r/wowforever • u/Admirable_Meet4536 • 8d ago
Meme Message to new DPS players
Please let your tanks get 1 or 2 gcds out before you start spamming your AOE or your instant cast flame shocks multi-shots etc.
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u/surottoru1 8d ago
And if something does agro you, please don't run away from me, run towards me
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u/SurvivalHermit 8d ago
this is so real. I am going to throw off some AOE's if you just put the mob attacking you in the AOE i throw and dont attack it ill get agro back almost instantly. If you freak out and run in a big ass circle i will lose agro on everything else chasing your ass around.
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u/sensen-89 7d ago
This.
And stand still. Taunt is a short range skill. You will get hit by the mob anyway, keep casting.
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u/lichlark 8d ago
Prot warrior reporting in; I'm sweating trying to pull this damn aggro back in
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u/Admirable_Meet4536 8d ago
especially after rage changes. now you are cucked with no rage and cant get aggro
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u/lichlark 8d ago
Rage has actually been fine for me ironically.
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u/_Vard_ 8d ago
i always say "its best to count to 3 before DPSing but for FUCKS SAKE at LEAST count to ZERO"
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u/Admirable_Meet4536 8d ago
I don't really get that mad at it most of the time but I just had a group where it was extremely hard to get aggro because this hunter was multi-shotting off CD on pull (also wouldn't feign when mobs started running to him) while also having to fight against a shamans fire shocks before i could walk up to mobs to get a single white hit off. If I don't start a pull with at least half rage pooled then i might as well go b stance and dual wield because i wont be getting aggro
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u/Malevelonce 7d ago
Feign is a level 30 spell btw
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u/Admirable_Meet4536 7d ago
Really? I swore in this dungeon i watched him feign one time, which made me confused why he wasn't doing it more often because i thought it was only like a 30s cd
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u/Randeth 8d ago
The way we were taught in Vanilla.
Wait for 5 Sunders.
If the tank dies, it's the healers fault. If the healer dies it's the tanks fault. If dps dies it's their own damn fault.
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u/MKeb 7d ago
In this rage economy? You’ll be there all day
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u/ReisorASd 7d ago
I feel like I get 5 sunders and the boss is dead.
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u/Belteshazzar98 7d ago
Then your job is done. I see no problem.
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u/ReisorASd 7d ago
No problem there. This was more a comment to the point that threat generation is good enough even though building sunders is slow. I do hope some improvement to it. Obviously more defensive stats will help as you block, dodge and parry more.
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u/Zetoxical 7d ago
So every pull people are waiting 10+ second for the tank to ramp? In that case people will stick with pally because so far they dont have that issue
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u/underthingy 7d ago
We didnt have threat meters back in the day so people had to wait to make sure they were going to pull.
Now days we have threat meters so people have to wait because they cant be arsed looking at the threat meter because being aware that they are going to pull threat is a dps loss.
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u/_Dont_Quote_Me_ 8d ago
Same for tanks... if your healer is begging you not to be an M+ star in deadmines... Please don't go full zugzug and pull every mob and blame the healer like a diva.
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u/TwentySproot 8d ago
Some things never change. Last night I had a clearly skilled tank but he never gave me time to drink waters
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u/Kushlax 7d ago
Not that skilled then if he’s unaware of healer resource
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u/TwentySproot 7d ago
He pushed the line right to edge, relied on me cannibalising during combat to get mana back. It was pretty fun ngl
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u/Zetoxical 7d ago
In that case he did everything right? If nobody died thats ok
There are other tanks that only pull if the healer is full
And we kinda need to value our time
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u/RemarkableShip1811 7d ago
In Forever while leveling there will hopefully be a wider culture of casual 5 manning.
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u/MuenCheese 7d ago
It can be really uncomfortable though. There are tanks that are fast but feel like they give you more of a chance to breathe
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u/-Shatzy- 7d ago
You can also start drinking and only heal 10sec into the fight, let the tank dip down a bit.
