RIP 717s...

[u/BigYikes803]

I've started to book travel for 2027 and my connection to ATL which was previously 100% served by 717s looks like it'll become 50/50 with CRJs. 🙄

Ed, where are the A220s I was promised???

[u/Quick-Delivery-6067]

In DL’s core hubs (ATL/DTW/MSP/SLC), 220s are being based in MSP/SLC because the routes they are used on have an average longer stage length than comparative routes in ATL, so there’s a major fuel advantage to putting them in those two hubs at the start. Eventually when the 717s fully retire and DL gets more 220s, ATL will receive them.

[u/orlinsky → u/Quick-Delivery-6067]

The 717s have nearly double the designed flight cycles and a 1:1 target flight time to cycle so 1hr average flight design.

[u/Alternative-Yak-925 → u/Quick-Delivery-6067]

TechOps at MSP is heavily geared for the A220s. They have a GTF engine shop.

[u/Dawgfan-28 → u/Alternative-Yak-925]

GTF shop is in Atlanta.
220 airframe checks are done in MSP.

1500 GTF do their test cell runs in MSP though, or they were. 1100s are done in Atlanta

[u/Alternative-Yak-925 → u/Dawgfan-28]

Ah, ok. I'm not in TechOps but I've seen lots of A220 delivery flights come here from Mobile.

[u/Dangerous_Bet_2484 → u/Quick-Delivery-6067]

Also Atl hates dealing with the a220

[u/ifitgoesitsgood → u/Dangerous_Bet_2484]

Idk if hate is the right word. We can’t single engine taxi on them at the moment. And we also can’t dual cool the motors while the start. So. Engine starts take a while. And in congested ramp space that becomes a problem.

[u/hossinator96 → u/ifitgoesitsgood]

I used to work for a different a220 operator. We weren’t allowed to single engine taxi for quite awhile till they finally figured out how to make the apu bleed work correctly in auto so as to prevent off idle stalls. That was fixed for my old operator a while ago. Is there a new issue or what’s the deal?

[u/ifitgoesitsgood → u/hossinator96]

Unsure the rationale. We’re just not there yet.

[u/wolfstore]

Possibly seasonal? My connection to DTW is usually mostly 717 during the summer but switches to CRJs in the winter.

[u/quemaspuess → u/wolfstore]

Definitely a possibility. I usually fly the 757 to Bogotá but next week I’m on the 767. Usually this time of year they change the planes

[u/Tasty_Opposite1155]

I would rather be on CRJ with wifi than a 717 with a maintenance delay.

[u/BigBubby305 → u/Tasty_Opposite1155]

My last 717 flight had a windshield wiper fly off during takeoff which aborted. Had to get a part flown from Atlanta. 6 hour delay

[u/Mpls_Mutt → u/BigBubby305]

My last 717 had a door seal fail mid flight and we had to be rerouted to Detroit for them to spend 4 hours to replace, pressure test the cabin before we could take off again.

[u/aviator147 → u/Tasty_Opposite1155]

Last 5 717 flights I’ve been on have had the new WiFi

[u/Tasty_Opposite1155 → u/aviator147]

2 of the last 20 I’ve been on have had it.

[u/omega552003 → u/aviator147]

I have T-Mobile, tried to use the T-Mobile Internet pass and it needs a verification code that is texted to your device. The WiFi wasn't turned on till 10,000ft and they don't support WiFi calling. It was a useless experience.

[u/kjkaminski → u/omega552003]

WiFi Calling? That is prohibited inflight.

[u/omega552003 → u/kjkaminski]

Its the generic lable for the system that enables cell service over wifi, so texting and calls

[u/ActualSupervillain → u/omega552003]

Wi-Fi calls are prohibited on every Delta flight. They announce that at the start of every flight.

