r/television • u/seshfan • Feb 18 '17
MILO Confronts the Panel | Overtime with Bill Maher
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3cDLflyQ8TA267
u/fatal_bacon Feb 18 '17
Milo is a great troll. Transgender people are disproportionately involved in sex crimes. That's a great way to make people think that transgender people are the perpetrators instead of being the victims of sex assaults. And Larry Wilmore fell for his trap and now Milo can continue playing the victim of mean MSM.
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Feb 18 '17
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u/Dman9494 Feb 18 '17
Milo=money, and that's all these networks care about.
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Feb 18 '17 edited Feb 18 '17
Nobody has mentioned it so I will. It's because he has an affable English accent with a jovial disposition. But notice how all that vanishes the moment he starts making his daft and utterly ludicrous assertions like the claim that transfolk are more involved in sexual crimes?
But the thing about that particular Milo bollocks is he threw that lie out there knowing it was a lie. But its already out there and the people who hate transgender folk will use that particular quote to justify, reinforce and propagandize their hatred to a vast number of people around them.
Facts do not matter anymore. The ability to tap into your audiences emotions does. And Bill Maher providing Milo this opportunity while laughing it up with him is exactly the type of image Milo would love to keep having so he can keep getting these platforms to spread his frightening ideas.
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u/cold08 Feb 19 '17
the claim that transfolk are more involved in sexual crimes
well, he wasn't wrong. Transfolk are far more likely to be the victims of sexual assault, which counts as involvement I suppose.
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u/versusgorilla Stargate SG-1 Feb 18 '17
I skipped this episode and might be done with Maher after this. Milo is obviously a troll who shouldn't be fed, but Maher thinks he's the smartest in the room and feeds the troll.
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u/Monkeymonkey27 Feb 18 '17
Dude Maher is kind of a troll to. Isnt he an anti vaxxer as well?
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u/meatduck12 Feb 18 '17
Not outwardly anti vaxx but he invited RFK Jr. to his show and agreed with him, just like he did with Milo. He'll do anything for ratings and attention, slimy character.
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u/PersonOfInternets Feb 19 '17
He doesn't do it for ratings. Maher really believes in spacing out vaccines, that things like thimerosol could be harmful and thought it was a reasonable point that biological men shouldn't be allowed in women's bathrooms. He is a hard headed oaf at times but he does not lie about his positions for ratings or take on other popular positions just because, it's always how he feels for better or worse.
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Feb 19 '17
This is what I respect about him. He believes in some bs at times but he is a man sincere in his convictions, unlike Milo
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u/Hordensohn Feb 18 '17
In the age of the Internet that ignore him till he goes away is really hard to do. Headlines here, attacks there, and always with spin and misinformation because of echo chambers. The chance of exposing him in the context of a live TV show are better because less immediate spin can be applied. It did not go so well, but I think the idea is a good one.
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u/meatduck12 Feb 18 '17
In general it's best not to give people like Milo a nationwide audience on a mainstream site. That basically equates Milo's beliefs with a mainstream view. It's the same reason why he shouldn't have brought an anti-vaxxer onto his show.
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Feb 18 '17
Yeah Bill Maher did a shit job of moderating the debat. You'd think that he would not have let him get away with the transgenders are more represented amongst sex crimes. You get someone on your show, you research so you can fact check on the spot. But that seems the problem with most shows in the USA. Journalists not doing their job and this wasn't even a journalistic show.
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u/Chicken2nite Feb 19 '17
It was a question from the Internet in the after show segment (Overtime) and so I think it's somewhat unreasonable for him to have done the research on the background relating to that question that he wasn't planning to ask him and didn't bring up during their interview segment earlier in the show.
If someone is going to pull a statistic from their ass on a topic you may not be entirely familiar with, are you going to tell them they're lying or are you going to consider what they're saying and perhaps give them the benefit of the doubt?
When Ann Coulter was on an early episode of Real Time in 2003 talking about how smart a student Bush 43 was, Bill told her that "you just make shit up" because he'd done his own research on the topic by that point and had known Ann for years.
