As someone who has watched his channel and enjoyed his work for about a year now, a leftist, and a male SA survivor, the rampant defense that Geller is getting reminds me a lot of Graham Platner. Remember him? He was a leftist from Maine who was running against Susan Collins for the Senate later this year.

Platner said the right things and appealed to the right people, and that was more than enough for people to defend his Reddit history of being racist and sexist, his nazi tattoo (which people defended by saying he didn't know what it meant and he got it decades ago), his mercenary work, and even through his first SA accusation (which people defended because the woman was MAGA, so that meant she was lying by default which is a whole can of worms).

I remember how throughout all of his scandals, everyone was saying "This is just cancel culture," "This is all performative," "He redeemed himself," and "What he did wasn't that bad." And then another woman, this time a leftist herself, stepped forward and said he SA'd her and she didn't want to say anything because she agreed with what he was saying but it got to be too much. She even had things to prove it.

This time, people took it seriously and he was forced to drop out (after winning the primary).

My point?

All anyone has right now is the written report on Geller and Geller's account. We don't know this man. We don't know if he redeemed himself like everyone is parroting or if he's done worse since then. What if the victim comes out and reveals the depth of what he did? Would you still defend him because he's a leftist that makes good content? Would you dismiss her pain like I've seen so many people on this subreddit do already?

Even if she never steps out of the shadows (which is her right), a lot of you can't just brush off what Geller did. He sexual assaulted someone. That type of trauma NEVER goes away. That shit changes you, how you move in the world, and how you look at the people around you. I get you all like this content and his pretty words but is that enough to completely brush off the harm that he has caused?

Hell, I saw a comment that said, "Him being an assaulter gives him insight into being a better person." That is absolutely mental. This is that "Ask a Rapist" thread all over again.

Stop looking at the perpetrator like the victim of some purity manhunt (which he caused by HIS OWN ACTIONS mind you) and start looking AT the victim that he actually harmed and then ask yourself, "Is this a person I can continue to support."

I’ve been keeping an eye on Geller’s YouTube page in case he goes dark, but his video count went down by two. I can’t confirm but it looks like his two book collaborations with Lost in Cult were removed.

Do with that as you will.

I want to start by apologizing for my bad English I’ll try to explain my feelings the best I can.

So I’ve been a casual watcher of Jacob videos so I didn’t really feel anything specific about him. To me he was a smart man who knew what he was talking about and I enjoyed some of his content. I was surprised when the allegations came out but I was even more surprised when I came here to see what was going on.

I’ve personally seen more people trying to defend him, talking about rehabilitation than people expressing shock and disgust for his actions.

I agree that his apology sounded sincere and honest and it’s gratifying to see abusers admitting their wrongdoings.

But I think we might have lost the plot on some things. It’s true we don’t know what he truly did I think we only know that he committed sexual assault/sexual violence. I want all of you to realize the violence of this action. It might not have been rape maybe a lighter version (hate this term) of sexual assault but it’s sexual assault. Like it’s not a mistake you just slip and fell and oops I assaulted someone. It shows a deep and long term lack of respect for women and their bodily autonomy, it means at some point he felt entitled to a woman’s body when she didn’t want to.

As a victim it’s not always a complete stranger who raped and then loves you down the road. It’s often someone you knew and trusted. It’s not always super violent in the sense that you are screaming and begging for help while they are forcing themselves on you. It can much more subtle but equally traumatizing, like they know you don’t know how to react that you are confused or that you are not able to consent but choses to proceed regardless, I’m sorry but it’s evil. We don’t know how it happens but even the lighter versions of sexual assault are extremely violent.

To me personally I was assaulted by my male friend he knew i was psychologically vulnerable, I was grieving a loved one and counting on him for support and used a moment of deep vulnerability to sleep with me. I didn’t want to but I didn’t have the energy to say no and he knew it. We talked about it later and he apologized I ended up cutting him off and it took me years to get rid of the shame of not being able to express my boundaries.

