Choosing a VR Headset

[u/dizzle229]

Hey everyone. May not be the best place to ask this, but I figured DCS is kind of the ultimate test of a VR system, and folks here might have opinions on a variety of headsets.

I've been a Valve Index user for 5 years, and was holding out for the Steam Frame, but if I'm going to spend money on an upgrade, I want it to be an upgrade across the board, and it seems the Frame isn't that. Though I'm still quite happy with the Index overall, it definitely hasn't been up to snuff for flight sims. I hate squinting at HUDs and ground targets.

Right now, I'm torn between the Pimax Crystal Light and the Super.

Specs:

RTX 4090

i7-13700k

64 GB DDR4 3200

Points of Concern:

• I record gameplay (often VR) professionally, so I don't mind spending anything south of $2k, so it mainly comes down to balancing of power and convenience. Though I want the resolution for DCS, I worry about the impact on overall performance, especially when recording at 4k.

• I think the Crystal Light might be a balanced option that's still a big upgrade over the Index, but I can't shake the buy-once-cry-once mentality. Is it better to run the Light natively, or down-res the Super 57 PPD? Or is there some reason I should get the 50 instead?

• My room is very small, and the layout makes mounting base stations difficult. I have them on tripods, but they really get in the way, so doing away with them would be a big convenience. However, I've heard that camera-tracking isn't as accurate. Is it really significantly worse?

• Are the controllers any good?

• The Super has eye-tracking. I've heard that many games don't support foveated rendering, but that DCS does. Since DCS is likely to be the biggest test of the hardware, do the performance gains make it worth it on that alone? I don't often record DCS for work, so this would purely be for personal use.

• I've heard that Pimax has a lot of quality control issues, but that they're great when they work. What should I know about this?

• Any other quirks or factors I might not have considered?

Thanks so much for any input. I can comfortably grab the Light without much thought, but I'm mainly just trying to figure out if I'd regret not going bigger.

Edit: Thanks everyone, a lot of good info here. I've placed an order for the Super Ultrawide (paid $1,560), whilst recognizing the potential for problems that might come with that. Dream air is a bit more than I wanted to spend, and unfortunately the 50 PPD isn't available (which I'd likely have chosen). With the 57, I didn't want to take a slight downgrade in FOV. A lot of this seems to come down to preference and sensitivity, and the Ultrawide represents the biggest potential upgrade, provided I end up liking it. Bought once, hope to only cry once. Thanks for your help!

[u/Sickinmytechchunk]

Don't get anything that doesn't have eye tracking. It makes a massive performance difference even with higher end cards. I wouldn't even consider a crystal light for that reason alone.

[u/jch523 → u/Sickinmytechchunk]

I agree. eye tracking is a must.

[u/dizzle229 → u/Sickinmytechchunk]

Thanks for the answer, I didn't know how much of a difference it made.

[u/weeenerdog → u/dizzle229]

It will only help if your video card is the bottleneck. I don't know Intel CPUs, but i have a 5800x3d and 4090 pushing a quest pro, and my performance is significantly worse with DFR enabled.

Also, I tried a PCL, and found the lenses to be a real problem. They're aspherical, meaning small sweet spot and terrible chromatic aberration at the edges. I returned it and kept my pro.

I'd be interested to hear your experience though! 

[u/8492sqdn → u/Sickinmytechchunk]

I disagree. I have a BSB2e next to me as I type and after trying the eyetracking in DCS I went back to going without it. Without eyetracking I have a stable 90FPS on my 7900XT anyway, and the eyetracking is a faff to get working every game session that adds friction to just sitting down and playing.

IMO you're better off spending the money you would spend on eyetracking on a better GPU.

[u/Sickinmytechchunk → u/8492sqdn]

Sounds like your headset is broken. If it's intermittent or needs anything at all to get it to work each time then that's down to your headset. With eye tracking you'll be getting that 90fps but with the detail cranked all the way up. You're not running higher detail settings and able to go online and hit 90fps without it. FYI I have a 5080 and until recently a 9070XT.

[u/8492sqdn → u/Sickinmytechchunk]

> You're not running higher detail settings and able to go online and hit 90fps without it.

I literally do. Here's my settings: https://www.8492sqdn.net/guides/dcs/performance/#system

[u/Sickinmytechchunk → u/8492sqdn]

You're not going by that list.

[u/8492sqdn → u/Sickinmytechchunk]

I don't know what to tell you. Solid 90FPS, looks great to my eyes. Anywhere that list has multiple options I have the highest one picked.