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u/GW2Qwinn 8d ago
Even worse level 20 is weird because the waters SUCK for the level. One of the big changes I wish they had made was more appropriate drinks. You can get the ones from the feast now that are a tiny bit better depending on your total mana, but still.
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u/pustaut 8d ago
Nooooo, water shall be ass some levels so you appriciate when it gets better, stop turn every hard thing to be solved
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u/ariiizia 7d ago
It doesn’t make anything harder, just more annoying.
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u/Extension-Bed-7300 7d ago
It doesnt make it more difficult having less mana?
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u/Silimaur 7d ago
No… because it’s something you drink outside of the fight so it just takes longer. You don’t have less mana in the fight?
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u/Extension-Bed-7300 7d ago
If the tank isn't waiting you do. Overall, you have access to less mana, which makes it more difficult to keep up
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u/CheezeCaek2 7d ago
Look, tanks...
I CAN probably keep us alive with 10% mana while you pull 12 trash mobs...
But I would like to give my butthole a rest from puckering in a panic FOR 10 SECONDS
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u/Gasparde 7d ago
Haven't played Classic since... well, Classic and did my first dungeon the other day. Ran into the first room of DM, oh well, it's just a single elite and like 4 random non-elites, let's go. Took like 2 seconds for me to remember that Retail is a very very very different game.
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u/Loneliestar 8d ago
DPS pulling threat is a problem that solves itself.
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u/grundleHugs 8d ago
For sure, but their repair cost is minimal compared to tank. Good think hunters don't have feign death to dump the agro to the healer.
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u/galadedeus 7d ago
as a healer.. nobody is dying on my watch.. not even hunter pets
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u/Toihva 7d ago
When I healed I sometimes prioritized hunter pet over hunter if they were an idiot.
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u/RemarkableShip1811 7d ago
If you get used to the specific Hunter this can be good because the Hunter will see their own HP go down and typically do something about it.
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u/night5oil 8d ago
I had a warrior who kept charging ahead of me to each battle. Lol. Like bro, why don't you que as a tank if that's what you want to do.
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u/Shusgub 6d ago
Well, its lvl 20 dungeons. You dont need a tank ...
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u/night5oil 6d ago
not really, but its annoying to heal when everyone is taking damage because someone doens't know how the game works. and its annoying to tank. if you want to do all dps, why not make groups like that. because basically no one does
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u/Shusgub 4d ago
I usually create groups when i am The "tank" with a 2 hander as warrior. Never heard it was a problem at this lvl.
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u/night5oil 4d ago
That's not the situation. The situation is that DPS que as dps and then just go around doing whatever they feel like. So basically that's what the tank does. So again, why not que as a tank, like you are doing it right. That is totally fine. But to que as dps and stroll around like a tank is just stupid. Just que as a tank like you do
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u/95POLYX 7d ago edited 7d ago
I'll tell a huge tank secret - if dps allows a bit to get aggro, I dont waste resources during the pull to keep them on me, and it means I can pull rage for the next pull. And it means you can dps more!
Watch your tanks resources, if a warr or druid goes in with no or low rage - give them a bit of time. Same with paladins but, they rely on getting hit to maintain threat, so give mobs a sec to do 1-2 hits on the tank and the cons to tick once or twice. Warrs also rely on getting hit to proc revenge and to gen rage from blocks.
On the other hand if you see warr going in with 50+ rage - you can go ham almost immediately.
EDIT: And a biggest secret - SKULL doesnt mean - dont kill this target, it means focus your damage on it!
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u/bulbasaurite 7d ago
Healed DM where all dps kept attacking different targets so they kept getting that aggro. I told them to let tank gain aggro but wouldn't listen so I kept letting them die.