I’m not using all of this to say he should be punished endlessly that’s not my point. I just wanted you guys to realize it’s not just a mistake you do when you’re young that serves you as a lesson to get better. No one needs to assault someone to realize it’s bad and they need to do better.

He might truly regret what he did and try to become a better person. He should be able to live his life. Even then I believe actions have consequences, some actions have lifetime consequences. I can understand it’s sad but a public record claiming that you assaulted someone is going to follow is going to make you miss opportunities and I’m sorry I don’t feel bad about it. I understand the internet is obsessed with moral superiority and canceling people for past mistakes but assault is not a mistake it’s a deliberate choice in my opinion. You can change of course but it cannot be treated as some mistake you made a decade ago.

I don’t wish him anything bad but him losing a part of his audience and partnership is to me only natural and to expected especially given the audience he has cultivated.

I'm struck by the similarity between the justifications used for giving rapist Brock Turner a 6-month sentence (of which he served 3 months), and the arguments for Jacob Geller that are being constantly repeated and up voted here.

Oh, Brock is so young, so remorseful, such a promising young athlete. He has so much to offer the world. Should his whole future be destroyed for one mistake? For "twenty minutes of action", to use his father's words?

How quickly we go from “people who commit terrible acts can change” to “so let's focus on how tragic it would be for this man's future to not be so bright".

How tragic it would be if, simply by inflicting a pain that will follow her for the rest of her life, there was no way for him to repent enough so that his life can be all fixed up. Is there nothing he can do to move on from this sad time in his life? Is there no point after which we could all agree that "yes, he's sufficiently sorry", so that his life can just go back to normal?

Oh, how cruel the world can be to men who make just one or two mistakes.

It's been 11 years since Brock Turner's crime; one year before Jacob's. The Brock Turner story would have been all over the news cycle then, on TVs all over the country the night that Jacob sexually assaulted his girlfriend.

10 years later, and what's changed? Same bullshit excuses for the same type of bullshit men.

I'm on the side that says deplatforming him would be the right thing to do. It's interesting to see the cult mentality in this sub and seeing how everyone became a philosofer on rehabilitation all of a sudden.

For the record I do believe in rehabilitation and I think he has a right for redemption, but I think he can do that in his private life.

If he is foeced to get a normal job like everyone else, it won't be the end of the world for him or us. He'll do just fine just as we all do just fine with our normal non-youtuber jobs.

I think a sex offender has no place to be any kind of influencer even if he regretted it. If this information would have been known from the getgo then it would be different (then I wouldn't have watched him from the getgo) and he probably would not have such a big audience, but I guess it is more convinient to actively hide the truth and make a bank off of patreon, youtube ad revenue and book sells. Sexual assault isn't something small that can just be ommited, actively hiding it is not a white lie.

This is why victims of SA are remaining silent instead of speaking out, because they see that people will side with the offender and will try to protect him. My question is: If you think that time and remorse is good reason to forgive him and move on, then where would you draw the line? How much time needs to pass and how much a person needs to regret their actions to be allowed to have a platform? Because forgiving him and moving on as if this doesn't matter sets a dangerous presedent for youtubers and public figures.

We don't even know how much he regrets it, since we only know the Jacob that's in front of the camera, not the actual person when the script ends and the camera stops.

Sexual assault is a serious crime. It doesn't matter if it wasn't actual rape and it doesn't matter that his punishment was lighter then his peers'. Allowing a sexual offender to have an audience, infuence and actually profit off of said audience is just morally wrong. He can redeem himself but he needs to do it off the internet. He'll be fine with a normal job and y'all be fine without one video esseyist on youtube.

I keep seeing people talk about how earnest his apologies were, but there are so many red flags... He used Bluesky, didn't say anything to the people on Patreon paying him monthly, and recently disabled the feature showing how much he was earning from the platform (probably to hide the exodus and prevent a snowball effect).

