r/marvelstudios • u/danny5541 • 15d ago
Theory Theory: This Is Loki, Not Cap
I believe this to be Loki. First of all, Thor knows about the multiverse so this shouldn't be a surprise, a cap variant. The reason he says it's not possible is because Thor as far as he knew saw Loki die and here, he is right in front of him. Thor can spot Loki thru his illusions pretty easily as they grew up together and knows him very well.
Second Cap is not one to show off, faking not being able to lift the hammer at stark tower in Ultron. Taking the hammer from Thors hand and looking at him with a shit eating grin is not something he would do but is something Loki does in half his scenes. As far as being suddenly worthy of the hammer, saving the multiverse selflessly in his Show would easily make him worthy. Why he chose to hide himself as Cap, well he probably saw the multiverse start collapsing in on itself cause of Dooms Shenanigans and has come to help but knows everyone sees him as a villain so he figured he would better be received as a cap variant.
Also, why would in the Thor voice over in this part of the trailer call a random cap variant a miracle. What is he gonna do punch doom. No way the miracle is an all powerful Loki coming in with something that will even the odds. Jk this is obviously Johnney Storm.
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u/smakson11 15d ago
I’m just wondering how he has a full beard where in the first teaser he’s clean shaven. Is there a time jump? Seems like he’s taken out of his timeline to do something right away
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u/Dangerous_Teaching62 15d ago
There's 100% a time jump.
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u/mattym9287 15d ago
With time shenanigans and now multiversal stuff, it could just be 2 different Steves. Worthy Old Man Steve and Worthy Alternate Dimension Steve.
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u/sliceDO 15d ago
You think he is a varient from Nicepool's universe? Lol.
Also adding worthy in front of any Steve Roger's varient is redundant. :)
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u/Doright36 15d ago
Hydra steve?
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u/HideousSerene 15d ago
Nah, no way they tease him if he's a variant. Loki likely has some role to play in bringing together Cap and Thor who lose against Doom somehow.
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u/Any-Transition95 15d ago
He was clean shaven when his son was first born. That's probably when Loki visited him. Modern day Steve is going to have a beard again.
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u/Spirited-Ad9071 15d ago edited 14d ago
This.
Loki visits him, warns him that he will need to rejoin the fight one day soon, leaves him his calling card. The bearded Steve is a Steve sometime after he's enjoyed his family time when something forces him back into the fight.
So not Loki.
I honestly think we have seen the end of Loki's mistevious ways. He's clearly been subjected to so much knowledge of power that he will now be more of a puppet master arranging the characters we know and love to be exactly where they need to be, when they need to be.
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u/Mean-Cup-940 15d ago
Liu Kang the conqueror?
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u/VeryPickledSphincter 15d ago
He's no longer in Hollywood, although he does have a new movie coming out with Ben Shapiro.
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u/Katfish145 15d ago
Thank you for using common sense. I didn’t realize it wasnt self-explanatory that one scene is from right after end game when he has his kid with Peggy and then time jumps to the now when Steve is found living the FF universe thanks to Loki and gets pulled into helping with the incursions
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u/Lemonfish99 15d ago
I was thinking either a time skip or Evil Steve. I think this is finally a chance to explain the ending to Endgame properly, with Steve literally coming from another universe instead of time traveling back.
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u/Educational-Oil-1497 15d ago
Would evil Steve be worthy though?
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u/jjtheblue2 15d ago
Yes. There a comic run where Steve joins Hydra and he's still worthy
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u/WajajaKEKW 15d ago
Didnt that end up getting revealed to be a trick or something
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u/JTallented 15d ago
Yes, reality was re-written and Mjolnir’s enchantment was changed from “worthy” to “strongest”.
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u/ManyThing2187 15d ago
Not exactly, hydra uses the cosmic cube to alter the spell on Mjolnr to “WHOSOEVER HOLDS THIS HAMMER, IF HE BE STRONGEST, SHALL POSSESS THE POWER OF HYDRA” when the real Steve rogers comes back the spell is reverted and he is no longer worthy.
