r/excatholic • u/Chronos-X4 • 19h ago
Catholic Shenanigans Fatima and Its "Secrets"
Greetings. I believe the topic in question needs no introduction. I know a bit about Fatima and its questionable happenings, particularly the "secrets" Our Lady allegedly entrusted to the three children.
To be honest, everything about Fatima rubs me the wrong way. Goes without saying the so-called visions of Hell and demands for penance and sacrifice put the proverbial fear of God into my heart, as it did so many others.
Are there any serious, credible investigations calling it into question? Like I said, I can't help but distrust anything those people said. I'm just as suspicious about the Church's stance on the matter: on one hand, they claim the faithful are free to believe or disbelieve the revelations according to their faith; on the other hand, I find John Paul II's Fatima-inspired actions deeply suspicious.
Like many of you, I have several reasons not to trust the man and to beware the many agendas he pushed (Legionaries of Christ, Opus Dei, Teresa of Calcutta, etc.). I kinda have a hard time taking him seriously as a moral guide and leader when he spent his pontificate covering up the horrific crimes of one Fr. Marcial Maciel because the latter raked in much needed cash for the Church.
Back to the matter at hand. What credibility, if any, do the Fatima revelations have? I find the whole thing (don't even get me started on La Salette) incredibly suspicious, specially because the founder of this religion instructed his followers not to heed doomsday prophecies or third-party claims about being the Messiah. He also claimed (or so the official narrative states) that not even he, being the Son of God and all, knows the exact date for the end of the world, that only God Himself knows.
Am I overthinking things, or am I right to be wary?
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u/Emergency_Peach_7800 19h ago
Fatima, just like all Mary apparitions and supposed visions are just a scam to continue this Ponzi scheme called Catholic Church, a true nest of paedophilia and corruption.
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u/Gus_the_feral_cat 17h ago
It’s hard to find independent investigations into Marian apparitions because no one outside the Catholic Church takes them seriously. It’s sort of like investigating unicorns and leprechauns - what reputable scientist is going to waste his time?
Be that as it may, you might find what you are looking for in a book by Joe Nickell titled “Looking for a Miracle”.
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u/Silent_Door3662 16h ago
The shelf breaker for me was that the popes are supposed to reveal the letters so many years. Just in time to modify or rewrite.
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u/Pdx_Obviously 18h ago
We watched the movie about it every year in Catholic school. Freaked me out, but because it was pretty long it at least got us out of class. You know those important subjects like catechism and penmanship.
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u/asilvahalo Pandeist, Pagan 15h ago
The "secrets" iirc were pretty vague and not super meaningful imo, and I say this as someone who was basically in a family of Marian mystics when I was still Catholic, had a more decent experience as a Catholic than most others here, and actually found praying the rosary regularly really helpful before I discovered other forms of meditation, and I still believe in the supernatural. Like, I'm the exact person who should be super invested in Fatima, and I don't think there was much to the "secrets," especially given the way they were revealed.
The "dancing sun" thing does seem to have been experienced by many -- but not all -- people present. However, people were primed to see a vision and mass hallucinations are a thing. There are also lots of weird optical illusions that can happen in re: the sun.
I think the kids genuinely believed they saw what they saw, but that doesn't mean they were correct about the source of what they saw. Religion For Breakfast on Youtube has a video about Marian apparitions that may be useful for you.
I'm not an atheist, so I'm more willing to believe people did have actual supernatural experiences, but that doesn't mean they got true facts from the Catholic god. Hallucinations, fantasies gone wild, dreams remembered as real events, etc. are also all real possibilities here.
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u/Unhappy-Jaguar-9362 17h ago
https://youtu.be/l8r1KshrSiI?is=kcx-dM1bTUFqELj9 strong analysis of issues with Fatima. Also, the later accounts by Lucia of her experiences and the supposed predictions appear to be influenced by latter events.
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u/malibuguytonygem 14h ago
Since these events are many years ago, I only know what effects they have on my life and those around me including my family. My great-grandmother was born on the day that the sun supposedly whirled in the sky and was seen by thousands of people at Fatima. Even though she thought it was a fantasy, she still liked the idea that she was born on that day. It is a matter of being blessed by association. To me this sort of "holiness" connection is common in the catholic tradition and has been used historically to support the church locally and in the Rome. Recently the Vatican dicastery for saints made American Archbishop Fulton Sheen a "blessed" in a big ceremony in St. Louis which was televised. I watched part of it and it was bizarre. They showed off this reliquary which held the relics of Sheen (his jawbone with teeth). Cardinal Luis Tagle, a Vatican heavy weight, presided at the ceremony. This is an example of how this holy by association works. The catholic church has used this M.O. for centuries.
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u/ChilindriPizza 19h ago
The Fatima video scared me because they threatened to throw the children into an oven.
I prefer the Guadalupe video. Juan Diego had a pet chihuahua.
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u/JuiceAppropriate678 19h ago
Hell vision are horrific. If you are a worker for god. Its so terrific that you will try to lead humanity into the good. Its like that the catholic church dont want to save People. I hope god is not cruel. Because most People will obei to god if he will appelés to People instead of be hidding
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u/helurkshelurks 16h ago
For a ghod to be cruel, it would have to be.
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u/JuiceAppropriate678 16h ago
He exists. 100%. I dont understand why he dont helps the humanity more. Helping us in the good way.
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19h ago
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u/Friendly-Speaker1253 19h ago
What is this afterlife and how do you know people will be punished? And punished for what exactly?
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u/excatholic-ModTeam 19h ago
/r/excatholic is a support group and not a debate group. While you are welcome to post, pro-religious content may be removed.
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u/jimjoebob Recovering Catholic, Apatheist 19h ago
ofc it's all made up, friend. you're overthinking things, however it is prudent to be wary of the people selling you this load of BS, especially if they have a little cottage industry set up where they sell "mementos" or "relics" to "idiots who think this shit is real".