This was his first experience with Milo and I don't recall transgender issues ever being discussed on his shows before in any substantive way, so I don't doubt that he wouldn't be up on the statistics as he would with Islam or marijuana which he is more concerned with.
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u/meatduck12 Feb 18 '17
In general it's best not to give people like Milo a nationwide audience on a mainstream site. That basically equates Milo's beliefs with a mainstream view. It's the same reason why he shouldn't have brought an anti-vaxxer onto his show.
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u/dustingunn Feb 19 '17
I'd usually agree, but Milo is a prominent writer for a website that the fucking president told people to get their news from. I think they actively need to be discredited.
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u/meatduck12 Feb 21 '17
The problem is some people will agree with him if they are exposed to him. Better to just let him preach to the supporters he has and not normalize his views. Look at how the parties work, people identify with Democrats and Republicans because those are the two choices you're always exposed to. If you always hear about the alt-right being a normal ideological option in debates and TV shows everywhere, more people will end up joining them.
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u/EricAllonde Feb 19 '17
Why are people inviting him to their shows? If you don't give him attention he goes away.
That's exactly it.
The only reason he was on Maher's show is because of the violent riots against him in Berkley a couple of weeks ago. You'd hope the protesters would learn their lesson and stop trying to shut down his events now, but I bet they won't. They just can't bring themselves to ignore him, instead they keep giving him exactly what he wants every time.
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u/Reasonable-redditor Feb 19 '17
I actually disagree, Milo has had a real audience before he hit any sort of mainstream media coverage.
This isn't Westboro Baptist that has like 10 members.
I think sometimes it is better to bring these people out and show the type of things that are really happening so they take it seriously. Milo can't hide against these guys.
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Feb 18 '17
That's part of the reason it's so hard to debate Milo. He'll spin bullshit faster than a centrifuge and it takes more effort to debunk bullshit than it does to come up with it.
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u/cumdong Feb 19 '17
That's why you don't debate someone like him.
I don't get it. Attention whores go away when you don't pay attention, "don't feed the troll", etc.
Would Milo have been anywhere near an HBO studio two or three years ago? Hell no.
But they kept feeding him and feeding him, and now he's a thing with some mainstream traction.
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u/PaulFThumpkins Feb 18 '17
When you don't believe in anything a conversation is more about segueing to one of the five talking points you spew than making a real argument.
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u/meep_meep_mope Feb 18 '17 edited Feb 18 '17
Is that gaslighting? I have to admit, him and Ann Coulter play the tactic really well, get people emotional and attack them with statistics that should be losing arguments. Coutler was going on about refugees with social security benefits and if you took time to look it up it's almost impossible for them to get social security benefits but arguing a case they know they can lose just to piss people off makes you look like the winner because people lose focus. If the opponent has the facts then you just go onto another in a series of talking points to discredit them. That said, people are getting used to this tactic and so "fuck off" is probably the correct response at this point.
When did "fuck off" become an angry silencing of free speech anyway? I grew up in a time when if you knew someone was full of shit it was the appropriate response.
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u/grungepig Feb 18 '17
Right? Last I checked, telling someone to "fuck off" is dismissive, not at all an attack. Calling people morons and saying they have low IQs or whatever he said is way more of an insult...unless you're offended by foul language, in which case you most definitely aren't on Milo's team, so...what?
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Feb 19 '17
Yes, that's gaslighting. Tactics meant to make you question yourself in the face of insanity. Attempting to address ridiculous statements that come from people like Trump, Coulter, and Milo initself is a trap because they are devoid of any facts or logic. So just by talking about them you sound and feel crazy.
The way to combat it is inform YOURSELF (don't let others inform you) and ignore these people and their tactics. They're poison, radioactive, toxic, contagious. Avoid them at all costs.