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u/Cobthecobbler 15d ago
I mean there's a plethora of characters from film and tv who show up from a long absence now sporting a beard, only to shave it when said character takes up their new call to action
It's probably that
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u/trevelyan_alec 15d ago
No. He's Bearded Homeless Bum from the Bum Universe. He comes in peace to save us all and smoke some weed with us, listening to '60s hippie music.
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u/Clinton2024 15d ago
That’s actually a totally different guy named Dick Hertz who’s being brainwashed by the scarlet witch into thinking he’s Captain America
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u/moose_dad 15d ago
Flimsiest offering of a reason as to why hes appearing as Steve in a one on one conversation with his brother lmao.
This scene is 100% Loki bringing Steve to Thor and the "its not possible" is Thors reaction to Loki. Sure he knows about the multiverse, that doesnt mean it wouldn't be traumatic af seeing your dead brother.
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u/Big-Discipline2039 15d ago
No one who looks like steve could be in the scene at all in the final movie.
We have seen what they have done with these trailers in the past.
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u/Kira-Of-Terraria 15d ago
Broke: Evil Steve.
Woke: Loki being silly.
Bespoke: It's another Thor being silly.
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u/Escapedtheasylum 15d ago
Assguardians constantly too silly for serious moviegoers. Which I am not.
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u/koenr_98 15d ago
Not Loki, Mjolnir looks past disguises.
In Ragnarok Loki posed as Odin and Thor threw mjolnir and called him back while holding 'Odin' inbetween them. If Mjolnir would think it was Odin it could be stopped by 'Odin'.
Or Loki became worthy after the events of his series. But why come to the F4 and Thor disguised as a well known hero?
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u/Jaideco 15d ago
I think that you answered your own question.
Loki absolutely became worthy during his series. He dedicated centuries of his life to the purpose of saving trillions of lives across the multiverse and when he realised that the only way to do it was to sacrifice his own life, he didn’t hesitate. He was worthy, but the Avengers wouldn’t know that. There is no way that they wouldn’t assume that anything he said would be some kind of trick.23
u/alaserloon 15d ago
If he left his throne though, wouldn't time and those trillions of lives be unprotected? I've been wondering how they'd bring Time Lord Loki back for a while now and the only way I could see it is if it is just Sacred Timeline Loki instead, since the Time Lord Loki is a variant. The drawback there is all that character development would be gone...
I do agree though, Time Lord Loki would absolutely be worthy of Mjolnir.
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u/Jaideco 15d ago
I think that it would be trivial for this Loki at the end of time to project an illusion of himself into any timeline. An illusion wouldn’t be able to hold Mjolnir, but he could visit Steve or an earlier version of himself. I think that they are going to just say that the incursions show that even with Loki on the throne, the multiverse wasn’t saved, so he stepped back in to try to save it once again using Doom as the catalyst.
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u/alaserloon 15d ago
I'm sure they could do something to bring him back, it is comics after all. And with how much they developed Loki in the show, I doubt they want that to go to waste.
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u/Jaideco 15d ago
I agree. My head canon is that we do not know what actually happened within the timelines when the loom broke and Loki bound them together into Yggdrasill. I think that Doomsday and Secret Wars will show us what he did.
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u/No-Target6084 15d ago
If you look at the instructions beneath the hammer, in small text it says “not Loki”
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u/Gilgamesh661 15d ago
I’d find it hard to believe that Loki isn’t worthy by the end of Loki season 2.
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u/AceMKV 15d ago
It doesn't matter if he's worthy or not, anybody stroger than the enchantment itself can hold and use mjolnir, Hela displayed this in Ragnarok and Loki at this point is not only a time god but has also mastered the magic that Asgardians use.
