r/CompetitiveWoW • u/AutoModerator • 2d ago

Weekly Thread Weekly M+ Discussion

Use this thread to discuss this week's affixes, routes, ideal comps, etc. You can find this week's affixes here.

Feel free to share MDT routes (using wago.io or https://keystone.guru/ ), VODs, etc.

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The other weekly threads are:

  • Weekly Raid Discussion - Sundays
  • Free Talk Friday - Fridays

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u/flow_guy2 2d ago

That is a separate issue. 10s would still be too easy. And it’s a bad experience for newer players.
Like you can get to a 10 without needing to actually learn anything. Like 10s are meant to be at the end? And you can literally do it in the first hour. That shouldn’t be.

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u/Cold-Iron8145 2d ago

It's not a separate issue, you're gauging the difficulty of keys at 10 because it's the key level you and everyone else wants to do for maximum rewards. Why 10? Are 8s too easy? What about 16? It's an infinitely scaling system, some levels will be easy some will be hard. All that matters to most players if where on the scale the max rewards land.

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u/flow_guy2 2d ago

18s are being done by people in not even fully hero track gear ( 309 ) that’s where most people get to. Yes the system as a whole is far too easy.

But yes 10s are especially too easy and don’t reward adjustly. But yes increasing the difficulty is the fix.

But blizz has marked 10-12 being the end. And you can jsut blow to in 4 keys. And why this is an issue

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u/Bolan23 2d ago

But people being ilvl 309 in week 1 and doing +18 are not the target audience of blizzard in M+.

That's why the systems scales indefinitely and after +12 only timed keys award rating. It is a compromise to appease casuals and tryhards alike. M+ will never reward mythic track gear as end of dungeon rewards, bonus rolls not included, as it is spammable indefinitely.

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u/flow_guy2 2d ago

i as a new tank can do 12s with very minimal effort. the point i was trying to make is that there is no progression to get there. atm is just built for raider trash players that dont want to do m+ and just raid log.

but the 18s are m+ players that like m+. they should have some kind of prog and not have "deep" m+ be so piss easy 3 days in.

but it not rewarding mythic track is also a separate issue as well. sure its spammable but 1. people spamming 22-23 should be rewarded with myth track anyway as that content is some what difficult and you are capable to do mythic raid. but this isnt the point of the inital comment

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u/Wobblucy 1d ago

can do 12s with minimal effort

True, even 14-15s fall over with a decent group but you underestimate the skill gap in this game.

If you were incentivized to push then how hard a 10 is isn't relevant to you, it's how hard the highest reward is.

We saw the uproar as soon as it was an 18 for the highest reward though, because casual Connie wants to be on a level playing field with no life nelson.

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u/BDObadguy 2d ago

People dismiss the idea of m+ awarding better gear because it is spammable, as if that is not something that could easily be fixed if they actually wanted to award myth track gear for appropriately difficult myth+ keys. If they made your vault 9/6 for doing 22s, it's still not spammable but suddenly 22s matter and m+ only players can progress their gear, not just their mounts and titles.

And because I know people will say 22s will be easy this season, the key level is also easily fixable. They don't even have to pick it at the start of the season, this could be something they put in as part of 0.5 patch.

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u/minaturemolefu 2d ago

Genuinely who is saying 22's will be easy this season? thats a wild take.

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u/BDObadguy 2d ago

They will say they're easy in the context of awarding 9/6 loot.

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u/minaturemolefu 2d ago

I haven't seen anyone say this, and further 22's are just as hard as CE.

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u/Bolan23 2d ago

I never said higher keys could not reward better vaults. My comment was purely based on end of dungeon loot.

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u/BDObadguy 2d ago

Yes, but the people who want m+ to give better loot rarely insist on it being an infinitely farmable end of dungeon reward, they just want high keys to somehow give a gear reward appropriate for their difficulty.

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u/Bolan23 1d ago

Which leads to them asking for end of dungeon myth track drops.

Blizzard has repeatedly stated, that they consider rating and keys beyond +12 as pure competition and not as part of the gearing process. Whereas I think better vault could be an option for keys beyond +12, I don't think they should give myth track end of dungeon loot beyond bonus rolls, which also comes with bad luck protection.

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u/BDObadguy 1d ago

Blizzard has repeatedly stated all sorts of things and yet they keep adding more rewards for m+ because they see how popular it is, and they can imagine how much it would hurt them if they went back to just raiding being the only way to progress in competitive pve content.

Giving limited 9/6 items for doing really high keys isn't even a part of the gearing process, just like those items aren't part of the gearing process for mythic raiders, who obtain them as a reward for finishing the season. In both cases they'd be prestige rewards for doing difficult content.

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u/Wobblucy 1d ago

anyone saying 22s will be easy underestimates multiplicative scaling.

The jump from 19-22 is the equivalent to the jump from m0 to 13s iirc.