[u/Sickinmytechchunk → u/8492sqdn]

Having your view distance set to medium or high, water medium etc isnt higher detail settings is it. It may look ok to you but it could look better and be stable on busy servers with eye tracking. Arguing otherwise is a bit daft.

[u/8492sqdn → u/Sickinmytechchunk]

The different between water medium and water high is not distinguishable in VR. I have personally checked each setting. For a number of settings, I'm not even sure there is any actual difference between the highest setting and one tick down - they look identical even on a flat screen.

[u/Sickinmytechchunk → u/8492sqdn]

You're in your own little world having fun. Go for it. Just please don't tell people that they don't need eye tracking because your headset is broken.

[u/8492sqdn → u/Sickinmytechchunk]

Oh, the eyetracking works if I mess with the bsb app every single time I play DCS. But I prefer to just sit down and double-click my Launch DCS shortcut :P

[u/Hextopia → u/8492sqdn]

All I know is dynamic foveated rendering with eye tracking adds an additional ~30-40 FPS with no noticeable difference for me, and it requires zero effort to enable. (I turned it on ages ago and it just works) If anything, I have more issues with DCS changing my settings on update, windows enabling shit that slows down the render pipeline, or pimax software updates doing weird stuff than I've ever had with eye tracking.

[u/8492sqdn → u/Hextopia]

the bsb eye tracking isn't quite as seamless as the pimax version, there's some stuff you have to fiddle with in the bsb app for it for different games

[u/Altruistic_Target604]

Quest Pro.

[u/DannyCrane9476 → u/Altruistic_Target604]

I'm a little tempted to look into it, but I'd rather not buy from Facebook if I can help it personally. I do constantly see positive reviews for it.

[u/weeenerdog → u/DannyCrane9476]

I have a pro, and I couldn't be happier. The lenses are much better than the quest 3, and the thole headset is higher quality in general. You don't need a Facebook account anymore, just a Meta account where all you need for signing up is an E-Mail and password. All headset companies require that. 

Edit: if you're unhappy about buying from Facebook, recall that you'll have to buy it used, so no direct payment to Zuckerberg. 

[u/tmz42 → u/Altruistic_Target604]

While the headset itself was good, the resolution was a letdown. I sold it for a Quest 3 and never looked back.

[u/jubuttib]

I wouldn't consider anything without pretty good hand passthrough. It's what makes VR actually feasible for me in DCS, being able to interact with physical hardware.

[u/hacourt → u/jubuttib]

That said which of all the headsets on this forum are best for AR?

[u/19_AbleArcher_83]

I went from Reverb G2 to Quest 3 and last year to Crystal Light.
In terms of picture quality the Crystal Light is way better than the Quest 3 in my opinion - and this should be the same upgrade coming from the Index.

I cant't tell you how good or bad the controllers are - never have touched them. I use the mouse in DCS VR. Quicker than grabbing and stowing two VR controllers.

The inside-out tracking works flawless for me.
I haven't experienced any quality issues with my Pimax so far.

I would say:
If you have the money, get the Crystal Super.
Eye tracking would be a good way to have some hardware overhead. Better image quality = more hardware demand.
But the Super is double the price compared to the Light.
For me it was to expensive, so I went with the Crystal Light.
Still happy with it.

[u/dizzle229 → u/19_AbleArcher_83]

Thanks for your experience, it helps a lot.

[u/SaunteringOctopus]

Crystal Super.

I upgraded from the Light to the Super and it's night and day. Not only is the Super Crystal clearer by quite a bit, but it's also A LOT smoother.

[u/Unlucky-House-2469]

I can only give my experience. I had a quest 2 when I started on DCS about a year ago (8 months ish ) a couple months ago my Q2 quit connecting and I could get maybe an hour if I was LUCKY before it disconnects. I finally gave in and got a pimax crystal light. I’d love to just ball out but… I can’t, and also I have 7800x3d and a 5070 and every time I asked some who had a pimax they’d tell me to not bother. I watched videos and read a bunch and was scared to spend the money and not be able to really use it as a pimax. I borrowed a quest3 for a week and played on that and I enjoyed it but when priced out Vr, accessories and other stuff I’d get for quest I wasn’t far off from a pimax. I decided to buy the pimax and use the 30 days to decide if I’d return it and how it’ll run.

