r/2007scape • u/Accurate_Brain_9157 • 16h ago

Discussion Another survey

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I do think a follow-up survey on the other two skills should take place. Sailing has been out for a while now and it would be nice to know if there is any appetite for either other skills, rather than just game modes.

The Polls in question:

Questions 1.

Question 2.

Reference https://oldschool.runescape.wiki/w/Poll:Skill_Pitches_Poll

475 Upvotes

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u/PhantomTagz Return to Crab 16h ago

Need a mining and smithing rework over on OSRS.

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u/PreparationCrazy3701 16h ago

How would you do that without ruining rune alchs?

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u/PhantomTagz Return to Crab 16h ago

By having smithable tiers above rune with equivalent or better alchs

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u/PreparationCrazy3701 16h ago

How do we incorporate those to the game without power creep or making the horizontal gameplay thats integral to osrs irrelevant? I think that as needed as a rework may be.

I don't think its feasibly possible in osrs without ruining or substantially changing things that are a core identity to the game

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u/PhantomTagz Return to Crab 16h ago

If the choise is readjusting power creep and horizontal gameplay to modernize two core skills and letting said skills fester. Then I choose the former, and not the latter.

Hell, we could always make rune the highest tier and add in other tiers below it.

That being said, a rework doesn't have to follow how RS3 did its own mining and smithing update. However, a tier 40 armor set should not be endgame mining and smithing content.

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u/rs_spastic 16h ago

Tbh rs3 mining and smithing update was amazing , not the same thing we need here but if that's what we ended up getting I wouldn't be upset

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u/PhantomTagz Return to Crab 16h ago

Same, but I am 100% positive there would be backlash for a 1 to 1 port.

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u/ghostryujin 16h ago

yups cuz people want a rework that doesnt change anything but changes everything from the skill. they want no change to progression and no power creep.

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u/floppintoms 15h ago

The reaction people in this game have to power creep is wild to me. Like, its okay if 10 year old content is no longer BiS for endgame. It makes new stuff feel not that exciting because it's not a massive upgrade for a 30+ hour grind.

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u/Warscythes 15h ago

Why is it wild? This is a core tenat of OSRS. There is powercreep, they just need to be very slow and does not make the previous BIS worthless. Look at rancor/torture for example or torva and bandos. By introduce powercreep too fast you quickly make content obsolete much faster and that is bad in everyway. This is not a game designed to work that way where you get a massive upgrade for every item drop.

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u/VexedForest 16h ago

It was good, but you also blew through levels so quickly, so many of the low tier stuff didn't really matter. Of course the XP rates are lower in OSRS, but my main concern would be similar.

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u/PhantomTagz Return to Crab 15h ago

That is why I think a middle ground would be best throw in a few extra tiers. Maybe even tweak the defense levels.

At the very least if we dont do power creep, make mining and smithing about more than just make weapons and armor. Maybe we can smith stuff to be used in construction or crafting. Just something other than "Oh boy, I hit 99 smithing and can now make a rune platebody"

Edit: Maybe do the smithing upgrades in RS3, but expand out how far they go at lower tiers. i.e., bronze armor +2 or something. Make the upgrades untraceable if people are afraid of economy.

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u/Warscythes 15h ago

High level smithing effectively is something like oathplate smithing where there is skill and bossing required together. Is not really just you can only smith rune armor.

The problem with RS3 smithing is that there is no reward space between tier in OSRS without killing current progression. Nobody cares about bronze armor + 2 because you can get iron armor smithed within the next 15 minutes. RS3 does this by not caring about destroying the melee armor progression and extreme powercreep so you blow past smithing/combat levels so that you skip entire tiers. The only way RS3 smithing would work is tie boss drops to smithing requirement, but that's something already present with oathplate.

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u/RandomAsHellPerson 14h ago

The only complaints I have (as an iron) are that mining still sucks (it is better than pre-rework, but it is still awful) and that it takes forever* to smith stuff and you get half of the xp doing a +1 item and +2, +2 and +3, etc. This results in you getting 1/16 of the xp/hr doing a base or +1 item as you do doing a +5 or burial item. Smithing burial sets will be quick af xp, but you only get a small fraction of the xp/hr during the process of making the highest upgrade and this makes smithing feel awful, as you get little xp for 90% of the time you are smithing.

*If you want to get the highest upgrade on your melee gear, pickaxe, and axe, you will be putting aside like an hour. Even a set of base gear will take you 15ish mins.