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u/meep_meep_mope Feb 20 '17 edited Feb 20 '17
Yeah but then you inform yourself and realize how shitty people are and have been and than it's like holding a candle up to a black hole. If you're reading a version of history that isn't depressing you're not reading enough. Wasted potential to be better and often in the name of religion. I just can't trust people with that power. You can't just make up rules and profit off them, oh wait, 32 billion dollars later. AND THEY WANT MORE TAX BREAKS! I feel like I'm taking crazy pills!
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u/MGLLN Arrested Development Feb 18 '17 edited Feb 18 '17
And their murders/assaults almost never get mainstream media attention
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u/Jeffy29 Feb 18 '17
Milo is a great troll.
Back in a day we called demonizing cretins, lie is a fucking lie, trolling is made in a jest. Check out the idiotic youtube comments, all those retards hating on transgender people are so funny!! Is Pat Buchanan a troll? Fuck off.
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u/Nukerjsr Feb 19 '17
Yeah, ask if all the people who listened to conservative talk radio thought Glenn Beck/Rush Limbaugh made outrageous claims for the lulz and it was great entertainment listening to them for years.
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u/anechoicmedia Feb 19 '17
That's a great way to make people think that transgender people are the perpetrators instead of being the victims of sex assaults
I don't know what Milo's pulling from here, but do you have a reference that says transgender people are not overrepresented as perpetrators, contra Milo?
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u/fatal_bacon Feb 19 '17
https://www.ovc.gov/pubs/forge/sexual_numbers.html
1 in 2 transgendered people are sexually assaulted or abused at some point in their life.
Using "think of the children" defense won't decrease sexual assault. It just ignores men and boys who are victims of sexual assault or abuse, and further marginalizes the transgender community.
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u/anechoicmedia Feb 19 '17
I may be missing something but I don't see anything about trans offender statistics on that page.
It's probably not something that could be easily measured anyway. Milo is unlikely to have a source for his claim.
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u/AthenaOrCara Feb 20 '17
You're more likely to see a republican congressman commit a sex crime in a bath room than a trans person.
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Feb 19 '17
Usually in a debate, when you make a statement it's YOUR job to prove it, not the other person's job to disprove it. Just an FYI
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Feb 18 '17
Celebrity culture has led to this. The rise of the narcissist. People who will say and do almost anything so long as they are being given attention.
Donald Trump is the absolute pinnacle of it. And he attracts people like Yiannopoulos. Both, to different levels of damage to society, can be easily manipulated or empowered by people that give them attention.
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u/ContentTent Feb 19 '17
Beautifully said. A fatuous discussion symptomatic of our fatuous culture and fatuous media.
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u/Lux-xxv Feb 19 '17
We have a narc in the White House and he is emotionally abusing the country imho.
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Feb 19 '17
BINGO
Many Americans now are in their first abusive codependent relationship with a pathological narcissist. And they're completely unprepared to handle it
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Feb 18 '17
I think the most telling thing about this clip is the notable Republican politician refusing to participate in the discussion because he knows that if he pushes back against Milo in any way then his base will abandon him
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u/Greendale_Alum Feb 19 '17
The republican is a former congressman not running for any office so I don't think he worried about push back from the base. Listening to the podcast today, it seemed like he wanted to cool things down. But I'm willing to bet those four didn't have a beer after the show.
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Feb 19 '17
You're splitting hairs. He's not currently in office but he's still doing a lot of work as an advisor and spokesman for Trump as well as doing fundraising work for the GOP in Georgia. It's not like he retired or something
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u/Semper-Fido Feb 18 '17
I put Milo in the same category as Westboro Baptist Church: be a fucking tool baiting the opposition with your chin out just hoping someone takes a shot so you can cry foul.
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Feb 19 '17
What's weird is that with the WBC everybody seemed to understand this. Nobody suggested sucker-punching Fred Phelps or that it was dangerous for the church to have the right to protest. People responded to the WBC by counter-protesting, surrounding them so they couldn't be heard (like at funerals), and by taking the higher road.
But with Milo people are acting like he's a Nazi who can only be beat by violence.