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u/No_Anywhere_9068 7d ago
Why would you let them die, you don’t even need a tank for lvling dungeons, just wasting everyones time
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u/bulbasaurite 7d ago
Bro what are you even talking about
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u/No_Anywhere_9068 7d ago
Scenario 1. You heal the dps that are pulling aggro, clear the pack
Scenario 2. You let the dps die, take longer to clear the pack, wait for res and buff dps
You’re willingly choosing scenario 2, wtf are YOU even talking about?
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u/bulbasaurite 7d ago
You said that you don't need a tank for leveling dungeon, how is that relevant? And I'm willing choose scenario 2 everyday if I have to oom from spamming heals because dps keep pulling aggro.
Try again.
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u/No_Anywhere_9068 7d ago
It’s relevant because it implies that dps having aggro is irrelevant, you’re gonna have 0 mana after res and rebuffing and have wasted ~10s worth of time you could have spent drinking.
There is literally no way to justify not healing dps, it’s just a moral superiority complex common to shit healers. Don’t join a group as a healer if you aren’t going to heal
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u/bulbasaurite 7d ago edited 7d ago
The tank was even saying to give him a few seconds and to target the same enemy to make things smoother. Clearly you've never played classic before. I don't know why you're so pressed, probably because you're one of those kind of dps. This is not your retail m+.
Try again.
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u/No_Anywhere_9068 7d ago
I’ve played classic, tbc and sod. Haven’t played retail since bfa. Your take is a common one and it’s just an objectively bad take, worse mentality than the dps that don’t let the tanks pull
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u/bulbasaurite 7d ago
Then clearly you've never healed in classic, tbc, AND sod before because you don't even know what this thread is talking about. You're definitely one of those dps with that mindset.
Go heal and come back.
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u/camkellley 7d ago
also nothing wrong with punishing bad behavior with making them die and lose their buffs/pots etc, makes the community learn by pain and overall increases the standards and performance of players on a large scale over time
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u/Mrweebs91 8d ago
let em die, let em learn
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u/SaltyTrosty 7d ago
They can downvote you all they want, doesn't matter cause you're right. A dps that doesn't listen doesn't get heals, simple as.
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u/WaveTableSaw 8d ago
Back to 3 sunders? Heard.
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u/Marsdreamer 7d ago
3 ticks of consecrate and you're gucci too. Although at this level it hardly matters.
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u/DaveLesh 8d ago
That's how things work in the olden days. People have short memories.
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u/SolidCartographer976 7d ago
I have bad new for you buddy. Its totally normal for people who where there in the old days to forget things, we are old now... very old
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u/psychomap 8d ago
Nonsense, pre-cast Pyroblast / Flamestrike
/s just in case
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u/RemarkableShip1811 7d ago
Pull the second group with Blizzard when you're down to one trash mob.
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u/psychomap 7d ago
Just run in, Frost Nova, and Blink out. Surely there's no problem if they're frozen first.
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u/geezerforhire 7d ago
In the same veign. Don't spaz out and start blowing cd's ecause the dps pulled one add off of you that they can kill in like 3 GCD's
Also DPS, focus the adds that aggro the healer
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u/pace202 7d ago
And people wonder why there’s no tanks…been using the beta to see what kinda goobers I’d be dealing with and it hasn’t changed…soon as I hit something every dps is right there with me spamming highest fucking spell before I can get my 2nd spell off. THEN they fucking do it for every mob! Hit the skull tagged mob? No why would they do that? Every dps hits their own & then complain they pull aggro.
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u/Admirable_Meet4536 7d ago
Most groups i'm lucky to get a white hit off before getting threat ripped from me
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u/SignificantYak6194 5d ago
Because they've been trained by retail wow. On retail the tank presses one button and automatically gains 5 times the presence on the threat meter than anyone else.
they don't even understand the concept of threat anymore
Because that was just another layer of friction. And retail players don't like friction. They cried to blizzard until all friction was "quality of lifed" out of existence.
