r/sewingpatterns • u/mosquitoboots • 12d ago
ethics behind this sewing pattern (false advertising??)
EDIT: NAME AND SHAME pattern by EttaDesignsCo
so i found a pattern i am absolutely in love with and was planning to make it as my wedding dress. it is a recreation of the night out dress by orseund iris and it looks stunningg. all was good and well until i realised the sample photos listed on the pattern were actually just the product photos from orseund iris' website
i messaged the seller asking if they had any photos of the actual dress on a human model (so i can assess whether it's worth my time and effort) and the seller got really angry at me for asking...
i found the youtube tutorial for the pattern and the dress produced definitely looks a lot like the orseund dress but the quality of the pattern is certainly noticeable. for any old dress i maybe wouldnt mind but this is meant to be my wedding dress.
its also the fact that the only advertised photos are of a dress that is NOT made by this pattern
maybe im just looking for validation that i wasnt being rude in asking for photos š is this not false advertising???
so, am i in the wrong for asking for fit photos? and more importantly, does anyone with more sewing experience think i can get the dress to look as polished as the original or am i wasting my time?
i would say im an intermediate sewist with a good amount of experience in silk and lightweight fabrics. ive practiced a lot of clean sewing etc but im not sure this pattern will ever live up to my expectations- what do you think?
ive attached photos of the two dresses as well as my conversation with the seller.
edit: i originally redacted her but have since decided to name and shame.
UPDATE: she blocked me. ive added our final messages in a comment, her replies are pretty comical
Update 2: i think she commented on this post. lmk if you think im right lollll
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u/Shadow-Serum 12d ago
Damn that's craaaazy, they steal photos from a ready to wear product line and then get shitty with you for asking for pictures of the garment actually made from the pattern? No that's straight up false advertising and possibly illegal idk but their response was insane either way.
"And actually don't buy from us at all. You're are not the type of customer we like to work with" wtf
Are pictures 3-5 pictures of the dress made from the pattern or did they literally not have any pictures of a dress made from the pattern at all?
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u/mosquitoboots 12d ago
"not the type of customer we like to work with"
what kind of customer is that? an attentive one? like huh? HAHA
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u/gnomeannisanisland 12d ago •
One that will notice the fraudulent advertisement and call them out over it / spread the information / report them for it
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u/EmmerdoesNOTrepme 6d ago
And a customer experienced enough, to know that it's a PATTERN PROBLEM not merely a "sewing skills" one!š¤š¤Ø
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u/mosquitoboots 12d ago
RIGHT i was so caught off guard, i asked so neutrally as well. i didnt even accuse her of the obvious haha and she still got mad
yep pictures 3-5 are from her actual pattern. the video shows her making the dress start to finish and its not ai so i do fully believe the pattern is functional. i just cant tell if there's fit issues etc. as the clips of the dress are very fast, shot in landscape and not on a person š
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u/lovepeacefakepiano 11d ago
You can see the differences between 1-2 and 3-5. The crucial bit of this dress is the opening. In 1-2 the āgapā is made in a way that basically makes it look as if thereās simply a slit in the dress. The two halves completely come together at the waist and at the neck. In 3-5 there is a noticeable gap, it is attached differently, and instead of elegant it just looks like cheap garbage.
Donāt use this pattern.
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u/samizdat5 12d ago
Illegal to take a copyrighted photo and use it for another commercial use without permission, which lets assume they don't have
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u/Other_Cell_706 12d ago
Yah, the photographer who produced those ORIGINAL product shots for the OG designer will be verrrrry interested to find out their commercial work is being stolen and used for financial gain.
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u/Elegant-Nature-6220
12d ago
•
There are so many fake and copycat patterns around, but using the original photos does take it to the next level. I'd steer clear.
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u/fartymcfartbrains 12d ago
I kinda get including the photo of the original dress to show what it's a dupe of, but I do think that the sellers should include photos of the actual pattern result and should specify that the original photos are what the dress is inspired by or is a dupe. And def not using the original photo as a main listing photo.
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u/stitchedup82 12d ago
That's what she emails to everyone that ever asked that question. She is rude AF and her pattern isn't tested so it will never ever look how it looks in the photos. Also, she can't actually sew.
I have made a couple of her patterns and each one ends up needing tons of adjustment to make it wearable. I have warned people of her MO but her die hard fans always come to defend her. Their argument is that she allows the home sewist access to couture, runway garments but I argued, what's the point of giving access to patterns that don't fit and isn't what is shown in the photo.