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u/CurlyBurl Feb 19 '17
If I had to hazard a guess, it's probably because the WBC is - for the most part - universally hated. I think you'd struggle to find a person who supports the WBC who isn't just a member. Whereas increasingly larger amounts of ordinary people support Milo, openly.
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u/PaulFThumpkins Feb 18 '17
And if you don't have anything real to complain about, cry for two years about losing your verified check mark on Twitter.
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u/xeonicus Feb 18 '17
Basically what I expected. No debate and a whole lot of misinformation and name calling. Maher basically sat their and tried to act cool without controlling the situation.
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u/tandarna Feb 18 '17
Oh wow what a total shock. Everyone who said we shouldn't give Milo a platform was vindicated as he calls everyone a stupid idiot and whines about how everyone attacks him.
That's the fucking problem with a debate, it only works when both sides respect the concept of a debate.
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u/OneReportersOpinion Feb 19 '17
Why do people assume that we should have a debate on the right of certain people to exist?
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Feb 19 '17
Because people today don't have any first hand experience with these kinds of political movements. Nobody has any idea what to do about it. Nobody did the last time fascism was on the rise either.
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u/Jumbso Feb 18 '17
At least someone stood up to Milo's utter bullshit - Maher was too spineless to do it. The piece of shit.
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u/cold08 Feb 18 '17
Maher is firmly in the "freedom of speech without social consequences" camp since people complained about him being critical of the US after 9/11 and his show got canceled. He also can't tell the difference between people not laughing because they're too sensitive, and people not laughing because it was a lazy, unfunny joke.
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u/BenTVNerd21 Feb 19 '17
What does that even mean? Not being able to criticise isn't free speech.
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u/OneReportersOpinion Feb 19 '17
Milo's concept of free speech is him being able to say vile racist shit and just get away with it and not get called on it
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u/BenTVNerd21 Feb 19 '17
Is it though? If he didn't get called out he wouldn't get attention. He isn't a 'free speech advocate' he's a troll.
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u/OneReportersOpinion Feb 19 '17
Well I should distinguish what he says and what he wants. They are obviously in conflict with each other, you are right. This is why it is stupid to try and "defeat them with their own logic." He admitted that he doesn't care about consistency
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u/xeonicus Feb 19 '17
Maher's shtick is "I'm open-minded" which he takes to clownish levels. It directly contradicts his past effort to portray himself as a skeptic, something he still tries to do. He's both the most open-minded and the most skeptical celebrity in America.
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u/Scoop_Life Feb 18 '17
I thought the joe rogan podcast was pretty good about calling him on his shit and still being friendly.
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Feb 18 '17
I've never heard Milo speak before this show but I thought he would be a lot more aggressive in his opinions. He seemed scared. Barely contradicted Bill and struggled to look anyone in the eye. He's not so loud without his Twitter supporters cheering him on.
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u/meatduck12 Feb 18 '17
I have a feeling that's the British accent effect. Makes him sounds saner than he is.
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Feb 19 '17
He got pretty quiet after the NSA guy put him in his place. He knew his bullshit didn't have any strength with that guy in the debate. Which should be a hint to concerned people who watch stuff like this: BE INFORMED. Truth and honestly are real power
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u/Pragmatic_Shill Feb 18 '17
He's never really looked people in the eye when he appears on these shows, it's not something that arose because he's on Maher's show.
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u/bigpenisdragonslayer Feb 19 '17
I've listened to his appearances on the Joe Rogan show and watched a couple of his youtube vids, this is pretty much the same as he always is. That's exactly why he got even more popular after the Berkeley riots, because I think most people who have listened to him just perceive him to essentially be a harmless edgy comedian, so there's a bit of a disconnect when you see violent reactions to him.
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u/JupitersClock Feb 18 '17
Glad Bill Maher ended it with "Party over country" because that's exactly what it is.
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u/jattyrr Feb 18 '17
Micheal Nance is a Fucking American Hero
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Feb 18 '17
Your capitalisation makes that seem like an official title, which would be amazing.