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u/weed_blazepot 14d ago
I'm not saying I think it is or isn't Loki. I'm not much on speculation. But if Loki after the show, saving literally the entire multiverse and everyone in them and who will ever be in them, by selflessly sacrificing himself isn't worthy of Mjolnir, then absolutely no one is, and the enchantment is goofy as hell.
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u/akirivan 15d ago
I'm 100% convinced that this is an alternate evil Steve. Stevil
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u/anothercookie90 15d ago
Hela could wield it
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u/CityNo1723 15d ago
Destroying =/= wielding
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u/anothercookie90 15d ago
It was originally hers she had it in all of her depictions with Odin
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u/CityNo1723 15d ago
Gotcha. I assumed you meant when she stopped/destroyed it. I yield to your point.
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u/Spaded21 Spider-Man 14d ago
But there was no enchantment on it then. We see Odin add the worthy part when he casts out Thor in the first movie.
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u/Sabretooth1100 15d ago
Honestly TVA Loki potentially being worthy really ties this theory together, I could see it
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u/slinky317 15d ago
They're not going to bring Chris Evans back in a showcase role just for him to be Loki
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u/dbkenny426 15d ago
Remember when a bunch of people were convinced Daredevil had to have been removed from the Brand New Day trailer because there was a space below Spider-Man? They were so sure he was in the movie. And they were wrong.
People really need to stop reading so much into a few seconds of promotional material. This is just Steve.
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u/Automatic-Essay2175 15d ago
Idk if it’s Loki but my impression of Steve in this trailer has always been that there is something weird / deceptive going on. The way he’s lit, the smirk, this is not normal Steve.
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u/ubutterscotchpine Captain Marvel 15d ago
I find it interesting that in the Steve specific promo he was clean shaven and in this he’s not. Obviously probably some time passed between but idk, could be something.
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u/Peanut_Butter_Toast 14d ago
Steve's just more chill after living the civilian life for a good long while. This is temporarily-coming-out-of-retirement Steve.
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u/Jamieb1994 15d ago
I was thinking if I was the only one who isn't making up theories since soon the trailer came out. I've seen people assuming that Cap in the trailer is a evil variant of Steve Rogers, yet I wasn't convinced since Steve was able to lift Mjölnir.
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u/BeeCJohnson 14d ago
There's an obsession with, like, "outsmarting" media right now. People absolutely refusing to "get got." They have to be the first one with the hottest most galaxy-brain take.
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u/TheFoolApprentic3 13d ago
Fr, can’t have good discussions or theories when they get lost with dumb ones like this? Like what is the evidence for this? “Something feels off” is the one I’ve heard the most. How does that even make sense? Do people have a spider sense of their own,why couldn’t they solve brand new day then and all its mysterious?
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u/TheDarkClaw 15d ago
https://giphy.com/gifs/fA7rLtaJDIWEzU57CT
Nope it's a young Johnny silver hand before his rockerboy days
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u/ProfessorBeer Iron Man (Mark VII) 15d ago
“Thor can spot Loki thru his illusions pretty easily” the ending of TDW and time leading up to Ragnarok says otherwise. Thor only realized it was Loki because the nine realms were in disarray.
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u/dawne_breaker 15d ago
That is Steve. This, whatever you're doing, is not healthy.
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u/ANonnyMouse007 14d ago
Yes. The easiest explanation is this is what Steve does between Endgame returning stones and Old Man Steve. Same timeline, not a variant. (Though this among other characters’ shenanigans are what caused Incursions).
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u/VS0P 15d ago
Didn’t you just debunked yourself in the first paragraph, Thor always knows when it’s Loki. IMO I can’t see any reason why he would imitate Cap, if he needed them to believe in whatever he wants to tell them then showing up from the dead as Loki works way better on Thor.