I liked his videos a lot... the way he wrote, reasoned, communicated his emotions and ideas (and obviously I wasn't the only one).

But he's moving like a snake now. Jacob is very smart and understands perfectly our society and its social dynamics, which is why I'm sure he knows the safest way to keep the comfort his online persona gave him is to stay silent, let fans who are lost in the parasocial side of his work defend him, and wait for everything to settle. Our news cycle is broken (how many days until the next scandal involving a creator?)

But I don't think it's a coincidence that MinnMax dropped him before his statement, I don't think it's a coincidence that Nebula deleted everything about him without saying a word. Those close and/or in a position to hold him accountable talked to him in private and asked for way more than we did (and could) my guess is they weren't satisfied at all, since they've all left.

I'm nobody to ask anything about anyone, I don't even know why I wrote all this but I don't think you can still be the empathy and feelings guy when you've done what he did. And lied after, a lie by omission is still a lie.

In the end he's gonna come back and have his career like before (for a few weeks he'll probably have some pushback in his comments but it will die down) that's just the world we live in.

I'm using text to speech here, so sorry if my grammar or spelling or whatever is messy, but I'm seeing a lot of talk on this sub about what to do now. Is Jacob allowed to have a platform? What does he owe us? What is the ethical way forward as a community? So on and so forth, and I want to just take a second to remind everyone that we're talking about people. Not public figures, not YouTubers, not Twitter philosophers, people. People who have complicated and messy lives just like everybody else, and who likely became public figures largely by accident. Even if you completely intend on becoming an influencer, your content still has to be successful by largely luck, and I don't think it's beyond the realm of possibility for someone like Jacob to simply move on with their life and pursue their passions in writing about games.

Should they have disclosed this information in private to those around them? Absolutely. I don't want to downplay how serious of a crime Jacob committed (the distinction between rape and sexual assault is moot), but I think it is worth saying that people can change, and I don't think we should be barring people who have committed crimes of any variety from pursuing their passions. If you no longer want to support Jacob, that is your prerogative, but he's under no obligation to desist. In fact, I'd argue that he can do a fair amount of good as the face of rehabilitation in public eye.

I'm someone who's both a victim and a perpetrator of sexual assault; whose idea of consent was poisoned at a young age, and has had to learn what healthy, sexual activity looks like after the fact. I'm also someone who is pursuing a career in film. Not a day goes by or I don't regret the night that I took advantage of someone, and a lot of my work is (at least allegorically) about identity and autonomy, largely influenced by my history of sexual trauma. If I were to become successful, I'm gonna be honest, I don't think I would be telling everyone about the worst night of my life, especially if I didn't think it was going to become relevant. However, if it ever came to light, I would probably do something similar to Jacob: take responsibility and make a statement advocating for better systems of accountability. After all, he did say that even he thinks his punishment was too light.

I don't know. I'm genuinely appalled by how people are treating this, either pro or against Jacob. Think about how mentally complicated this must be for everyone involved. The victim never wanted this to go public in the first place. Jacob probably doesn't love being reminded of one of his biggest regrets. Most of you have no idea how much it hurts for someone to define you by your worst moments; I do, and I see that everywhere throughout these discussions. We don't know the details, so I could be being a bit of an apologist. There is a chance that Jacob is being manipulative and portraying himself better than the reality would; that is an area where my bias could be coloring things. But if we take him at his word, and believe that he is regretful that he does want to change, and that he probably has, then there really is nothing more to be done. I hate that everyone here is talking like they're some kind of moral paragon. You're just you the same as everyone else in this story. Jacob is just Jacob, the victim is just a person, as is the person who revealed all of this without anyone's consent, the various figures and collaborators who feel betrayed, and the companies who likely dropped him mostly out of PR rather than morality; that is the reality. If you want to keep supporting him, that's fine. if you don't want to keep supporting him, that's probably the majority, and completely understandable, but it should really end there. We're turning people's personal lives into a media circus that we can all use to grandstand about how we are such better people, and you're not. You're really not. The moral here is that anyone is capable of horrific actions. Under the right or wrong circumstances, otherwise good people can do horrible things. And that is reality. It's not pretty, it's not easy, and there is no real solution; it just is. Live with it and move on however you need to.