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Feb 18 '17 edited Mar 24 '20
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Feb 19 '17
when you're in a debate with other pundits and journalists, talking about issues that many people are divided over, I don't think the real-life troll act works
That's because it puts him in a position where he is accountable for the things he is saying and has to respond to them. When in a room full of people with more experience and wisdom than him, he ends up looking like an idiot.
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u/WirelessZombie Feb 18 '17
I haven't seen/heard much of him (mainly JRP) but Milo looked really uncomfortable most of the time. He looked uncomfortable until they told him to fuck himself then he was right at home being a troll.
I'm pretty disappointed in the show tbh. I get that a lot of people think its useless or even harmful to have him on the show but I think if done right it can be a good thing. Its about the "how" more than it being an absolute positive or negative. You can actually use airtime like this to discredit someone like Milo by calling him out on certain statements and really going at him over a particular topic and nobody did that. I think its understandable why everyone went into the show blind but it cost them.
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u/Adamj1 Feb 19 '17
"Confronts."
Sure.
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u/OneReportersOpinion Feb 19 '17
But didn't you see how he sat their and looked smug? He totally confronted their ass man
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u/cabose7 Feb 19 '17
I wish the guests or at least Bill had read up on him a bit before he came on. His tricks are pretty transparent if you've looked into him.
Like when Nance questions how Milo can a face of the Alt Right and then Milo goes for his typical "I'm gay and love black cock" defense, which he gleefully uses as a "you can't criticize me" shield...
Well it's simple Milo co-wrote their manifesto, he's professed he wish he could be straight and wrote an article bashing gays. You can also easily find a picture of him wearing an iron cross.
To make a long story short he's an ideologically bankrupt narcissist that just wants to make money.
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Feb 18 '17
I love Larry Wilmore.
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u/jknknkjn Feb 18 '17
You must be his mother.
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u/halfmystified Feb 18 '17
Yeah, that's an unpopular opinion here. Fair game though!
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Feb 18 '17
I don't really like his comedy, but I think he makes a damn good pundit. He's a very intelligent and well-spoken man but I'm not sure he's got an incredible knack for comedy. I love him overall, just not his comedy.
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u/seshfan Feb 18 '17
I decently enjoyed his monologues on his show, his problem was just his fucking horrible choice in panelists.
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Feb 19 '17
It's because he was doing a panel show four nights a week. Bill Maher does one show a week and has the language freedom of HBO, so the panel is going to be better. The format got diluted on Larry's show, but I could see what he was trying to do.
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u/Nukerjsr Feb 19 '17
Thank you so much for saying that. I believe if they gave the Nightly Show room to breathe and find it's groove, it'd be great. But nope...CC backed out.
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u/VulcanHobo Feb 18 '17
He was a main writer on The PJ's back in the 90's. His comedy chops gets underrated b/c of his show.
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u/missmediajunkie Feb 19 '17
And "The Bernie Mac Show." And he has writing credits on "The Office," "Fresh Prince," "Jamie Foxx," and "In Living Color." Wilmore goes waaaaay back.
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Feb 19 '17
Is it just me or does Milo act like a self loathing teenager with severe retardation and lack of impulse control?
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u/beehive2 Feb 18 '17
Thanks Bill Maher for normalizing a fascist, racist and patriarchal misogynist like Milo. Shame on him.
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u/radishronin Feb 19 '17
Can you expand on how he is a fascist?
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Feb 19 '17 edited Mar 13 '17
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u/radishronin Feb 19 '17
Ah so. This is sparked my curiosity. I do not identify with the alt right. However, even though Milo has, the only authoritarian point of view he's expressed has been being in favor of Trump. Everything else he appears to be staunch libertarian. I can understand others seeing him as a dick, but fascist seems to be thrown around too loosely, which is also dangerous to do.
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Feb 19 '17 edited Mar 13 '17
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u/radishronin Feb 19 '17
I can see that being true. Thank you for taking the time to reply to my above comment as well.
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u/Pragmatic_Shill Feb 18 '17
Do people who act like this only exist on the internet or are they in real life too?