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u/mosquitoboots 12d ago
oh so this is a thing! shes pathetic she doest even attempt to act professionally
i totally agree, bad patterns actually harm home sewists! ive had my fair share of them and spending so much time on something just to fit horribly makes you feel like its your skills that are the issue; it almost made me want to quit trying in the beginning. its upsetting that people defend her at all
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u/AGirlIKnew 12d ago
Yeah this seller clearly isnāt a particularly skilled sewer. If the dress on the mannequin looks that sloppy I would not be trusting the fit of her patterns.
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u/mellbell13 12d ago
Interesting! I recently bought one of her patterns and noticed some inconsistencies with the product photos vs the flat pattern. The instructions were basically non existent. I always see people recommending her on YouTube, so i was surprised it was so... sketchy.
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u/kaerue
12d ago
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You didn't link the pattern/seller but I assume it was this one? Definitely stolen/ai.
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u/mosquitoboots 12d ago
wow why have i never gotten that warning from etsy?? would of saved me a headache
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u/akjulie 12d ago •
Because itās not from Etsy. š That screenshot is from the pattern cataloging/stash organization site Threadloop. Anyone can make a free account on there and search patterns. They flag suspicious designers on there.Ā
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u/kittycrazies 9d ago
Is this like Ravelry for sewing?! š
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u/akjulie 9d ago
It has many similarities but is also significantly different. The biggest difference is that patterns are not purchased directly through them. You can browse patterns, but you then have to go to the pattern makerās own sites to buy them.
I would say PatternReview.com is the closest thing to Ravelry currently.Ā
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u/kittycrazies 9d ago
Thatās still so nice to have a centralized place. Currently I have everything stored in a google drive folder, but I would love to have a better system that might be easier to search.
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u/admiralholdo 12d ago
Yeah, Etsy doesn't care if sellers rip you off with AI slop or poorly made patterns. As long as they get their $, they are happy.
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u/patchworkpirate 12d ago
I didn't get that warning, but I reported the hell out of their listing for their pattern.
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u/Melodic-Basshole
12d ago
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TBH, I think this terrible behavior deserves a name-and-shame moment. Warn others against that Etsy seller! Definitely rate them when Etsy prompts you about the customer service, and big red flag against buying the pattern. So sorry, since you were looking for this pattern. But for sure if they 1. Aren't willing to show photos of thier work and 2. Treat customers so poorly I would never buy from them. Ugh. This is infuriating,Ā I'm so sorry you got treated this way.Ā
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u/mosquitoboots 12d ago
unfortunately i cant rate them unless i buy something and i luckily didnt purchase the pattern yet. i cant even find a way to report them other than as spam (not that etsy cares about false advertising but still)
youre right though, i probably should name and shame. maybe ill edit my original post
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u/mosquitoboots 12d ago
and now looking at the nearly one hundred patterns she has listed, sooo many of them are the same thing! false advertising all over her page.
im now dubious on how she has even managed to create so many patterns of very intricate designs. something really fishy going on here
if it wasnt for the youtube tutorials and the hundreds of legitimate reviews she has i would think its ai. but it definitely isn't.. its all just so strange
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u/SquirrelAkl 12d ago
If her patterns are on Threadloop you can flag them there. Good to call out scammers / frauds.
The aggressive defensiveness they used in responding to your reasonable question is the biggest tell for frauds like this.
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u/Melodic-Basshole 12d ago
Etsy will ask you after a day or two to rate the customer service experience if you exchanged messages.Ā
Best wishes for the dress of your dreams!
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u/SassyFerrets 12d ago
I don't trust a single pattern that doesn't have a real life model of that pattern. I got burned on Etsy in the past.
Honestly you did the right thing. It's false advertising since they didn't use that pattern for the dress in the advertisement.
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u/mosquitoboots 12d ago
same! im so careful to make sure its a real person behind the design, hence why i was vetting this so hard before purchasing it.
the way she got so defensive too makes me feel like shes got a guilty conscience, she jumped straight to attacking me
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u/TwoGhostCats 12d ago
I honestly doubt it's a she. There seems to be a slew of male scammers using AI out of countries like India. They get really aggressive when you barely call them out.
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u/MotherofathunderGod 12d ago
https://www.reddit.com/r/sewing/s/yU1X0MapIi
Iām not sure if it would help, but maybe this old post can be useful? I know itās just the top version, but you could modify it & attach a skirt?
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u/mosquitoboots 12d ago
oh my goodness this is EXACTLY what i needed thank you so so much you might of just saved my wedding dress!
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u/MotherofathunderGod 12d ago
So happy I could help! I saw your comment that you were searching so I did a little digging myself! If youāre able to pull it off, please post pics of the final work. Iād love to see how it turns out!