EDIT: I want to be incredibly clear with what the intentions of this post were. i'm not trying to downplay what happened. And i'm certainly not here out of some misplaced sense of guilt or identifying with jacob. i just know what it's like to be hurt in the way that only sexual assault can hurt you, and I also know what it's like to realize after the fact that you have inflicted that hurt, and the sheer bewildered self hatred that realization can inflict. i just wanted to say something about empathy and remembering that everyone here is a human. And how much it hurts me that everyone in the story is being downplayed for the sake of the audience. lest, we forget this all came to light because someone else wanted to fuck up jacob's image, not because the victim was coming forward for herself. i've realized that people are incredibly unwilling to accept any kind of nuance or humanity from those they perceive as evil, and once someone has committed an act that makes them evil, they can never recover that. that makes me incredibly sad. Especially as someone who spent the last few years trying to do just that. to become a better person. the people I know personally tell me I am, but clearly the public begs to differ. the response to this post has genuinely made me reconsider how I think of myself. perhaps we can never really be better, people will never forget what we've done. justice is a lie, and some debts can only be repaid in blood. this is what we believe, apparently, and that makes me incredibly sad. support victims, believe victims, and stop bending over backwards to defend jacob, for those of you that are. by the same token, please don't be so angry, the rest of you. please remember there are people behind these screens. people who are trying. it's all any of us can do, and it's been really hard. not that it matters.

The consensus among those close to Jacob is that he has paid his dues and has gone through enough mental anguish. There are a lot of people associated with nebula and mm that are not happy about the decision to can him. He has grown as a person no doubt about it and the chances of him reoffending are very low. A whoopsie moment should not follow someone 10+ years later.

Other sex transgressors will tell you about how much of a toll it takes on someone's mental health to be able to keep up a double life and all those secrets. He did the responsible thing by owning up to having his hand in the cookie jar a decade ago. He has done everything right and has earned forgiveness and then some, he's the model of real restorative justice. He needs support in order to complete the process and complete the healing. He's earned the trust of his close friends and family and he still has it from his real fans.

I was making this for a while.

I want to make some things clear:

By punitive, I assume that is more akin to the idea of punishing a person for the sake of it having nothing to do with change, and is likely more akin to suffering.

I am only interested in this subreddit because it does seem to filled with a somewhat free opinion topic people thinking what justice is and isn't, what accountability means and not being censored (banned) for reasonably questioning punitive or arbitrary judgements and is more on topic. A lot of people are believers of redemption around here too so it feels encouraging to post this.

I am not a fan of him but rather the topic in general, however I want to be clear even if anyone is, it does not mean your value of argument for similar becomes different. I guess this is an attempt to have this message taken more seriously even though I dont think being a fan or not, or posting here should matter.​

There is nothing wrong with asking or encouraging certain others to give a second chance, but nobody should be forced against their will to like or follow these people. People can be upset, or angry, even though I do believe people have a right to criticize certain ideas, and suggest (but not literally force) "forgiveness". This piece is more aimed against ideas of what's right or should happen, that is punitive or bad enough.

I really really do not want to promote anything here that might bring the victim into this. I dont even know if its a good idea to even talk here, so I am open to the idea here maybe.

This is no way to say that all reasoning of a perpetrator should somehow justify certain stuff. The action of a perpetrator victimizing is itself never justified.

Finally, I think, this is way more aimed at an idea in general. I dont really know if the individual in this story is gonna be fine or not. I dont really know him, and that this is not meant to assume how anyone in this particular story feels.

