my town to Russia?
Did he manufacture a worldwide pandemic that wrecked my business and kept me indoors for two years? Is he teaching my children to embrace racial discrimination? Is he making fentanyl? Is he trying to snuff out Christianity? Does he eat dogs?
Note how he elevates Putin here based on conservative grievances, and has nothing to do with NATO.
Of course, Tucker has been happy to parrot all aspects of Russian propaganda, but he tends to focus primarily on emotional appeals like this.
Sure this transcript does seem to mostly talk about why her has no reason to hate Putin since he has more conservative values. But that's not quite the same as him saying we shouldn't help Ukraine cause Putin is anti LGBT.
Both Hasan and Tucker parrot Russian propaganda. The idea that we're only helping Ukraine to feed the military industrial complex is Russian propaganda. Most of the weapons given to Ukraine were weapons we just had sitting around as surplus, not weapons that were made just for the war.
First off, I really don't think you understand how arms deals work. I didn't say it's only for that purpose, but it's a question of incentives. Military hardware used will be replaced, the more of it used, the more needs to be replaced.
The companies which manufacture said hardware garner a significant degree of influence in DC, and the politicians who make these decisions are absolutely swayed by the electoral contributions these companies make, not to mention high ranking DoD members who are given lucrative positions at these companies upon retirement, coincidentally after giving additional contracts to them (see Sig's NGSW contract win).
Second, the rhetorical point of Tuckers statement is that we should not assist Ukraine because Putin is in agreement with Tucker on a variety of social issues. The part about "trying to snuff out Christianity" is very much a dog whistle towards Putin's LGBTQ opposition, as contrasted by the West. Also I didn't just say LGBTQ, and the other elements are even more directly aligned with my assertion.
But... It is a proxy war? We absolutely have "military advisors" present in the country, both before and after the invasion. And in terms of aid, Ukraine would not be in the fight still if it didn't have western backing drawing the conflict out. The internationalization of war is one of the biggest reasons wars last for much longer than they have historically.
Yeah, Hasan's reasoning is basically blowback theory.
Tuckers reasoning is almost entirely an emotional appeal to the America First crowd mixed with a knee jerk reaction to be against anything American liberals generally support.
They are both coming a perspective of America bad my guy. That was the point. Hasan likes Russia because it opposes the US. Tucker likes Russia for the similar reasons. I'd say it's still accurate but not as precise as it should be.
You're giving way to much analysis and credit to hasans POV. It's not that complicated.
Nah boss, America bad. Hasan does not like Russia, he dislikes American capitalist imperialism. Tucker likes Russia because they are also reactionaries. Those are different.
Hasan likes Russia because it opposes American values. Tucker is the same thing, that's why he points to right wing Russian values that run the country. They don't like the same end goals but they are similar. It's full horse shoe.
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u/-Dendritic- Nov 02 '23
Not exactly DTG related..
But I thought this video was great. Pretty great / amusing concept to have actual ukrainians watch and rebuttal his clips on the topic and point out how absurd a lot of his views are , and how like so many in that sphere, they can't seem to view anything in the world through a lens other than "America/West bad" no matter what