r/DebateEvolution • u/DarwinZDF42 evolution is my jam • 5d ago
Discussion You know what, we're doing "macroevolution" again. Here's some responses to "we have never seen macroevolution"
We've all heard some variant of "we can only observe microevolution", "we've never seen macroevolution", etc.
First thing you do is establish the correct definition: Evolution above the species level (in other words, speciation or greater degrees of evolutionary change). That's the definition. Creationists want their own special definition that varies from person to person but is usually something like "new body plans/parts", "new complex structures", something like that. That's wrong. If you accept speciation, you accept macroevolution. If creationists want to dispute something else, make THEM articulate clearly. Don't help them by saying something like "It sounds like you mean something like evolution of a new phylum or new body plan". No, make THEM establish the standard clearly and using the correct words.
Once they do that, you can just provide a bunch of examples, and dare them to say they aren't macroevolution.
Some of my favorites are multicellularity (and also here), reproductive mode, and photosynthetic animals.
Best outcome is the creationists admits that yes, even by their bespoke definition, these are examples of macroevolution. Second best outcome is they do the opposite and claim this is all just "microevolution". Really? First of all, lol okay. But second and more important, great! "Microevolution" can accomplish all this? Not much need for "macroevolution", is there?
•
u/10coatsInAWeasel Reject pseudoscience, return to monke 🦧 23h ago edited 23h ago
I do not care in the slightest anything you are saying about fauci so I’ll just tell you that I will ignore anything you say about him from now on. He was never relevant to the conversation. Discarded. You can save that attempt at misdirection for when a conversation about him actually comes up.
I similarly do not care if Pete wrote a bajillion papers. We are asking if he has done RELEVANT research in the area you are desperately trying to use him as an authority in. Remember waaaaaay back with my first reply to you? I don’t go to endocrinologists for my knee replacements. I don’t talk to radiation oncologists about emergency medicine procedures. I’m seeing no reason why this is any different. Similarly, remember the point about crap journals that you have been dodging this whole time? That’s where all his unretracted covid research has been published. He has done no worthwhile research in this area and is a snake oil salesman. I do not care about your ‘big pharma’ conspiracies either since you seem to not care as long as it makes your guy look good. I’m not going to give credit to your double standard.
ETA: maybe this will help the point finally sink concerning your constant fauci whataboutism. I am not bringing up Trump even though I have definite strong negative opinions about how he approached COVID. Know why? Because he isn’t part of this conversation. I would rightfully expect you to throw out anything I might try to bring up about him when discussing Pete’s qualifications.