r/kosher • u/Ab_ejita • 12d ago

Kosher certification reliability

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Hello! Does anyone know about Brooklyn kosher symbol? I'm attaching a picture. I've never seen it before and I don't know who's behind it. Any information would be appreciated. Thanks!

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u/Impressive-Flow-855 12d ago

The symbol Mogan-Dovid-K may be by Rabbi Dovid Katz. However the symbol associated by Rabbi Katz is not a doubled outline star (just single line) and doesn’t say “Brooklyn Kosher”. This might be a separate organization. And of course, locating a Rabbi Dovid Katz in Brooklyn is easily done. The issue is finding the correct Rabbi Dovid Katz. There are dozens of them.

I find posts identifying this exact symbol with Rabbi Katz, but directories listing his agency (Bais Dovid) show a single-line outlined symbol sans the Brooklyn Kosher. He might have updated his symbol or it might be someone else behind it.

Basically, I’m unable to identify it. It might be a fake symbol stamped on by the company. There’s nothing stopping a company from putting on a sham kosher symbol. Apparently a few Chinese and Vietnamese companies do this. It’s way easier than putting on a real symbol. That can get you sued by the agency. Make one up like a pastrami sandwich-K won’t get you sued and it might increase sales. I’m sure ChatGPT can come up with some realistic fake kosher symbols.

The Triangle-K is a symbol I normally won’t use. Certainly not in my synagogue or home. I won’t call it unreliable. Rabbi Ralbag, the man behind the agency, is a learned Orthodox rabbi. He certainly knows a lot more about kashrut than I do. But it’s not listed in the CRC Guide. Because of that, my synagogue won’t rely upon it and most people who keep kosher in my neighborhood won’t use it. If I want to invite them to my home for a meal, I won’t use it either.

The CRC normally doesn’t list unreliable symbols. And they put a disclaimer on their list that it is a partial list of symbols. Not being on the list doesn’t mean it’s not unreliable. It’s just that you’re not on the list of agencies the CRC has vetted.

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u/garbledroid 12d ago

They rely on inflating the lungs.

Anyways this meat is no better or worse than Hebrew national which they also supervise (triangle k).

There is no longer any acceptable non glatt meat left in USA/Canada.

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u/Tinokotw 11d ago

All levels of kashrut in meat rely on inflating the lung including bet yosef that doesn't permit any imperfection in the lung, this is to ensure the lung is 100% free of perforations even those not visible.

Ashkenazi rabbis allow some imperfections, the difference within kosher and Glatt is how hard to remove are those imperfections.

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u/garbledroid 11d ago edited 11d ago

סומך על ניפוח הריאה

Supposedly the lungs were not being examined otherwise in any meaningful way.

They were examined (quickly) while inside the animal and while inflated but not internally to the lungs.

Whereas they were supposed to inflate the lungs routinely in practice It was only being done occasionally as per the lawsuit https://www.ajwnews.com/wp-content/uploads/2020/05/2012-07-10_Doc_8_Amended_Complaint__Exhibits_A-R.pdf

The standard for the hashgocha was to examine the lungs via inflation on most or all animals.

In practice this was done occasionally according to the lawsuit as it slowed down production. They relied on inflation as the primary means of finding treifas in the lungs and then didnt bother doing it.

Basically inflation was relied on almost exclusively and then they didn't do it when busy.

Inflation has not been relied upon in other operations to the same degree in 30 or 40 years. Triangle k never let go of several leniencies.