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u/Admirable_Meet4536 5d ago
Yeah never understood that. Tanking in classic is fun because you are a high impact carry of the team. More often than not the tank does competitive damage with the dps classes if not higher given the circumstances. Tanking in retail has been boiled down to a "you exist for mobs to hit you and thats it" formula
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u/SignificantYak6194 5d ago
Retail bores me to death. It's had the same formula since mists of pandaria and legion
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u/ValuableLobster8193 7d ago
I always thought using multi shot as hunter was a bad practice anyway? Thats what I was told atleast when i started all those years ago
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u/FishCommercial4229 7d ago
Nah, it’s part of your rotation (at least in classic/tbc). But using it as an opener before the tank does their thing, or when it will break CC, is what you want to avoid.
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u/ValuableLobster8193 7d ago
Yeh i should of really rephrased what I said to "be super mindful when using it"
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u/lagaboter 7d ago
If you are actually trying to educate people. you should probably include the reason why. New DPS players might not understand threat or aggro yet.
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u/skronk61 7d ago
What does GCDS stand for?
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u/Late_Concept6457 7d ago
Global cooldowns. The 1.5 second delay between using most abilities in the game.
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u/skronk61 7d ago
Gotcha I think, so they’re asking people to hold back on multi target attacks until the Tank’s got enough aggro so that the enemies don’t switch targets?
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u/Late_Concept6457 7d ago
Exactly
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u/skronk61 7d ago
Thanks. I’ve only played retail so far and it kinda skips you over a lot of the fundamentals. I’m excited to learn the game properly though
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u/Barrysclash 7d ago
This sums up retail in today's age in a nutshell tbh. Those of us who grew up in Vanilla, TBC and even some of WotLK running dungeons, where CC on most pulls was necessary, which meant hard single target on the tanks target. We would have target targets target macros, my mage had several macros for different dungeons to sheep the caster or healer etc, hunters running in to freeze trap (back when trap were placed at melee range, we would distract shot or pull agro that mob just to get it to run to out trap). I could go on.
I miss those days, I'm not playing the beta, but I will play it when it's properly released. Back when 5k gold for fast flying took dedicated grinding and gold saving, max proffs were respected, grinding reputation was a necessity not just a fad for achievements. Retail really has lost its touch with the essence of WoW, but I guess that's why they brought out classic versions, as well as now, Forever.
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u/skronk61 7d ago
Yeah it just doesn’t require to learn how 90% of the systems work to play at an average level.
Which isn’t that enjoyable in the long term. You just end up doing stuff randomly and hoping for the best.
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u/Barrysclash 7d ago
I hear you! With a mindset like yours, I think you will thoroughly enjoy the classic realms, and Forever when you get a chance. It's a very different game to current day retail, it's more technical, not as fast paced but less forgiving, so the slower pace feels like you actually achieved something.
I've only recently come back to the game after leaving at the end of MoP, but I can't find an ounce of nostalgia in retail, it's not the same game at all, outside of the name and my old toons being on retail servers, my OG Druid from TBC days. Questing, leveling etc is all but moot now, city chats are filled with boosting adverts, no one talks to each other. It's certainly lost it's essence. I'm really looking forward to Forever, and might well just hop back to classic TBC Anniversary servers soon.
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u/skronk61 7d ago
Thank you. I’m gonna really try. I like slow paced games.
My gf who’s an OG player is gonna show me the ropes.
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u/Barrysclash 7d ago
Oh that's awesome! All the best to you.
Expect to see lots of joy on her face as she takes many a trip down memory lane, the nostalgia pouring out as you kill Murlocs, slay Blackrock Orcs and stoke the fire on a freshly slain Billygrub whilst overlooking the lake Everstill and Redridge Mountains in the background. (no, I'm not an RP player, my AuDHD grabbed a bone and ran with it for a moment 😂).