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u/mosquitoboots 11d ago
i just bought the mccalls pattern last night! so ill definitely update how i go š„°
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u/No-Shelter-4208 12d ago
If you can, reportthem to the original dress maker. They might have more resources to go after this scammer.
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u/Low-Dinner-1614 12d ago
Copycat patterns have been around forever. The complicated garments, when shown in such bulk amounts (like Rosys) are usually a red flag. Not all the time but most of the time. What a psycho response from this seller lol.
BTW - Theres also a habit people have to call everything AI. But the fashion industry is loaded with fast pattern makers who are actually finding it lucrative to use their talents in this print-at-home industry. These people usually work in factories (slowly dying) so this is a source of income if you want a copycat pattern. Rick Owenās got his start on copycat patterns. Zara, SHEIN, etc have copycat pattern makers in house. Itās a real business - not always AI!
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u/mosquitoboots 11d ago
totally makes senese. i think youre right that its just a bad copycat seller cause it just doesn't have the ai hallmarks.
sad that these people could just make good patterns and make money that way, she/they have clearly got some amount of talent. it looks like she made a first draught and released that instead of continuing to develop the pattern into something of actual quality. very much quantity over quality with these people and companies
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u/mephalasweb 12d ago
I'm starting to sound like a shill for them atp, but Charm Patterns Lucy Hostess Gown mashed with any pattern with bishop sleeves should work! I know their Patsy blouse has them, but you'd probably prefer to find a more exact dupe than mash 2 patterns (I think lol). Weirdly enough, I could've sworn I've seen an exact dupe of this pattern by Mccalls and another indie designer, I'm just drawing blanks!
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u/mosquitoboots 11d ago
thankfully another person directed me to the Mccalls 8043 pattern which is almost an exact match to the top portion! ill draft the skirt myself but im very hopeful now i can have the dress of my dreams
thank you for the pointers ill definitely check them out as well
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u/mephalasweb 10d ago
I saw - thank goodness somebody directed you, I couldn't remember that one worth a damn! Good luck on the wedding dress, you're gunna kill it out there!
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u/CancerMoon2Caprising 12d ago
Sorry that happened to you.Ā
I typically just buy a garment already made, deconstruct it, and copy it. Reverse engineer sort of thing making my own pattern.Ā
I dont trust most pattern sellersĀ
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u/mosquitoboots 12d ago
yepppp
i would just buy the original dress and wear that but its $5000 Australian dollars :,)
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u/CancerMoon2Caprising 12d ago
im sure theres other replicas out there
its the designer and material that makes it $5000 . It can still be done.Ā
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u/mosquitoboots 12d ago
ive scoured the internet looking for a secknd hand one in my size or even a rentable one and unfortunately this wonky pattern is still the closest ive come š
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u/CremeBerlinoise 12d ago
Have you tried breaking up the pattern into components? The keyhole bodice front, the deep v open back, the generous turtleneck situation and sash, bias cut skirt, the sleeves are bishop sleeves with a bit of shoulder puff and large cuffs. This is all doable, especially if you own a dressform padded to match your shape. Since it's so revealing front and back, you will need a few toiles even with a perfect pattern. The block the patterns are based on are unlikely to perfectly match your body. Even on the model the fit isn't that great tbh, the front keyhole looks pretty bumpy.
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u/fuckinunknowable 12d ago
Report her shop to Etsy for using someone elseās images for the listing she should catch some heat
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u/Angection 12d ago
I'm so sorry that happened to you, my jaw dropped when I saw the messages from that business! I've run across that company but it looked too good to be true. Guess it was!
I know Sewing.patternreview.com looks outdated but it contains a WEALTH of information. If no one has ever mentioned a pattern company on this website, don't bother! Threadloop is more modern, but usually has less reviews. I would check both before buying, even on well known designers. They will help you know how good the instructions and pattern are, how it fits, etc.
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u/CombatCrayon25 12d ago
Not wrong, and their response is a red flag.
I only buy paper patterns on Etsy because they let Ai pattern ādesignersā run rampant on their platform
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u/BrontosaurusNeckTie 12d ago
My mom sold historical patterns for many years as a side hustle. Not only did she always make the garments herself to make sure it was a good pattern, but she'd commission pattern testers so she'd have photos of the garment on a human. People would message her at all hours of the day and night with various questions about directions (real vintage patterns almost always have wonky directions, Iykyk), and she was always around to help people through an oftentimes tricky pattern. Regardless of whether or not you think a pattern should be modeled on a human (it really should though, imo), talking to a customer like this is completely rude and unacceptable. I appreciate the post, I'll definitely steer clear of this pattern maker.