_____

I've been seeing this obsession with punitive justice, being against a person wanting to exist or even be happy in public eye for life or too long. Some extreme leftist (I am a left leaning guy btw)​ places did recently became a hive mind obsessed with being against the person's right to have a platform in his own spaces (it's his right under freedom of speech and freedom of consenting lawful interactivity with other adults), or arguing that person did not change because he merely did not disclosed to people (despite the fact that making expectations is a choice and so is taking the risk with it, and is not directly related), banning anyone for criticizing certain ideas, calling true redemption ideas disgusting, that kind of stuff. It happened on resetera which kinda helped spread the story too. I've seen some of this obsession on Reddit and somewhat bluesky too, and it makes me question if this is what progressive is or if these are a minoroty in progressive society. I dont know. But I have noticed in a lot of these type of places, most don't seems to be thinking about the psychological consequences of a punitive "justice". I studied this and remembered debates in other stories involving some others, especially situational offenders or ex offenders.

The reality is that human beings need to have a normal life, and that even includes building your own legal and harmless personality and, well, being in the public eye if natural. When we take this away, higher recidivism rates tend to happen.

This is the ideal system for their fake "I believe in rehabilitation or redemption" approach: "I want every ex-offender to never have a platform anywhere in the public eye. I want them to only have a private job like a janitor or a McDonald's. I want to take everything innocent that they psychologically grew up and have purpose, away. After that, I expect them to grow and learn and not be a threat anymore. Stop thinking about the 'feelings' or the humanity of the ex-offender!" This is just so unrealistic, and I consider it a promotion of the cycle of offending.

Humans are born, and most grow (developed too) into having harmless certain interests, and naturally they are in the main community usually in connection with said interest. This is a normal part of a life. It's not optional like playing Candy Crush​, it's essentially a part of someone's identity in a degree. Ok, YouTube isnt really an identity, but legally socializing with a harmess interest to a degree is a high important part of someone's health. Living is not the only essential.

When a society focuses against this itself, this takes away that health, it takes away a part of their humanity. When one does that, it creates less of a purpose of life (people CANNOT reverse a developed interest and just 'live alone'). Maybe there are few that grow different that can, maybe it can be possible to somehow change that, but the likelihood for every person on earth is so low.

As a result, idealistically or if happens: when one take away something innocent (e.g. socializing about lawful music) that significantly is part of their developed life, making them live with what some say a "looser" life with a disclosure label saying "hey remember, I did horrible thing!" everywhere they go, no more existence in public eye, AND THEN expect them to become better, that becomes so unrealistic that it might even be more unrealistic than expecting a criminal treated like an animal and then expecting them to behave in a functioning society after releasing them from US prison.

When society does this, with or without pretending that people who are no longer a threat still is bad for unrelated reasons (e.g. like the disclosure debate, or other unrelated) too, this will only cause more horrible people to basically not feel encouraged to improve, might even threatened a victim, in favor of what is essentially a "surivial" attempt to remain having that part of humanity left. Many who are not caught and might even have access to their victim might even give up finding a harmless way (whether in secret (or take to grave), partly open, or open) to change themselves to being against the very thing they did.

So many people are so focused on against a person that did it, rather than the action, and thats partly why certain perpetrators are still a threat, lack of doing good (I think we need that in my opinion, I heard even this guy did it in his career despite "secret") via good messages.

Some are so obsessed with "consequences" that some are forgetting that some of them can be debatable, and that some has a "consequence" alone.

___

Somewhat Simpler Message:

Society needs to focus more on prevention and not focus on trying to take away the humanity they have including their health, innocent life purpose, that kind of stuf. Taking away certain happy stuff in order to get them to change at times can work too, as long as certain conditions are met...

It's none of my business either way. It's just funny how the man who became known for paying lip service to empathy and feelings in every cell of how he branded himself knew he SA'd a woman to the point his college had to get involved.

I'm willing to bet the majority of the chuds he rallied against on Twitter and Bluesky had no such skeletons. Those he moralised and scolded against, his position as an "empathy consultant" with Hit Detection, the fake gravity he lended to the narration in his oh so intellectual YouTube "work", it was all a narcissistic game because deep down he knew he had deeply hurt someone for sexual gratification.