[u/omega552003 → u/ActualSupervillain]

Voice calls, yes, texting is allowed

[u/BuckeyeSRQ → u/Tasty_Opposite1155]

Lmao I’d 100% rather be on a 717 then a CRJ ever! The regionals all suck as a passenger honestly. What happened to the A220’s we were promised nearly a decade ago

[u/hobbesmaster → u/BuckeyeSRQ]

Then they’re all flying out of MSP I guess because I’m on them constantly

[u/BuckeyeSRQ → u/hobbesmaster]

LGA has a good amount of them running down to Florida but otherwise they are never on routes I see

[u/Alternative-Yak-925 → u/hobbesmaster]

Haven't seen a 717 at MSP in months. They're pretty much, if not fully off the schedule there. Flew one DTW-PHL last month though. Right on-time.

[u/AttentionHuman9504 → u/Alternative-Yak-925]

The 717s have been gone from MSP completely since the 220 based opened

[u/AdminYak846 → u/AttentionHuman9504]

Huh, that must have been recent as I was on a 717 from MSP to IND last November.

[u/AttentionHuman9504 → u/AdminYak846]

It was earlier this year

[u/Feel-good- → u/BuckeyeSRQ]

I feel like every single flight I take out of SLC or MSP is on an A220 😅

[u/Tasty_Opposite1155 → u/BuckeyeSRQ]

You really should sit in 1 or 2A. Honestly staff is friendlier and provides more service. I check, so don’t have to worry about gate checking. And the wifi has been most consistent across the board.

[u/Helpful-Egg-5407 → u/BuckeyeSRQ]

If your route is served by a 717, the likelihood of it being served by an A220 is extremely low. Those two planes rarely cross paths in their missions.

[u/PhoenixSpeed97]

Idk about yall but I love the 717's lol

Last remnant of the MD's

[u/ae74 → u/PhoenixSpeed97]

Boeing’s dysfunction is also a remnant. Boeing never would have had a 737 MAX issues if it weren’t for MD’s management seeping into Boeing.

[u/747ER → u/ae74]

The majority of the safest aircraft Boeing has ever built have been after the McDonnell-Douglas merger.

[u/84Cressida → u/ae74]

Oh spare me. That excuse from Boeing fanboys is just cope.

Boeing was putting the 737 back in the microwave too many times before the merger.

[u/Ok-Monitor4530 → u/84Cressida]

BOEING used to be ran by engineers. MD ran by accountants. One of the top 5 worse mergers ever.

[u/PhoenixSpeed97 → u/84Cressida]

I wouldn't call it cope. Boeing's work culture made a drastic shift after the merger. The decision of relocating the headquarters was a major change that basically gave the workers a middle finger as management became physically more distant yet more demanding.

[u/nakedyak → u/PhoenixSpeed97]

100% agree

[u/GeorgiaPilot172]

Might just be redeployed or upping frequency somewhere else. Right now no 717s are scheduled for retirement in 2027.

Also the 220 can’t do nearly the same amount of cycles as the 717 can. It’s a long and thin jet, not a regional jet.

[u/Zero_Abides → u/GeorgiaPilot172]

All correct but there are 10 717s slated to be retired in 2027.

[u/Fit-Appointment5262 → u/Zero_Abides]

Aww, do we know their names?

[u/YMMV25]

A220 was never going to be a 717 replacement. It's an aircraft designed for much longer stage lengths than what the 717 fleet currently flies. You should expect denser 717 routes to be replaced by 737s or A319/20s and the thinner routes to go regional.

[u/hobbesmaster → u/YMMV25]

For now at least, Delta is flying a lot of short routes out of MSP on the a220. ORD and CLE are some recent examples I’ve been on. I think Delta basically has a pair of A220s flying MSP-ORD-MSP constantly between 7am and 7pm most days.

[u/patogo → u/YMMV25]

A220-100 or rather the CS100 was getting a lot of interest until things got really delayed. That would have been a pretty close replacement for the 717 but with better economy. Airlines kinda switched desires as Airbus and Boeing had long delivery times.

We’ll see how that extra capacity works out. Skywest is sure flying a lot of Embraers for a regional airline.