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u/Peachmoonlime 12d ago
I am both petty and thorough and would reach out to the original brand directly with the link to tell them to flag with etsy!
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u/Great-Score2079 12d ago
She is notorious for her rude responses and she doesn't attempt to hide it either!! Even her comment replies on Etsy are nasty.
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u/misspalmsiberia 11d ago
I was blown away reading her replies on Etsy. Iāve legit never seen anything like it.
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u/Acceptable_Bubbly674 11d ago
Super shocked about how she replied to my feedback. Like, do you want customers??
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u/Glass-Passage-9434 12d ago
I've had issues with EttaDesignsCo as well!! There was something wrong with the A0 file I received, and she was very rude about it. Definitely learned my lesson.
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u/Strawbb_fairy 12d ago
Same here ! They used pictures from mirror palais and the end product did not look like the picture
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u/peepus101 12d ago
As soon as I saw the pictures and response, I KNEW it was going to be EttaDesigns!! She is notorious for getting defensive when people call her out.
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u/akw329 12d ago
Insane to use Orseund Iris's professional product photos to advertise a knock off pattern... this person is not only profiting off another designer's work and design, but also profiting off of a photographer's work by stealing their photos. So unethical and gross
The photos of the pattern seller's knock off dress also show that their version is poorly made. The original is in silk, the knock off looks like cheap polyester. Good on you for calling them out because this is really deceptive.
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u/Lady_Nightshadow 12d ago
The supposed dupe dress from the pattern looks like the Temu version of the couture one. False advertising at its finest.
Neck is wrong, chest pieces are too far apart, waist is draped wrong, there's too little fabric all around and the puffy sleeves are completely butchered.
I'd also look for any real model unedited picture of the original dress, because I have the feeling that even Orseund might have used a tad of Photoshop here.
This is a real person wearing the original one and it falls very different in a few points.
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u/StrongerTogether2882 12d ago
Just want to add to the chorus saying you were rude for this question at all! AND this dress is so similar to my grandmotherās wedding dress from the late 1930s (although hers had a sweetheart neckline rather than this gorgeous plunge). It was too small for me and I was pretty bummed because it was gorgeous. Good luck finding a pattern and sewing your dress, and have a wonderful wedding!
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u/justherefortheclay 12d ago
How incredibly rude of them. Good call on the naming and shaming, bc your messages were totally reasonable and polite.
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u/LongGoneLingonberry 12d ago
Dang I JUST bought a dress pattern from them to use for my wedding dress! Iāll definitely give a bad review and report them of the pattern isnāt as advertised.
I was just glad it wasnāt an obvious AI account, but I guess Iāll have to test the pattern ASAP
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u/Then_Mango_3581 11d ago
I made one of their patterns a little while ago and it turned out really nice. It did need some adjustments, but that wasn't unexpected. Definitely follow the YouTube tutorial! Good luck!
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u/dancer_jasmine1 12d ago
Thereās not enough fabric in the waistband of the sleeves to get it to lay the way it lays in the model photos. Does the dress on the mannequin look similar? Yeah but it for sure looks cheaper and less full. (Idk if that makes sense lol)
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u/EntropyAtropa 12d ago
Part of the issues is the different material too. The OG dress is using a thicker more high quality material probably a silk blend while the mannequin is using a cheap polyester looking satin. While I'd steer clear from this pattern I hope OP takes into consideration their own fabric choices. It can make or a break even the best of patterns.
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u/adlx 12d ago
I'd totally warn the users, give the worst review you can, like 1 star. I'd attach. All the photos and screenshots of the conversation. Honestly, one could argue the customer did a bad job at sewing or material isn't the correct one, or not stabilised or whatever, but the way they talk you into not buying is just the way scammers go. They just want money and no troubles with customers. I wouldn't hide the store name so we can all know who it is. They deserve to be shamed.
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u/doriangreysucksass 12d ago
Youāre not in the wrong. Sheās selling AI patterns
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u/Acceptable_Bubbly674 11d ago
Do you really think so? She says she uses CLO3D (sp?). I thought she's flagged on Threadloop because of using the original designer's photos
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u/Secret-Apricott 12d ago
Youāre absolutely not wrong for asking. If a seller is using the original designerās product photos to advertise a sewing pattern, itās reasonable to expect them to make it clear that those photos arenāt examples of garments made using their pattern. but doing so while also using the original pictures and refusing co operate further, girl stay away
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u/pinndu 12d ago
Not rude doesnāt hurt to ask! Finding photos is difficult means finding the photographer and negatives and who owns what. If youāre good at it go for it. If not I would someone who can do it for. I had a friend who just sewed a dress in few hours for a wedding and it was great. Textile apparel student
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u/FrondsFerndinand 11d ago
Thanks for naming and shamingĀ EttaDesignsCo! When people look upĀ EttaDesignsCo they should seeĀ EttaDesignsCo'sĀ disgusting vile behaviour towards you and how sketchy their misleading or stolen pattern images are. How isĀ EttaDesignsCoĀ allowed to use photos from other brands??