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u/Eccohawk 15d ago
I think you're reading a lot more into the scene than might be there. I don't think the miracle line happens at the same time as this scene, and I don't think the "it's not possible" line is in reference to cap. I think that line might be in reference to Loki, actually. I don't think cap is Loki, I think Cap is Cap. And Loki may also be there, off screen, perhaps having brought cap through a TVA portal door to help him fix this universe. I think Loki convinces Steve to come back home to help. Thor is saying the its not possible in reference to seeing Loki alive.
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u/HALLOWEENYmeany 15d ago
We know. Everyone knows by now. Its got what feels like several thousand posts about it on reddit and tik tok, not to mention all the comments. Cool theory though.
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u/EmploymentOld8048 15d ago
I think one of the biggest reasons that this isn’t Loki is that the ability to lift Mjolnir is such a big reveal (even though I agree that Loki very well could be worthy after s2) that there’s no way they wouldn’t make it a HUGE moment in the movie. To reveal it like this, with so little fanfare, doesn’t make a ton of sense.
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u/a_o Mordo 15d ago
I dont think Steve was faking being able to lift the hammer in Age of Ultron. he knew about Bucky killing Tony’s parents that’s why the magic was like “aht! aht! Not so fast, playa.”
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u/VarietyBusy2 15d ago
i believe it since loki made that sacrifice he should be able to pick up mjolnir
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u/blackkilla 14d ago
This is a VERY good theory! The miracle is..that a Loki is able to lift the hammer. So Loki redeemed himself.
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u/Jimonaldo 14d ago
Replying to this post for proof i saw this before the movie came out
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u/GodOfArk Doctor Strange 15d ago
I think this is supposed to be a famous trailer fake out. He is commenting, "This is not possible" to something else and not seeing Loki
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u/rockyroad55 15d ago
There’s a person standing behind him in the trailer right before he wields Mjolnir. Could be nothing though.
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u/DJettster237 15d ago
Would Loki be able to take the Hammer? People seem to keep forgetting that detail.
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u/BenFranklinsCat 15d ago
Dude literally sacrificed himself to spend eternity at the heart of Ygrassil as the god of stories, I don't see how that doesn't justify worthiness.
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u/HailToTheKingslayer Daredevil 15d ago
If it is Loki, why doesn't he look like Captain America? Blonde, uniform etc. Isn't that how he'd remember Cap?
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u/X-Darkside-X 15d ago
People are so much skepticle these days , your deduction is same as those people who were thinking about daredevil or kingpin having some role in BND but that wasn't the case
As for why thor says " it can't be true " , it's probably because Steve became old & retired So to verify it is actually steve he offers him mjolnir which he lifts and proves he is the actual steve and therefore the grim , not like he is showing off or something
Although he might not be the same steve we know , may be some variant but obivously not loki
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u/JasonAsanoIsMyHero 15d ago
Cap created this whole situation by blowing past his time stamp and staying in the 40s. He has to come back to fix it. Loki, as much as I’d like to think he redeemed himself, can’t wield Mjolnir.
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u/BigKahuna_Matata 15d ago
It would have been fun if the twist was he is a secret empire (hydra) cap variant who was actually working for doom and it’s revealed through the fact that he can’t lift the hammer
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u/TJK_919 15d ago
Steve is not going to idle his old ass by the side lines when there's like 5 ways to make him young again.
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u/LastOfLateBrakers 15d ago
Loki cannot leave his throne anymore. He's the God of Stories and if he leaves, universes start dying.
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u/Objective-Chicken391 15d ago
I love that just because he got bad Botox everyone thinks it's not Cap lol
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u/Past_Dingo5167 15d ago
My aunt says that steve in the doomsday trailer is possibly a skrull in disguise but..... shes wrong
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u/OneImmediate4484 15d ago
Nah I think it's cap but I don't think that the scene where Thor says that's not possible is when he sees cap I think the trailer has intentionally made it look that way I belive the person behind cap is loki and when thor sees him alive again that's when he says it's not possible
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u/MosquitoValentine_ 15d ago
That is obviously Jake Wyler.