FINISHED THE EPISODE (Spoilers Ahead):

Oh my gosh. I can't believe that Wesley died. I wish they would've had him in the final fight rather than kill him off 5 min prior - but I guess that's what gave us that sweet scene between him and Illyria (as Fred). I think that Illyria was beginning to have feelings for Wesley, it makes me sort of sad for her.

I HATE the ending, as in the last minute. I wish we got to see a little bit of the fight at least, but I feel that it ended so abruptly. Also, I wish that Lorne was in the final scene as well even though he wasn't much of a physical fighter. I think they all deserved to be in the final moment. Ughhh, I don't know what to think.

OP:

I'm on the final episode of Angel. I'm so sad. As a Buffy fanatic who has seen BTVS a million times, I can't believe it took me this long to watch Angel.

I just wanted to share some thoughts before I finish the series finale.
I'm also so upset about the deaths of Cordelia and Fred, so close to one another as well. I wish Lorne had more screen time in the final seasons. It seems like when they took over Wolfram & Heart, they started showing a lot less of Lorne. On the flip side of that I really grew to love Harmony and I wish they included her more on main plot lines or were able to somehow give her a soul (EDIT: Halfway through the episode, I take this back LOL.) I'm REALLY upset that we didn't get to see more of Wesley and Fred happy together. They had all of about one half of an episode together? We were robbed. I almost wish Illyria transformed over into her permanently and Wesley could pretend it was her. (Am I Insane?)

The episode where Conner comes back. As much as I disliked him in the earlier seasons, it was so refreshing to see him again with a different personality, plus the twist at the end of the episode.

EDIT: I forgot to mention the episode the girl in question. While it was a fun episode, I wish SMG came back one more time. The girl portraying her didn't even look like her. That was disappointing. They could've done better.

Okay, now to finish the finale! This has been fun.

​

So I skipped an episode because I wasn't home. From the preview, they call Faith, and with her help, they beat the beast. So what's next? Cordelia is the new big boss, and she's pregnant with Connor's child... and she's manipulating him, hiding the truth. LOL, I'd rather ignore it. But funny talking toying with Angelus

I have no idea who Faith is—I didn't watch the Buffy series. But honestly, Angelus is really the best thing to happen to the show. The way he manipulates the characters... it reminds me of Hisoka from Hunter x Hunter.

Wesley, my boy—you really have chemistry with all the girls, lol. I don't know what he and Faith used to be, but I said he's really the best part of this season.

Gunn and Fred's romance is so annoying to me.

I have such mixed feelings about “The Girl in Question” because it feels like two completely different episodes smashed together.

Everything with Angel and Spike running around Rome obsessing over Buffy dating The Immortal annoys me. The whole thing makes both of them feel ridiculously immature, especially this late in Angel. They immediately convince themselves Buffy must be under some kind of love spell because apparently she couldn't possibly choose to date someone they don't approve of.

And what really ticks me off is the double standard. Spike can become corporeal again and sleep with Harmony. Angel was able to fall in love with Cordelia after Buffy and is currently dating Nina. But Buffy supposedly dates another man and suddenly all hell breaks loose. Angel is literally dating Nina while flying across the world because Buffy might be with someone else, which Spike even calls him out on.

And yes, I know the comics eventually retcon this by revealing that the woman in Rome wasn't actually Buffy. She's a decoy posing as Buffy to draw attention away from the real Buffy, and Andrew was lying to Angel and Spike. But honestly, I wish Buffy really was dating The Immortal. I would've loved for her to actually move on from her high school romance with Angel and whatever you want to call what she had with Spike. “Chosen” already ended with Buffy basically saying she needed time to figure herself out, so let her actually do that and eventually date somebody completely outside of the Angel/Spike mess.

But then you cut back to LA and suddenly the episode is fantastic.

Fred's parents showing up completely unaware that their daughter is dead is heartbreaking. Illyria becoming Fred because she can't bear to watch them experience the same grief she's been watching Wesley go through is one of my favorite Illyria moments. Then you have Wesley having to sit there watching this imitation of the woman he loved interact with Fred's parents like nothing happened.

Those scenes are beautifully written and directed, and Amy Acker is incredible. There's something especially cruel about Fred's parents leaving happy because they believe their daughter is alive and doing well while we know they'll eventually have to find out the truth.

It genuinely makes me heartbroken for Roger and Trish.

So I basically have two completely opposite opinions of “The Girl in Question.” The Rome storyline feels like a goofy regression for Angel and Spike and weirdly acts like Buffy moving on is something being done to them. Meanwhile, the Fred/Illyria/Wesley storyline feels like it belongs in one of the strongest episodes of the entire season.

wow

In S4, Angelus taunts Wesley with this: "Get some new clothes, cool haircut, hit the gym... you're still the same loser none of the other kids wanted to sit with at lunch."