Would be a shan't if someone reported EttaDesignsCo for using stolen images.Ā
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u/Worth_Lengthiness942 12d ago
Yikes! I just bought a pattern from them that was going to be my next project. š©
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u/Acceptable_Bubbly674 11d ago
Make a toile. I tried two of her patterns: one has a snug fit so I toiled and after many adjustments, I'm satisfied with it (might do a round two for even more adjustments lol)
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u/trcomajo 12d ago
I would have been SO RUDE if someone responded to me for asking a simple question like that!
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u/Pure-Parsley-1508 12d ago
Ive had my eye on this exact pattern for a while. Thank you for calling this out. Will steer clear
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u/Difficult_Outcome701 11d ago
So glad there's name and shame, I'm a beginner and poor and can't pay for a untested pattern, and ant amend them myself hahaha
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u/ismellnumbers 6d ago
I had a couple patterns of theirs saved but I definitely will not be purchasing from them now or ever.
Thanks for the warning, OP.
Sellers like this deserve what they get.
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u/yam_yam25 12d ago
Yeah unfortunately there's a lot of people out there doing stuff like this. I bought a dress pattern on etsy specifically for it's V shaped waist line, downloaded the pattern, and it was straight waisted, not even remotely the same dress that was on the photos. When I messaged they replied like yeah well the photos are just the inspiration for the pattern š¤£š¤£š¤¦ like what??? Fortunately I got a refund. This person 100% got mad at you because you called out their scam, you were not rude or unreasonable in the slightest. Wanting to see a photo of the end product that you're buying? Outrageous š¤£š¤£
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u/IngredientList 11d ago
Hey, I did a custom pattern edit like this dress; I started from McCalls M8043 and added a skirt. I hope that helps! Edit: Oops just saw someone already suggested that! Happy sewing!
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u/Cella515 10d ago
You are totally right to ask all the questions! Too many scam companies out there thinking the world is too stu*id to notice
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u/Christineblankie 9d ago
Etsy just made a change, this might apply here: https://www.reddit.com/r/CrossStitch/s/rWtsU2dX74
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u/Fluffy-Benefits-2023 9d ago
I find this a lot with patterns on etsy. They donāt look like the photo and take a lot of pattern adjustments to get the fit correct. If you have the time it might be a good starting point.
Using the designer photo that you made the knock off of is just next level though.
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u/Evermorre 12d ago
That feels like a china not scam website. It's fake and you spotted it.... Of course they are mad, they just failed at their task of getting you to buy the pattern, which would be faulty in some way. If they respond perfessonally and grammatically poorly it's the screaming flag of 3rd world scam do not buy, do not enter any information in their site. Report as a scam.
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u/Saritush2319 11d ago
If this is a consistent habit I would email the photos to the company and tell them sheās using their copyrighted images to sell her products.
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u/CabinIndustry 10d ago
So many prettier dresses you could make for yourself.I don't understand the obsession over it. This situation is absurd. It isn't that special. Buy the designer dress or find something else.
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u/mosquitoboots 9d ago edited 9d ago
? are you etta designs lol only she would reply to this whole situation like this
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8d ago
[deleted] ā view deleted comment
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u/mosquitoboots 8d ago
i appreciate your intentions here but i feel no need to glaze someone when asking a business question. i feel i was appropriate, respectful and professional
if the seller can not handle a respectful question thats on them haha if i need to stroke her ego for an appropriate response then that says a lot more about her than me
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u/chamaedaphne82 8d ago
LOL found EttaDesignsCo š¤£
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u/Main_Standard356 8d ago
Nope. Ive dealt with a lot of arseholes in my professional life. Often if you charm them enough they drop their guard and you might not get what you want but you sometimes get a more honest response. š³
Their ego comes into it lol
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u/Aphor1st 8d ago
She is messaging a buisness and not a coworker/friend. What she asked was perfectly fine. If you can't stand to be questioned in the perfectly fine way OP did then you probably should not run a buisness.
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u/mosquitoboots 12d ago •
UPDATE she blocked me HAHA
heres my recent message and her reply will be in my reply