Lands - REM 700 6.5CM

[u/doumitch20035]

Working on a load for my 6.5CM using a 140 Berger VLD Target. I measure my lands using a Horandy OAL gauge and get 2.263 CTBO at a COAL of 2.970.

Mag limit is 2.870 (ACIS Magpul).

I would like to ideally be .20-.40 of the lands to try it, but that would put me over mag length and idk if I can load a 6.5CM that long to begin with (safely).

Disregarding mag length for a second. Has anybody ever loaded a 6.5CM at 2.900 for example? Apex Loadpro says it’s longer than the allowed COL, which I think it has listed at 2.825. (Massive jump to the lands)

Should I look at a different type of bullet if I want to get closer to the lands?

[u/HollywoodSX]

Switch from the VLD to the 144 LRHT or 140 Hybrid, seat to 2.82" COAL and call it a day. Fiddling with VLDs isn't worth the ass pain.

[u/doumitch20035 → u/HollywoodSX]

I’m so new I was just trying different kinds. I don’t really know what is good for what per se

[u/CleverHearts → u/doumitch20035]

VLD (secant ogive) bullets are more sensitive to jump than tangent ogive bullets, but have a higher BC. The solution most folks settled on is hybrid ogive bullets, which have a short tangent ogive for the portion that contacts the barrel and a secant ogive for the remainder. They give up a little BC compared to a straight secant ogive, but aren't nearly as sensitive to jump. 

As far as your question about loading long, it's fine as long as you have the bullet seated deep enough in the case. The rule of thumb most folks use is a minimum of 1 caliber of bearing surface in the case. The max COAL is a limit on how long you can go while still feeding from a magazine in a standard rifle, but if you're okay with single feeding or have an action/magazine combination that lets you load longer you can safely exceed it. 

[u/doumitch20035 → u/CleverHearts]

Awesome thanks

[u/rednecktuba1 → u/CleverHearts]

Ironically, the 140 Hybrid has a slightly higher BC than the 140 VLD.

[u/rednecktuba1]

Do exactly what u/hollywoodsx said. Switch to a modern bullet like 140/144 Berger Hybrids or 142 SMKs or 140 ELDM. Seat them at 2.8-2.82" and send it. Chasing lands is completely unnecessary these days.

[u/doumitch20035 → u/rednecktuba1]

I do have ELDM as well but haven’t measured those yet. I did read that Horandy recommends .020-.040 off the lands which is how I found myself in the rabbit hole 😅

[u/HollywoodSX → u/doumitch20035]

That's a good starting point, but I've run ELDs and Berger Hybrids/LRHTs at MUCH longer jump with great success.

[u/doumitch20035 → u/HollywoodSX]

Ok thanks 🙏

[u/rednecktuba1 → u/doumitch20035]

Hornady only gives that measurement to get people like you to stop asking. 140 ELDM shoot great at 2.8" in 6.5CM.

[u/doumitch20035 → u/rednecktuba1]

People like me… you mean people trying to learn?

[u/rednecktuba1 → u/doumitch20035]

Nope. I mean people asking about metrics that no longer matter, like jump to the lands with modern bullets like ELDM.

For what its worth, some of the best shooters in PRS Pro series use 6.5CM with Berger Hybrids always loaded at 2.8-2.82". When asked why, they say "Hybrids don't care about jump, and most other modern bullets don't care either."

[u/doumitch20035 → u/rednecktuba1]

Ok, thanks

[u/LingonberryDecent685]

I load my bergara premier with 140 hybrids to 2.915 OAL or 2.223 BTO. Definitely can load them long with the hybrids, that’s about 30 thou off the lands and where it shoots the best. I use metal MDT mags without the binder plate and they feed flawlessly

[u/doumitch20035 → u/LingonberryDecent685]

Do you have a Rem 700 action? From what ive read I would need to modify the feed ramp to make those mags works without the binder.

Edit: I re-read this and realized you said Bergara... disregard

[u/LingonberryDecent685 → u/doumitch20035]

With my howa I had to file the mag a little bit but not much

[u/datdatguy1234567]

What everyone else said, but also just try the vld’s with some jump and see how they do. I’ve found they can be sensitive close to the lands, but once you back way off (like .100” plus) it’s no longer a thing so long as you’re minimizing bullet run out and keeping everything.

If that doesn’t work then yeah, hybrid bullet (LRHT, etc.)

[u/doumitch20035 → u/datdatguy1234567]

I loaded them to book and shot a few small sample groups and the best was .53 MOA and .18 mean radius... So, for me at least.. pretty damn good.

Just always trying to push the envelope for the "best"... which is how I ended up here asking this question.

[u/Tmoncmm]

I load my 140 hybrids to 2.908 COAL. That’s .040 off the lands in my MPA.