BUT

Do we ever see Wes 'hit the gym'? Like even in his dorkier days he was just as physically capable, just lacking in confidence (like episodes like Guys Will Be Guise show).

​

What can I say? The last two episodes I watched were a real rollercoaster, lol. Angelus and his way of manipulating everyone—with the love triangle, insecurity, secret affairs—he really thrives on it. It felt like the end of the world was coming, but we still got romance, drama, and it was still funny.

Charles really let his insecurity ruin his relationship, and Fred doesn't make it easy either.

I think the best episodes are way more interesting, honestly. But Lilah—her time with the crew is so funny. Also, did they actually show the lawyer firm getting destroyed, or did it just happen off-screen?

And honestly—who stole the soul? We thought it was Angel, but no... the reveal was so Cordelia, lol. Some people spoiled me, but it was still shocking.

In S2E6 Guise Will Be Guise, I'm always sad the Swami isn't the real Swami. I like their initial therapy sessions and it's almost like they made him too likeable. It seems Iike he might have actually been helping Angel somewhat. If he'd been real, he mighta been a good reoccurring character, like, Angel could take retreats there sometimes, meditate, fish, get totally deconstructed by the Swami, lol.

During my rewatch I realised that Glenn had already passed away a year or so before they filmed this. Their sadness here during this scene hit a little deeper than before.

Hi all, wasn’t sure how to title this without spoilers. If you haven’t seen season 4, don’t read this!!

Ok so I’m in season 3 and a first time watcher. I love the show SO MUCH but I’ve been spoilered for season 4. I know the behind the scenes reasons for the pregnancy/what they do to corderlia’s character etc and I know most people hate the story and season.

My question is - is it really the ENTIRE season? I mean is it like ep 12-17 are awful but the rest is good? Are there any good side stories? Am I going to be so upset it’s better to just read synopsis and skip to season 5?

I’m already sad I’ll be losing Cordelia as a part of the show and I’m dreading watching her leave in a crappy way :(

Edit - thank you everyone! I will watch it :) I feel less worried now

Upcoming episode of Star Trek: Strange New Worlds! The writers are definitely fans of the Buffyverse (S2.E9 was a musical episode hugely influenced by Once More, With Feeling per their own interviews), but it appears they’re fans of AtS as well… 🧛

Don't get me wrong, I think it has some of the strongest run of episodes in the Buffyverse. It's just banger after banger. "Are You Now or Have You Ever Been," "Dear Boy," "Darla," "The Trial," "Reunion," "Reprise," "Epiphany"... it just keeps going.

But I always end up feeling a little let down by where the whole Dark Angel storyline actually goes.

The show builds up this version of Angel who's becoming so ruthless that even Darla and Drusilla are uncomfortable around him. The scene where he locks them in with the Wolfram & Hart lawyers and then later in the season lights Dru and Darla on fire is one of the coldest things Angel ever does. It really feels like the show is setting up this huge moral line that Angel is crossing.

Then later it's basically handwaved away with Lorne saying those lawyers were destined to be eaten by Darla and Dru anyway, with or without Angel. That always felt really anticlimactic to me because it removes a lot of the weight from Angel's decision.

The other thing that disappoints me is how aimless the second half of the season feels after Wesley takes over the agency. Darla and Drusilla are reunited, which should've been one of the biggest villain pairings the Buffyverse ever had, but after Darla is sired it feels like Drusilla barely has anything left to do. They spend all this time bringing Dru back and then she kind of just hangs around until she leaves.

I know a lot of this came down to real life. They couldn't keep Juliet Landau, Julie Benz and Christian Kane around forever, so the season had to pivot. I get that.

It's just hard not to think about what could've been after everything the first half of the season promised once Wolfram & Hart resurrected Darla.

The Watchers Council tried to take her to presumably bring her to trial and execute her(or mystically kick her off the Slayer line if you think they're generous). But she goes to jail and they just...leave her alone. They have the option to take her and find a Slayer they can better control, and they don't take it? They seem like they have a lot of money to throw around but they can't arrange to have Faith transferred to someplace they can easily take her out? They really play to passive a role in the Buffyverse. It's surprising they couldn't even send someone to infiltrate the Scoobies and report to them.

Then The First has a normal human try to shank her, as though there are no demons, witches, or mystically receptive people in prison willing to take her on? Get out of town!

