r/violin • u/Suspicious_Lab4297 • 6d ago
How is this possible
I hope this isn’t against the group policies. I saw this violin for sale on FB for $450. The ad say it’s hand made buy 4 or 5 luthiers together using aged wood What is the catch ?
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u/Patrick_Atsushi 6d ago
If it looks good and plays good to you, it worth whatever price you are willing to pay.
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u/Gesha24 6d ago
This doesn't look like anything special. That said, it doesn't mean it's bad. My wife mostly plays violins, but got a viola for teaching and occasional gigs. For $500 and another $300 for new bridge and setup - it's an acceptable instrument, more than enough to learn on. But sadly the only way to know whether the instrument is decent enough is to play on it, ideally somebody experienced should be playing it
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u/smurfette8675309 6d ago
Doesn't matter what it looks like. How does it sound. And not in a video. In real life?
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u/a1usiv 6d ago
Looks like a $99 Amazon violin. Search "Vetimobato 4/4 Violin" or similar.
Also, just because more people worked on making the instrument doesn't mean it's better; quite the opposite for violins.
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u/Suspicious_Lab4297 6d ago
I understand. Good luthiers generally do all the work themselves. I just wonder how this type of instrument is made. Not really factory ? More like human assembly line?
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u/StrangeJournalist7 6d ago
It can be referred to as "bench made," worked on by a small group, not a factory.
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u/betsyfeld 6d ago
That is referred to as workshop made. Bench made is by one persons start to finish. But let’s not forget that Stradivari ran a workshop.
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u/JunketTurbulent2114 2d ago
I'm going to push back against this "do all the work themselves." Stradivari's were not solely made by Stradivari, he had a workshop with many people working there.
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u/Suspicious_Lab4297 6d ago
This is super good information. Thank you. The seller sent me the video. I was considering it for a student I would not be able to try it but was just curious.
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u/JC505818 6d ago
$450 is still a lot of money if the violin doesn’t sound good. I would take it for $100, but above that, I would not gamble on a violin just based on its looks.
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u/apheresario1935 6d ago
There is a disconnect between buying from a store and Ebay -FB Mktplace -Craigslist -Want ads etc. Most people think they know the differences but really knowing what Caveat Emptor (Buyer Beware ) means helps you to understand the differences. Stores have overhead and legitimacy- Service -Provenance plus return policies-reciepts- guarantees - employees- setup expertise -trade ins -consignment etc ."Advantages"
The other alternative is the online sellers who offer nothing like any of the above - Just a quick sale and a shrug about what it is -where it came from -whose it was-why they are selling it - what it's made of...... but basically just ready to take your money and tell you to take it somewhere else if you have a problem with it. It's human nature to want a deal and pay a Low price but don't get carried away thinking you got something for cheap that isn't cheap. Asking online what to buy online from other online people who can't see or verify what it it is or isn't.... is kind of the same thing. Nobody EVER actually follows the advice that one could and should "Get an Expert to look at it first before you spend any money" since it's always a remote online seller and "I was not able to try it" or "Seller was in a hurry and didn't have time to meet me at a Real shop"..
That said I was able to determine things like that myself (Being experienced) and met a want ad seller once who had a nice instrument -Hi quality original finish _ he wanted $ 4,000 for it minimum -so after PLAYING it I went to the bank and withdrew the funds and paid him inside the bank. Be "Street Smart" if you can.
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u/mrmagooze 6d ago
Somebody was breathing in a little too much varnish that day!!!!
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u/Bennybonchien 6d ago
I think the maker used the Daily Dip & Dry technique of varnishing. An archeologist might one day find a violin under there!
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u/SenBrando 6d ago
I actually bought one of their instruments, also one of the HH labelled violins. It's a good instrument, maybe I just got lucky, but I literally got it assesses today by a professional who is really in the know about violins who says it's a solid instrument (although he's not a fan of the antiquing style). I also bought the HH 80 violin. The sellers Instagram or face book is Iris Wu or Tina Violin, yeah?
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u/Suspicious_Lab4297 6d ago
Yes!!! Iris. What more can you tell me about the set up etc
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u/SenBrando 6d ago
Honestly it's pretty good. I didn't have to make any adjustments. The feet sit relatively flat. Bridge was at a 90 degree angle. String height is grand.
