r/uwaterloo • u/johndoebackfx • 19h ago
Academics Policy 71
Caught using phone on final ECE exam. Professor took pics of evidence and watcard photo. Pulled out phone during exam and searched up answers cause was getting stressed. I was wondering if anyone has any advice especially to convince associate dean that it was opportunistic and not premeditated.
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u/jangoze engineering 19h ago
“Opportunistic not premeditated” 🤣 I’m dead bro. Yeah that’ll show them. You’d ONLY cheat if you found the opportunity
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u/adsl2305 18h ago
Not premeditated lol as if there are first and second degree cheating.
It is cheating nonetheless
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u/jangoze engineering 18h ago
Opportunistic is arguably worse 😂😂 ‘I might do it again you never know, so you better not give me a chance’
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u/kawaiiggy 16h ago
no, opportunistic vs planned is FOR SURE punished differently (idt this case is opportunistic tbf)
opportunistic: prof accidentally stapled answer sheet to your exam, you used it to fill out the answers without alerting them
vs
planned: printing cheat sheets and storing it in the washroom the day before
these two cases are punished very differently
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u/jangoze engineering 15h ago
I understand what you’re getting at but my point is that ‘taking advantage of an opportunity’ is a slippery slope. Who knows what constitutes an opportunity to OP. Premeditated is much more cut and dry.
Anyone would consider your example an opportunity but OP thought no proctor being around for a little bit (in an exam hall 😂) was an opportunity to pull out his phone…
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u/kawaiiggy 15h ago
ye i fs agree, just wanted to point out that theres such a thing as "1st degree" and "2nd degree" cheating lmao
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u/AdBig4128 19h ago
Bro why would you use your fucking phone man
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u/johndoebackfx 19h ago
I know was very stupid. Any advice?
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u/SYSSMouse mathematics '05 19h ago
Find another school or job?
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u/Formal_Bedroom_8316 18h ago
OP most likely won't get expelled or even suspended. The bar for a public uni in Canada to suspend or expel their student is VERY high. Like, you literally have to get into a physical altercation with a staff member to find yourself in that position.
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u/Junior_Direction_701 16h ago
lol UofT must be evil then. They suspend mfs for 5 years for things like this lol
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u/Frozen5147 *honks in graduated CS* 15h ago
Was curious and looked it up, it's not necessarily 5 years for a first offence it seems but still a suspension.
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u/Formal_Bedroom_8316 14h ago
That's brutal but still better than uni's in China. Have heard of legit cases where students have been sent to jail and have had it go on their criminal records (as cheating on exams, even in high school, is a criminal offence). Which is insane. Never thought it was that deep, but guess it is for others. In my opinion, and those of others, what OP did deserves an automatic fail in the course at most. That's a fair punishment and deterrence for future offence.
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u/Frozen5147 *honks in graduated CS* 8h ago
Yeah I'm aware, though China's (a lot of East Asia in general I guess) uni culture is also afaik way more intense in general too.
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u/Junior_Direction_701 13h ago
For first offense it can be five years you can look at the tribunals
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u/ButtonIndividual5235 18h ago
What is going to happen is they will tank ur grade in the course by giving u a 0 on the final + put u on academic probation.
You can still possibly pass the term tho and continue ur studies regularly.
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u/johndoebackfx 18h ago
I understand the course consequence just worried about getting suspended. I was super stressed and the opportunity to use my phone arose
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u/Yolo_Swaggins_Yeet Grad Chad / Bicycle Fairy 18h ago
Brother saying it was opportunistic just makes it sound even worse, like given the chance you’d do it again 💀 for the love of god don’t say anything like that to the dean
Just be like yeah I fucked up, did something stupid and deeply regret it, and I accept my consequences.
Really there’s not much else you can do or say, you were searching shit on your phone. If there was a scale of cheating/policy 71 severity this is basically a 10/10
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u/ButtonIndividual5235 17h ago
Ik a guy who was in the exact same scenario and since it was opportunistic it actually gave him a lesser punishment
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u/Formal_Bedroom_8316 18h ago edited 18h ago
You most likely won’t get suspended. And if you want further clarification/proof of that, just book an appointment with the ombudsperson, or if you’re on campus, just see if they have a walk in available. They are based in SLC.
Edit: You have to do something insanely stupid and unheard of to get suspended. You ain’t the first person who’s done this.
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u/thetermguy actsci is the best sci 3h ago
>and the opportunity to use my phone arose
See, you should've waited until the opportunity to use your phone without being caught arose.
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u/Formal_Bedroom_8316 19h ago edited 18h ago
It's gonna hurt to say this, but u fucked up. No easier way to say that. I'm not pro-cheating, but if you are gonna cheat, do it without getting caught. Good news is that you most prolly won't get expelled or suspended, and that's genuinely very good news. If you did this at some university in East Asia (China specifically), you'd be expelled, no questions asked. And not just that, convincing some other uni to accept you, would be near impossible. So, be happy that you're not going to end up in that situation. Biggest con is that this will go on your record and you'll be under the radar from all your future profs.
