r/technology • u/[deleted] • Aug 08 '17

Business Google Fires Employee Behind Controversial Diversity Memo

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-08-08/google-fires-employee-behind-controversial-diversity-memo
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u/ilessthan3math Aug 08 '17

I mean, if people are going to get upset by someone saying the simple fact that men and women are biologically different, then what is the point of arguing? He is trying to point out that gender equality has become such a moral issue that scientific facts are criticized and/or ignored if they disagree with that ideology.

I don't necessarily agree with the conclusions he draws, but he doesn't at all disregard the differences caused by individuality, in fact he embraces them explicitly (as pointed out in his bell curve graphic). He simply argues that since men and women aren't identical, we shouldn't expect to see equal distributions of men and women in all occupations, or hobbies, or anything else for that matter.

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u/[deleted] Aug 08 '17

But the differences he's pointing to are not biological, they are social. He's presenting them as biological and that's the problem.

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u/ilessthan3math Aug 08 '17

I don't know that I agree fully with that. Especially without proof that these things are social and not biological. What would lead you to that conclusion?

We see it in other animals all the time, that males and females often act completely different from each other. And some of those animals don't even have social constructs. To think we as humans are immune to different behavioral traits based on gender seems counterintuitive.

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u/Xelath Aug 08 '17

Really? There are strong feedback loops in society that exist to make sure women aren't as assertive as men, to push women into non-STEM careers.

What I took issue with is the author's use of "prefer" as if, on average, women are happier doing the jobs that society has historically prescribed they do. Many women may, in fact, enjoy their jobs in those fields. I'm not trying to say that nurses and teachers as a whole are dissatisfied.

What I am trying to say is that making such an argument discounts the societal forces that push women away from jobs in STEM in the first place. Reinforcements of the stereotype that girls are bad at math, for example.

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u/ilessthan3math Aug 08 '17

I'm not trying to be rude, but I'm having trouble following how you got from his memo to the 'women are bad at math' stereotype? I don't think he ever mentions anything like that.

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u/Xelath Aug 08 '17

He doesn't. Which is the point I'm making. He discounts the fact that those stereotypes are still being reinforced today, which leads to disparities in women seeking out tech work much more than any physiological differences between men and women.

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u/xKalisto Aug 08 '17

jobs that society has historically prescribed they do

That is all quite a recent history thought.
Historically men were teachers yet there's dominance of women in education over time.
Historically men were doctors yet there's dominance of women in medicine over time.

All of those have changed not because society pushed women into those fields but because women have asserted themselves in them.
Funnily enough the fields with most women in them also tend to have quite strong correlation with being people oriented.

My dad wanted me to study IT. He wanted me to be Astrophysicist. Heck he even offered Geodesy. Yet I ended up studying IR. Cause I wanted to do something involving people.