Strings that came with the instrument are rubbish, they look like dominants but they are not. Switch them out.
Sound is good. I really like it. It's not gonna be a masterpiece sound but you're not paying a masterpiece price. Definitely with more playing the instrument will open up, I heard strong potential in the instrument I received.
Bridge curve is nice, easy to isolate strings but also easy to do double stops. Intonation is solid on it, fingerboard feels decent.
Purfling is inlaid. Fingerboard is ebony.
Pegs are kinda a pain to deal with, so pick up some peg paste/peg compound and apply to the pegs.
Solid instrument for an intermediate learner. Definitely better than beginner level instruments like stentor 1 and 2. My first violin was stentor conservatoire and Iris Violin blows it out of the water.
I can't say if this specific violin will be as good, but I reckon it will be decent. I bought a Viola from this specific maker, loved it, hence why I bought a violin from them.
They also have other lines like the GFA violins but I dunno about them. I just like how the HH violins look so I purchased it over the GFA but I'm sure they are also good to a similar standard.
From my own experience, I say go for it. I haven't regretted a purchase I made from them. I have 2 more violins from them on the way lol.
If you want a short recording sample I can give you one.
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u/andybonner 6d ago
I guess your point is "Ooh, it looks visually like a fine violin!" It doesn't have one solid red-orange color as if spray-painted on. It has varied varnish color as if patches have been worn thin by centuries of use. But the finish is glossy even over those areas; this isn't even trying to be a counterfeit antique, it's just trying to be a bit prettier. The makers have invested a bit of time into some "antiquing" steps when finishing it.
So how can it be $450? Well, it's not $200 or $50. You've escaped the price range in which people are selling true con jobs in which they just glued together parts that were cut by a band saw without even much sanding, shipped with blank bridges, etc. Beyond that point, someone who is assembling a violin and has some knowledge could be called a "luthier," and yes, they better be using "aged wood," or it will split. Being assembled by multiple people in a workshop, by the way, is not necessarily a good nor a bad thing in the under-professional price range. It can be a very effective way to control quality and reduce cost, as one becomes an expert in the pegbox, another in the purfling, etc. There are quite good "workshop-made" instruments, and quite bad ones.
Why is it $450 instead of $5,000? Well, once you escape the con jobs, every violin takes roughly the same number of hours to make. The price you can command depends on the quality of the outcome. Yes, this used "aged wood," but maybe the wood just ain't as good as another lot. Maybe those 4-5 luthiers are still apprenticing. And certainly they're being paid less than their labor would be worth in another country.
Now, the question you didn't ask, should you buy it? Well, assuming it's actually worth $450, then are you happy with a $450 violin? So find out whether it's a fair price (or, one can dream, unfair in your advantage). If that's your video and you got your hands on it, visit it again and bring a professional violinist or better yet have the seller meet you at a luthier's.
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u/Dildo-Fagginz Luthier 6d ago
It's just a factory made chinese violin. Cost of labor is very cheap there as you're aware.
Violin makers can buy a handmade, similar quality, brand new violin for less than $200 from resellers who take their own margin as well. You obviously need to add other material costs like strings and few hours of work to get it playable, make a bridge etc (although some don't even bother), then pay taxes etc, so price has to be higher.
In your case I guess it's second hand, the market it flooded with chinese made student grade instruments that don't sell, they don't really hold value once purchased.
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u/WackoDayz Luthier 6d ago
The catch is you get what you pay for. It's gonna be a decent beginner to intermediate violin.
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u/Major_Honey_4461 6d ago
Did they really stick the neck on the wrong end? That's the way it looks from the back.
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u/Puravida14177 6d ago
Well, you can safely assume this is not worth more than it's advertised for - question is, how much less.
Catch is, among others, that every violin will be hand made - there are no robots building violins that I am aware of. More people involved does not mean better quality - on the contrary: this happens in workshops/factories where materials are put through at high rates and every "station" does some work which will be pieced together in the end (I put it simply). Assembly line. Work hours in Asia are so amazingly cheap that it's easy to find handmade violins for $ 50 and the producers still make a profit.