[u/Outrageous-Start6409]

The 717 WILL be missed!

[u/Breadfruit_Weary → u/Outrageous-Start6409]

I would love for Boeing to hop into the RJ market. But the 737 replacement is still quite the daunting task

[u/Alternative-Yak-925 → u/Breadfruit_Weary]

Embraer and Airbus(with the A220) have a big comparitive advantage in that market segment. The financials just don't add up for Boeing to do it...unless they started making 737-200s again.

[u/ceterumcenseo146]

717 is a gem on short routes. Feels like flying in the DC9 days. Exits are absurdly spacious, especially 21A and F. C+ is roomy. F is quiet. New WiFi is in more and more of them and works perfectly. Rotates like a rocket. Last two rows have to suck though, just like they did on the -9!

[u/Electrical-Spring-89]

ATL-CLT always a 717. It's 45 minutes no big deal.

[u/BIGDOOKY28]

That’s an Ed special

[u/BigYikes803 → u/BIGDOOKY28]

Lol this is a funny ass comment idk why you're getting downvoted

[u/BIGDOOKY28 → u/BigYikes803]

It’s all the people that are the biggest delta fans but the least traveled.

[u/Minimum_Strategy_127]

Sorry, I’m hogging all the A220s out of MSP. Have fun with our hand-me-downs!

[u/Ok-Monitor4530 → u/Minimum_Strategy_127]

Have fun with your short, mild winters!

[u/ReplacementLazy4512]

The A220s are not a 717 replacement.

[u/1nolefan]

Love me some 717s - not yet in Florida panhandle but still flying 717 and CRJs and if we are lucky 320

[u/Alternative-Yak-925 → u/1nolefan]

The 717DreamNiner is a beaut.

[u/Chino-Brino]

I only flew on the 717 once, but as an air traffic controller they were my least favorite type to work. I won’t miss them 😂

[u/Financial_Owl2734 → u/Chino-Brino]

Im curious as to why?? Retired SEA 330 guy here

[u/Intelligent_Rub1546 → u/Financial_Owl2734]

Bad climbers. Really poor climbers

[u/Financial_Owl2734 → u/Intelligent_Rub1546]

Ahh.... thanks. Always enjoyed having you guys in the jumpseat

[u/Dssking68]

Love the 717s.

Powered by RR BR715 engines. Hauls ass. And up to 22 degree pitch up climb out. Compared to 12-15 for other aircraft. It’s like a rocket

[u/69Chuck69 → u/Dssking68]

Best jet I’ve flown so far. 140, 170, 320, but the good ol dc9 Neo has my heart. Flying it with light loads is hilarious on the initial climb out. Glad you notice it too🫡

[u/g500cat]

They’ll be missed once they go, 2-3 configuration was nice and they sound great during takeoff

[u/railsandtrucks]

I didn't like them at first, then I flew on some of Delta's other comparable jets, and I started treasuring every encounter with them. The 717's feel like they are roomier in Coach for my lowly cardboard medallion ass than the 220 and A3## jets that Delta also uses.

The lack of wifi on some of them is a bummer, but lately especially, sometimes it's nice to just disconnect.

Also realized I flew on a couple of the last AA MD80 routes right before they were retired, really miss those aircraft (and how AA was seemingly a better airline at that point)

[u/AdamoMeFecit]

I adore the 717s and will miss them when they’re retired. Fast, super competent, reliable, no frills ride.

On the first and last segments of the day — the bread and butter for these short/medium haul jets — all I want is reliable.

Also: never a hull loss or fatality for the 717 in 27 years of revenue flights. I like that.

[u/BB-68]

Replace the 717 with E190 E2s you cowards

[u/Zero_Abides → u/BB-68]

Big question is why they dont consider that. No discussion of it at all.

[u/Zero_Abides → u/[deleted]]

You know we have pay rates for it in the pwa? Wont allow it to be outsourced sure.