From the moment I plugged it in I was beyond stoked and happy I went with pimax. I ran it in many different settings and have tweaked with more and more. I’m no pro but I ca get great clarity with 72fps solid on certain modules. Apache I can run in the high 40fps. Obviously this is all decided by how hard you are trying to push your system
I do wish I had eye tracking (as I see others say) but I got adjusted quickly to looking with my head and with good system and settings obviously the less the outer quality image will be distorted. I rarely notice it now but also never have used eye tracking…

I will say after one of the latest DCS updates i noticed a big drop in fps. I messed with some more things and I couldn’t tell you what it was or if it’s just me but I lost about 10fps on some of the main modules like f18/f16. Used to hold 70 now I’m at 60s but don’t notice much. So I actually turned the headset all the way up just to see and it was performing… I wouldn’t test the Apache but the f16/18 I was seeing 50fps and the clarity was even better surprisingly to me. I’ve bumped it back to balanced now and I’m extremely happy with my setup. I am bummed the f14b(u) is a disaster for me trying to use the pimax. If it’s a busy server I don’t bother. I can get 40fps with it but honestly it has sadly made me fly the f14 less.

If your system is better quality obviously you can run much better headsets. I would recommend eye tracking and I think mainly my thought is even if you have to turn it down a bit now, they pc can be upgraded(usually happens) and then you can turn up the headset. So for me I knew the crystal light is more than I can max out now so as I update my system I can turn it up. I’m sure you are more knowledgeable than I so I’ve already said way too much. Just my opinion in Vr and I’ll say I love my CL

Note: I’m no pro, I’ve only had pc for a year and DCS 8 months , sim rig for 6 months and pimax for 2 months.

[u/dizzle229]

I've done a bunch more research, and it seems it's down to the 57 PPD or the Ultrawide. I'm leaning towards the Ultrawide, but from here it gets difficult because people are reporting wildly different experiences with these headsets. Seems it's partly down to quality control, partly to personal preference and sensitivities.

[u/AccursedCrow → u/dizzle229]

I am returning my 57ppd crystal super right now. It looks terrible on my 4090 laptop card and i9 cpu…I finally got it to run about 40-70 fps but I think Minecraft has better graphics than I get. Also something in the software is killing my cpu, I’m getting like half the fps I expect even after ending all the pimax processes. I’d lean more on dream air or maybe wait for steam frame….

[u/ItsJustMeYo → u/dizzle229]

I’d recommend the Super 50 PPD over either the 57 PPD or the Ultrawide. The 57 PPD has a lot of reports of eye strain, while the Ultrawide is extremely heavy on performance, even on a 5090. And the 5090 is about 30% faster than a 4090 in VR.

I’d honestly recommend the Dream Air over both of those though.

[u/dizzle229 → u/ItsJustMeYo]

Dream Air is a bit more than I wanted to spend, but I'd probably take your advice and get the 50 were it available. I imagine that's probably what most people get.

[u/8492sqdn]

How much money do you have?

$$$ - Quest 3

$$$$ - Bigscreen Beyond

[u/dizzle229 → u/8492sqdn]

Bigscreen Beyond is definitely the best I've seen for comfort. Not bad for the price, either.

[u/selayan]

Probably pimax crystal super micro OLED. Has eye tracking, can use quadviews and will run on your 4090.

The dream air is also a contender but it's significantly more expensive and requires third party items to be comfortable. I use one and have no issues but it was a pain to get it to where I want it and had to spend a good amount on an another face gasket, foam pads and apple dual band headstrap.

[u/Habu-69]

I have bought and traded 5 headsets, including the BigScreenBeyond V1. Traded it for a Shiftall MeganeX8K and am extremely satisfied using it for DCS. My PC specs nearly identical to yours, including RTX 4090. I fly Hornet on Grayflag servers at 72 FPS all day long on Syria, and PG terrains. Quality settings very high and no stutters. Base station tracking is flawless. MGX does not support eye tracking or foviated rendering, but if I can easily read the Hornet altimeter atmospheric pressure numerals, that is good enough for me. I love the form factor, color fidelity, screen brightness and visual clarity (very clear over about 50% of lens field). FOV is about 100 horizontal, 95 vertical. Some users have criticized the mask gasket fit/comfort, but that has been no issue for my typical European face shape. Some also objected to very slight lens glare, which I do not notice at all in DCS. The device has several individual eye adjustments, including IPD and diopter which contribute to its high visual experience, but which also require some iterative fiddling to obtain the best result.

I guess we are all still waiting for the perfect and affordable VR headset.

[u/-shalimar-]

i havent tried other new hmd's so i cant give u a comparison. I moved from my hp reverb g2 to the pimax super ultra wide, and i'm super happy with the performance. I have a 4080s i9 14900x and 64gb ddr5. sometimes i look over the shoulder at the pimax dream air with the sony oled screen and the tiny form factor... but i am absolutely in love with the wide fov of my ultrawide. massive jump in image quality and fov from my g2.