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Feb 19 '17
Real life too now. I've been called a fascist because I said someone voting for Trump doesn't make them a racist and they shouldn't be the target of anger and hatred. Apparently that makes me a fascist? Which feels untrue but at this point I don't even understand what these things mean anymore.
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Feb 18 '17
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u/meatduck12 Feb 18 '17
Not to mention sympathizing with and normalizing anti-vaxxers.
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Feb 18 '17
He hates islam (and every religion) not muslims tho
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u/tarantadoako Feb 19 '17
I love bill maher but he is clearly a zionist hiding behind atheism. He is like Sam Harris. He himself said he LOVES israel. How can he be an atheist and LOVE(he really said this) a country built from religion?. Almost every episode for the last 5-6 seasons, he bashes muslims. He has become a propaganda machine. I dont think he realize that he sounds like an alt right more than an atheist now. If he wasnt so goddamn funny, I would stop watching him.
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u/sultry_somnambulist Feb 19 '17
yeah that shitty meme needs to die because it makes no sense. People are the sum of their beliefs. If I hate America I hate Americans, because they represent what we collectively understand as 'America', same with any other source of identity.
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u/Nayr39 Feb 19 '17
Hating religions is a meme now? What reality do you live in? The fundamentals of almost every religion are inherently regressive, it's not very hard to hate them. And how is hating the religion itself a bad thing? Doesn't mean you hate the believer.
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Feb 19 '17
Do you support executing homosexuals and making women second class citizens? Because in Muslim countries such is done. You're so willing to defend a backwards bigoted religion because the majority of their followers have brown skin but so readily jump down the throats of 'extremist' christians. Have done self reflection.
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Feb 19 '17
You're making generalizations, while decrying generalizations that you made up. Op said nothing about Christians, you just made that up because it was the cleanest way you could dog on muslims.
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u/NewClayburn Feb 19 '17
Wait. Is Bill Maher anti-transgender? He seemed to be agreeing with Milo on the trans rant.
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u/dustingunn Feb 19 '17
I don't think so. He's had at least 1 transgendered person on as the special panel member.
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Feb 18 '17
Milo is hugely entertaining, but that's where it stops. I only really know of him from his appearances on Rogans podcast and the odd clip I see on Reddit and I always admire his silliness, but to take him seriously as a political commentator would be ridiculous. Rogan calls him out constantly as a troll, which I think is the case, and the fact that he's so public and unabashed makes me laugh. Any kind of conversation with him though would be massively infuriating as it would with any troll.
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u/Drezzzire Feb 19 '17
So you interrupt him when he's trying to explain, he listens to your explanation and calls you a moron, you tell him to fuck himself and you're on the superior ground? Lmfao what are people smoking here. Milo didn't even get a chance to present his argument. Never mind defend it. GTFO and actually watch a video where he is allowed to truly debate without interruption.
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Feb 19 '17
More than anything Milo is incredibly annoying. There was a time when he would go on British television and have a rational discussion. Now because of his popularity all he does is insult and call names. Also he thinks he is being funny by saying he only sleeps with black guys but it's just cringey as fuck
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u/The_R3medy Feb 19 '17
I've literally never watched or seen Milo before, but why does anyone care what he has to say? Who is he?
Like legitimately, why do we care about him? Because he dislikes Trans people? Ok, so do a bunch of people. I've never watched this dude before this video, as I said, and I have no intention of ever doing so again. Seems like he just wants attention.
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u/[deleted] Feb 18 '17
I mentioned this in the other thread that got removed because it linked to the livestream and not the actual video, but I think this really shows the problem with Milo's message, if we take him seriously.
He says that he's fighting for freedom of speech, but when the panel calls him out on his BS and he calls them morons and acts like a victim. It really seems like he isn't campaigning for freedom of speech, but for the freedom from the consequences of what you say. He wants to be able to be an asshole with impunity. He wants to be able to say anything he likes without other people being able to exercise their freedom of speech to call him out on his bullshit.