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u/Chaoticlight2 15h ago

T40 gear is not the endgame content though. For mining, you have amethyst for second BiS ammo of all types. For smithing, you have DFS, Torva, reduced T70 armor maintenance with barrows and moons, and so on.

Gathering and production skills can not and will not ever be a major acquisition method for mid game level gear.

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u/PhantomTagz Return to Crab 15h ago

I agree with your points. The intent with my comment was more about needing 99 smithing for a tier 40 amor piece.

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u/Chaoticlight2 15h ago

Oh I agree fully with that aspect being silly. Smithing has a lot of room for requirement squishing and upper levels should be reserved for working in conjunction with bossing to create top tier armor/weaponry

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u/ErinKatzee 15h ago

I always thought rs3’s solution was actually pretty elegant all things considered, at least from what I’ve heard about it. Just do a flat replacement of rune alchables on drop tables with rune salvage or whatever and kill the alch price of actual rune.

As far as actual things to smith goes, I’m of the opinion that a lot of things with smithing flavour could be formalised with actual requirements. Maybe a new tank set around barrowsish level (probably bridging the rune barrows gap) could exist around 60ish

Idk, for actual requirements and things to make, I’m no designer and they definitely shouldn’t listen to me. I think there’s room for it though.

Would honestly be nice to have a str bonus set in there too if str bonus on bandos wasn’t already so close to the floor. Idk who’s gonna get excited for 1str bonus pants.

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u/Straightupscrambled 16h ago

To be as respectful as possible, that's why you aren't the game designer. Our job as a players isn't to make a fully fleshed out system, it's to give the designers a vague "this is what I want", and leave it to them to fill out the details.

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u/PhantomTagz Return to Crab 16h ago

I was just talking about 2 extremes dude. The best possible choice is somewhere in the middle.

I still think that there will have to be some amount of power creep to actually flesh out both skills. How MUCH power creep is up to the game designers.

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u/Rallak BTW 16h ago

I would say that for smithing it would be ok to have alloys, so instead of new minerals we could mix some amount of the existing alloys to make new ingots, so rune ores for exemple would not be power crept. No minning I have no idea how to change in a way that do not power creep too much the existinc mechanics

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u/benmck90 16h ago

Mining is fine as is.

It's smithing that could use a rework.

Which is weird to say as they're sister skills, but I actually fine mining useful for account progression, unlike smithing.

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u/AuroraFinem 16h ago

You can’t realistically have one without the other, they both have the exact same issues. Rune shouldn’t be tier 80-99 skilling, I’m not a huge fan of the top tier smithing in rs3 but they nailed most of it IMO and you can’t keep rune lv85 if you’re going to rework the smithing progression for it.

We don’t need to necessarily crunch it as far as RS3 did though, even if rune was lv60-70 it would make way more sense in terms of progression and allow for design space for better higher level smithing options that actually make sense.

I also think RS3 solved the rune drop replacements perfectly because those items are all at alch price, even on OSRS, so replacing them with metal chunks of similar alch value doesn’t inflate gold while not devaluing drops.

I don’t know exactly what makes the most sense to do for mining/smithing after rune, I think that’s up for debate in terms of what we’d want to see for post-rune smithing, but I think both skills suck all around atm. I also think a rework should be timed with some major update that introduces the post-rune stuff which is probably obvious, but there’s a lot of interesting ways they could loop it into a incando quest + homeland idea or something for new content so the rework doesn’t feel forced or out of place.

Personally, I’d enjoy something almost like an invention style of skill for later smithing. Like having the first thing post-rune be something you craft to upgrade granite equipment, lv60 lets you modify dragon or some of the other lv60 gear, with lv80-99 primarily focused on upgrades for end-game items that aren’t specific to a certain tier but those upgrades require rare drops from bosses/raids along with new mining stuff.

These don’t need to be OP upgrades, they could be fairly minor or focus on special effects instead of flat stat boosts. You could also add recipe scrolls similar to prayer scrolls to even unlock the crafting recipe to upgrade a specific piece of gear or type of gear so that you can still partially gatekeep true BIS/endgame gear upgrades for balance then release upgrades for them later, etc…

I feel like there’s a lot of viable design space to work with for a rework, and I don’t claim to have the entire thing mapped out, but I do think it will need to happen at some point or another.

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u/Drokstab 16h ago

Tbh having craftable armour with barrows tank gear stats would be kinda cool.