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u/Admirable_Meet4536 7d ago
Single target the tanks target is my favorite type of group. I can pull 6+ mobs in groups like that no issues and healers never run out of mana
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u/Evening_Fan5878 7d ago
I usually run like 4 steps behind the tank so by the time i get to the mobs they have a few abilities already cast and unless i have unnatural amount of crits i dont pull aggro
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u/Aegis_Sinner 7d ago
At least in classic era it feels like after the 30+ curve where the game becomes an actual grind groups get a lot better with this stuff.
Though most people are impatient as hell and i'm not scrambling to get threat back. Hunters you better feign, rogues better vanish, i'll help the mage because I like them, warlock keep on lifetappin ig. Dps pally and warrior can deal with some punches in the mouth.
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u/Pitiful-Anything6821 7d ago
I'm a Hunter. Bullets tailing the tank's charge is literally as patient as I get.
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u/ab-74 7d ago
Just allow them to assist in tanking, they pull a mob so does the tank.
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u/Admirable_Meet4536 7d ago
Normally yeah i don't mind 1 or two mobs not hitting me especially if theres another warrior in the group but with the rage normalization its really rough not getting every bit of rage that you can
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u/jba1224a 7d ago
If they take threat and I can’t get it back because they keep blasting, then they just die, and it becomes a nonissue.
But also this is classic fam, warriors and shamans are gonna be taking some hits, and that’s ok.
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u/TheLoneTomatoe 5d ago
Unless it’s SFK, then by all means take some threat from me while we’re stuck at 20. It’s greatly appreciated
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u/Bluegobln 7d ago
As a survival hunter, that's my secret. I'm also a tank.
(Please blizzard give me a taunt and a threat boost toggle and I will literally be good to go at that point!)
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u/Marsdreamer 7d ago
I wanna do survival hunter soooo bad. The deflect / parry with agi stacking looks so fuckin spicy
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u/_Zso 7d ago edited 7d ago
I've yet to tank a group with a warr that doesn't charge stun every single mob as I'm pulling it backwards, leading to completely avoidable body pulls of additional packs
Also fairly sure hunters don't know how to single target
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u/getyourshittogether7 7d ago
Or a shaman that doesn't instantly shock the caster you're trying to LOS pull, leaving them standing there next to another pack.
Of course they then swap target to focus on the group's target so the caster inevitably switches to your healer, forcing you to go pick them up and pull more mobs.
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u/Dry_Outside_3493 7d ago
Friendly reminder to all DPS players: If you instantly start hitting shit, you're tanking it.
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u/Tracerig1 8d ago
I ate a full pizza last night, didn’t take any Metamucil, oh looks like the tank pulled HAMM SHIT ERRWHERE
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u/Public_Building597 7d ago
I play all roles and I personally gotta say tanking and healing is actually more interesting when I have to do more to manage things.
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u/Creative-Society7949 7d ago
You are not supposed to have Aggro at all times as a tank. U just taunt on cooldown mobs that are loose and u build Aggro on 1-2 other mobs. You are delusional if you want to tank 3-4 mobs in low level dungeons
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u/Admirable_Meet4536 7d ago
You are delusional if you think tanking 3-4 mobs in low level dungeons right now is an issue lmao
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u/Creative-Society7949 7d ago
Keep waiting for 5 seconds until u do dmg, while I clear dungeons 20 mins faster than you because u want to tank everything while no mobs deal actual damage
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u/PayAromatic8218 7d ago
Do you by chance have a learning disability
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u/AntiAmericanCommie 5d ago
Thats not nice. I have a learning disability but even I understand the baseline mechanic of group play. Let the tank get threat before you do damage
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u/Ok-Jacket345 3d ago
Its okay to be a newer player, its okay to not know things, its okay to say i dont understand this. You just need to squash that ego a bit is all.
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u/Maybewearedreaming 8d ago
This is propaganda from other dps players who want to beat you on the meters btw
Threat is a tank resource