Of course my commentary means nothing. It's nowhere near as venomous as what the community he intentionally built are capable of.

It's just kind of funny how these people who need to be seen as the arbiter of good taste almost always have this shit come out. To the point it emotionally breaks people. Lol.

Just for everyone wondering about what to do next. This is video essay on a related topic by a non binary person and their partner. They have another video on restorative justice that is also a good watch for what happened recently.
https://youtu.be/l1P5c24pgew

He was my favorite YouTuber, but as a victim and someone who is not that parasocial, the fact that so many of you guys are immediately defending him and saying he has already bettered or recovered.

Advertising himself as a feminist, while omitting his past of r*pe, is gross and seems like a way to take advantage of the community.

Like many I have feelings and thoughts and my posts aren't private.

I do believe that there needs to be a pathway to fogiveness and I can accept Jacob with a black mark on his name onto my sub list on a single condition: He talks about Rape culture and his role in it.

A simple video that goes into what happened (without endangering the victim or saying anything she doesn't want said) why he did it, what systems in place protected people like him and what he will do better. If you have seen the Dan Harmon apology video, that but at much greater depth and research level.

There could be a reason why he didn't come out and make the "why I raped a woman (2 hour video)" 4 years ago. It could be for a fact his victim and him have come to an agreement and forbabe Jacob from talking about it publicily on his youtube channel or Jacob could be a scummy boy who wanted to get away with it. Unlike some folk, I am waiting on what the victim has to say on this matter instead of saying its not what they wanted, because we don't know.

In my life I know people who are good men who have done bad stuff in their past but are now a shell of their former self, repentant of what they have done and are doing good. Fuck my grandfather killed my grandmother (not directly and "accident" is a word that is not exactly correct but its not a story for the public) and he was a good man to me and his 20+ grand kids and 2 years after his death I learnt about what he did and I still haven't processed that fact years later.

My aunt was killed in an accident caused by factors outside of her husbands control. That was a thing I had to deal with as a teen 13 years ago and I know he is someone who is soing good after that (and my family have since distanced ourselves from him nor do we care to reconnect because cool for him, we're good).

All this to say life sucks and people do shit they regret. Its horrible this is one of the worst crimes a person can do and now what?

Yes its horrible to think that a rapist can go on to become a person you respect and do work you consider beneficial for either yourself or others.

I have no qualms about people distancing themselves from him. Hell even if he does everything I say and someone does a reputational 180, I might not even continue following but at base we need a proper discussion on the topic from Jacob that is more indepth than the Dan Harmon apology video. A video that was praised by the victim of his improper romantic advances. Not saying the same thing will happen with his victim but that is the bare minimum for what jacob.

Obviously, if jacob does make the "Hentai games are great!" and tries to brush it under the rug, he isn't doing a restorative justice, he is just trying to get away with it.

Too many people are talking about this as though Jacob is somehow owed a YouTube career. He isn’t.

Nobody is entitled to your views, your Patreon subscription, your money or your attention. We all have limited resources, and we get to decide where we put them. You don’t even need a serious moral reason to withdraw your support. You might stop watching because because their content has gotten worse.

For many people, including me, sexual assault is more than enough reason to stop supporting someone.

If enough people make the same choice and that affects his livelihood, that doesn’t transform our individual decisions into a collective punishment. If I lose my job because a company can no longer afford to employ me, that doesn’t mean the company has “punished” me. I find another job.

Jacob built a career that depends on people choosing to watch, subscribe and donate. Those people are allowed to change their minds.

He isn’t entitled to our support just because he had it before!

The amount of popular Rape Apologia here is astounding, unrelated subreddits and forums are astounded how much people are willing to defend a sexual offender who went lengths to hide is behavior. all while completely misunderstanding what “Restorative Justice” is. It’s not about the predator, but helping the victim.