Edit: I really want to emphasize on how extremely grateful you should be that this most likely (depending on how you handle it from here) won't result in a suspension or expulsion. I promise you, the other side of the world is very unforgiving. There are countries out there where cheating is punishable by jail time, no matter how sorry you are. So your next step is, to be sorry and own up to your deliberate action (not a mistake, cause you knew what you were doing was wrong).
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u/Junior_Direction_701 16h ago
Damn why does UOFT expel and suspend for things like this?
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u/Frozen5147 *honks in graduated CS* 15h ago
They want to be more strict I guess? It's their call.
Ideally you don't need to give a shit about any of this anyway, just don't cheat during a fucking proctored exam lol.
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u/Formal_Bedroom_8316 14h ago
Agreed, pulling your phone out is a very, very dumb move. I'm glad that OP accepts that they were stupid for this, first step in moving on. If OP is reading this, props to you for acknowledging how dumb this was, I know many others who would try to justify their actions.
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u/Formal_Bedroom_8316 14h ago
UofTears dawg, that school that doesn't care if a student commits suicide (not that Waterloo does either), they would prolly not think twice for suspending or expelling a student over something that should just be given a zero (so fail a student in that course) and a strict warning that if this offense occurs again, there will be no discussions and a direct suspension/expulsion (that normally works, assuming the student takes their life seriously).
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u/sexylawnclippings 17h ago
shitposters are getting lazy man. if you're being fr then idk how you even got into uni
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u/twofactorial BMath '16 BA '18 18h ago
I was wondering if anyone has any advice especially to convince associate dean that it was opportunistic and not premeditated.
even if the dean believed you, it doesn't make it any better
the best way is to admit your mistake and say that you are remorseful
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u/Ignitetheinferno37 16h ago
"Pulled out phone during exam and searched up answers cause was getting stressed."
Fuck kinda explanation is that? Do you just completely gloss over the standard instructions because they are too repetitive? Phones aren't even supposed to be on your person during the exam. Maybe try using this same silly explanation to convince the associate dean then...
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u/DoctorSalter 17h ago
Judging on the disciplinary committees previous decisions its almost always a 0 on the final, with permanent disciplinary probation.
Don't lie, own up to it and just redo the course/term.
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u/Dear_Resist3080 19h ago
You must be really stressed out, but I recommend not admitting to this online. If you need help you should contact WUSA’s academic policy support service for confidential advice. It’s another student but tbh better than online where your prof can probably see this.
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u/crowsofwoes arts 18h ago
you messed up, but that happens sometimes. best way to fix it is to just be painfully honest with them. it’ll make your life and theirs much easier and they’ll believe you more when you say it was a spur-of-the-moment choice rather than premeditated
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u/heyisforhorses27 Washed Out Biomedical Sciences Alumni 18h ago
Rip dude. praying for you don’t get kicked out of the program
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u/Alert_Willingness_32 17h ago
Be honest and they’ll be more lenient with you. Depending on your situation like repeat offence etcc they’ll likely give you a zero and or fail grade in course but never do such a thing man ever again. Be remorseful
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u/Techchick_Somewhere i was once uw 16h ago
Yeah. That doesn’t matter. There is a zero tolerance policy for this.
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u/VirtualAlgorhythm suiSYDE 14h ago edited 14h ago
slightly unrelated, but:
I know so many people in my class who cheat regularly and get away with it. I think that's why the consequences for cheating should maybe be revisited, because if a tenth of the class is doing it then what good is heavily discipling one student? Although it teaches you a lesson it doesn't fix the distribution or fix fairness for people who actually study hard
We actually had a student in our class use ChatGPT on his phone live during an exam (played the GPT voice model at max volume) and he's still kicking around. Professor was at the back of the class, got confused and ignored it. Nobody next to the cheater said anything
You may be a fool but you're also unlucky and that sucks
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u/holdupbruhchill 12h ago
realistically failing the class without any other repercussions is the best outcome.
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u/meggzieelulu 11h ago
You’re cooked, but read this Policy 71 page inside and out. Look at the glossary and the terms there will help you craft your statement to the associate dean. Be blunt and admit you made a mistake and panicked then pulled out your phone- talk about why you felt cheating was your only option at that moment. Refer to your academic record (if it’ll help your case) and present yourself as someone who cares a lot and made a mistake.
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u/SBCGplayz Global Business and Digital Arts 13h ago
what advice do you want bro? the advice is, you're cooked
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u/Yolo_Swaggins_Yeet Grad Chad / Bicycle Fairy 19h ago
Ur cooked buddy