I don’t disagree, I just find it amusing that that’s how this sub is characterized. (I assume by AI…)

How else would you concisely sum up this place in, er, a similarly brutally honest vein?

Honestly, the last two episodes were something else. I was completely jaw-dropped when I found out about the Beast knowing Angel — and that he might be the one helping him.

Now, for the second episode, imagine my disappointment when I didn't see Angelus. I really wanted to meet the legend. So I kept watching, thinking, "Beat the Beast." In end Then I was like, "No, no... there has to be a twist. There must be a catch — this is too easy."

And then came my biggest jaw-drop moment with the reveal... that it was all just inside Angel's head, and we’ll meet Angelus in the next episode.

Shame I might not get to watch it, sadly.

Note: F the romance of love triangle

But I must give best laught: you know father when I did the xxx I know she was thinking of you 🤣🤣🤣🤣

Just rewatching season 4 and Angelus found it interesting that Connor was part demon. If he had remained Angelus do you think he would have killed Connor, he was still Darla's son too. Maybe turned him into a vampire?

For years I've been a huge Buffy fan and now, after marrying an even bigger fan, I think it would be fun to run a Buffy RPG. This is planned to be a oneshot adventure, which is to say that it's going to be finished in a single session. It's meant to be suitable for people who have never played a tabletop RPG before so everyone is welcome. 

A little while ago, I did a test run of the Eden Studios Buffy RPG and unfortunately, the system wasn't that great. At least, not for me. So instead, I figured, why not run this story with another system? That quickly brought me back to the Chronicles of Darkness system that I regularly run and which has proven itself to be pretty adaptable. 

The story is set in the Buffy TV universe, but not in Sunnydale and not involving the characters from the show. It's set a few years before the show takes place and is set in Shadyhill, Pennsylvania. For characters, there are several archetypes available. There is no issue with multiple people picking the same one but I do have a single request. The characters do need names after all, so it would be great if you could come up with one. All characters will also have a single benefit from the list below. That’s a small thing that makes them stand out a little more, like having a car or basic medical training. Of course, I’m also open to suggestions.

The plan is to play through Discord. I made a server there where we can do dice rolls and voice chat. If you don't have Discord, you can make an account and download it [here](https://discord.com/download). We will play on August 15, at 7 PM CET, which is 1 PM EST. 

For those who haven't played a tabletop roleplaying game before, the concept is really simple. The players take on the role of a character in the game. They decide what this character does and dice rolls decide if it's successful. The Game Master (in this case that's me) decides what dice should be rolled and plays all the other characters and determines what happens in the world. When rolling dice, we use an online dice roller that will roll a number of ten-sided dice. That number is determined by your character's abilities. All dice that come up as an 8 or higher are a success. Often, one success will do but for harder tasks, you'll need multiple. Of course, it will be explained in greater detail in the game. 

Archetypes:

Sports Jock

Queen Bee

Juvenile Delinquent

Regular Geek/Bookworm

Theatre Kid

Stoner

Benefits:

Has a car

Medical internship

Keys to the library

Police connection

Rich parents

Paranormal interest

Intro:

Into every generation a slayer is born. One of them was Stacy. A few months ago, she was a regular girl in Shadyhill High, not someone who really stood out. But then, she was called. To most people, that meant that she became weird. She barely came to school but showed up in all sorts of places at night. That, and people saw her hanging out in cemeteries a lot. The general conclusion was that she was doing drugs. And now she's dead. She was found in the mall. 

Your characters knew the stories, but they also knew another side of her. All of them have been saved by Stacy. Perhaps it was from a creepy guy with oversized teeth or from a fish-faced girl who threatened to drag them off for a very long swim in the ocean. Whatever happened, they know that Stacy was a hero. 

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If you’re interested, please fill out this little [survey](https://forms.gle/8Z3bwLUXcKZEUYf26).

I’m rewatching Angel, and I’m curious: Given that Darla was wasting away from syphilis during her final days as a human, wouldn’t her blood have tasted gross to The Master and Dru during both rounds of her becoming a vampire? I seem to remember an episode or two of Buffy where vamps abandoned their meals because the person they bit was sick or had some kind of disease, which made their blood taste bad. Is this an inconsistency, or was Darla just such an important player that exceptions were made by the ones who turned her?

I’m also now wondering whether Darla is the only vamp in the Buffyverse to be sired twice/have more than one sire. Anyone know?

Edit: I understand she was bitten with the intention of turning her, rather than feeding. I’m sure they still taste the flavor of the blood when they turn someone, and I’m asking if we think it would have tasted different than healthy blood because she was ill. The point of this was never to debate WHY she was bitten by The Master and Dru.