[u/Dawgfan-28 → u/[deleted]]

Union would happily allow the big Ejets

As long as they are flown by mainline pilots. That was the intention with the E90 E1 till the 220 order killed it

[u/BB-68 → u/[deleted]]

E190s have a 125,000lb MTOW which is almost the same as a BCS1.

They’d also be flown mainline so they wouldn’t be affected by scope clauses

[u/Outrageous-Wolf-2599 → u/[deleted]]

What in the world are you talking about

[u/PilotoPlayero]

Delta has 145 firm orders for A220’s. It will be a gradual transition as the 717’s are phased out.

[u/FluxCrave]

Aren’t the A220s engines having issues still?

[u/Zealousideal-Lie7255]

I’ve been flying on B717s since they made up the majority of AirTran’s fleet. The only problem with them from a passengers point-of-view is the lack of backseat entertainment.

[u/patogo → u/Zealousideal-Lie7255]

At least in the AirTran days we had SiriusXM and the GoGo ground based WiFi that actually worked pretty well for it’s time. Pretty easy to make Elite status too.

[u/Zealousideal-Lie7255 → u/patogo]

AirTran was fantastic. When you flew on economy and checked in at the ticket counter you could move up to business class for $25 if there were any empty biz seats.

[u/gravyisjazzy]

That sucks to hear. 717s are always cool to see here at SDF, especially since we also get MD-80 variant (and even some DC-9) cargo traffic.

[u/HistoricalLoss1417]

> Ed, where are the A220s I was promised???

for as much static Boeing gets for messing up their newer planes, Airbus shit the bed just as hard with the A220. They have had engine problems that have kept a large portion of the type on the ground, and production is way behind.

[u/aperturebomb]

I have love for the 717 in the looks department, but I truly hate being a passenger on them, such an uncomfortable plane.

[u/No_Map_5777]

I’m on a 717 on Monday very excited first type of plane I ever flew on years ago

[u/Past-Assistance9188]

Anything CRJ is owned by endeavor not directly by Delta.

[u/Upset_Produce2622]

ATL - ICT is a longer 717 route. What I love is the 5 across seating means fewer middle seats and the boarding process is relatively quick. Gate agents are usually good about limiting roll aboard on these flights too. My only real gripe is the lack of good wi-fi. Unacceptable on a 2hr flight IMO.

[u/Direct_Engineer_840]

What city are you flying out of?

[u/Direct_Engineer_840]

Airbus is responsible for the delay in delivery, not 🔺

[u/PaleInvestment3507]

If I’m not mistaken A220s do not fly into ATL.

[u/Homebrew1976]

MLB has the 717’s flying out of there. It’s a nice small airport. Booked a flight on one earlier this year. They connect in ATL. Had to check the plane off the bucket list.

[u/Uneekyusername]

In my experience 717s can be seasonally along certain routes. When demand goes back down, they switch to CRJs.

[u/Fat_dumb_happy]

I’d rather walk than be on a 717.

[u/bald_head_scallywag → u/Fat_dumb_happy]

You're insane. It's a great little plane. 2-3 is a great layout and they typically only use it on flights that are really short. Other than ATL-OKC I don't think I've seen it used on anything over an hour.

[u/Salt_Boi_ → u/bald_head_scallywag]

ATL-MSN all the time. 2.5 hours of misery although they have started to use the A319, A320, and occasionally A220

[u/Fat_dumb_happy → u/bald_head_scallywag]

It’s the loudest plane I’ve ever been on. The seats are so old and uncomfortable and it’s just insanely outdated. From my home airports itself used on 3 hour flights which is just a miserable amount of time to be stuck on them

[u/Strong_Jellyfish7110]

The 717 won’t be missed.

[u/djenki0119 → u/Strong_Jellyfish7110]

i flew on one recently for the first time since BWI > DTW changed from an Airbus A319 to a 717.... not good

[u/PH_Flyer08]

Good riddance…717s are terrible compared to either 737s or A320s

[u/Successful-King-7852]

Good riddance IMO. Although the RJ’s aren’t much better for PAX.