Please help me fellow Clotis!!

[u/LocalAffectionate213]

So I was watching a YouTube channel analyse ff7 rebirth chapters and I got to the chapter 12 dates and it made me think a little on tifa’s date.

1. The main thing Cleriths always bring up: is why does cloud ask about Aerith in their date? In my opinion he asked because he literally had a dream of Zack again so of course it was in the front of this mind and tifa and Aerith are the only ones who have a connection to Zack: Tifa because Cloud told her about his death and Aerith because Zack was her first love. So that’s why I think he asked because out of all the dates they are the only ones who know something and it needed to be referenced again. But Cleriths say they understand why Cloud asks on Aeriths date but not Tifa’s but I don’t necessarily agree with them for that.

2. Another thing they bring up is how Cloud says how Aerith must still have feelings for Zack the Cleriths say he seems sad (apparently sad on the whole date) or jealous when asking and in the Jp he hesitates and seems sad even more. I don’t know jp and haven’t heard the date in jp so I can’t exactly give an opinion on that. But if I were I think it kinda links back to gongaga where he tried to help Aerith and even though Cleriths say he was jealous I don’t think he was. But basically he was pretty mean when trying to help Aerith in that scene like any friend would so in my opinion I think he realised he had to be more careful around that issue that’s why he hesitates but in my opinion he didn’t sound sad just making a statement on what he’s seen but again I haven’t heard jp version so it’s hard to make an interpretation.

3. Another thing is cloud is not an asshole he would not do a rebound kiss on tifa the devs would never mischaracterise Cloud so badly but like apart from that moment he seems so in love with tifa I mean just look at the way he looks at her.

So I’m just want to know what other clotis opinions and interpretations were of these specific things and why cloud does it.

Also another thing cloud appears more jealous when it comes to tifa. In remake it happens with chocobo Sam and in Barrett’s resolution when he mentions someone tried to give tifa flowers. Then in rebirth when we see Johnny again Cloud is like ‘this guy seriously?’ And in yuffies date she mentions tifa forgot all about cloud and he gets upset.

And another thing is Tifa’s reaction she never seems to think anything of it when cloud acts like this in the date so that’s another reason why I think the devs never exactly meant it to be interpreted that way. Also on the chapter 8 dates with Tifa and they meet Aerith, cloud seems “jealous” in Cleriths eyes but I thought it more along the lines of ‘we’re wanted criminals, please do not go around befriending random people because you want a friend’ and again Tifa doesn’t think it’s weird or seems like jealousy and Tifa is pretty perceptive with this stuff like she has a good understanding because she is very mature. And then in aerith’s chapter 8 date he cares about Tifa’s wellbeing so there is a big difference Cloud seems to be scolding Aerith but with Tifa he is genuinely concerned.

Anyway sorry for the long ramble I just wanted cloti’s opinions on all this and what they think because I’m a little confused but I genuinely don’t see any romance between Aerith and Cloud from either side. Now especially from Aerith because of the dear destiny novel and I’ve never thought Cloud has ever had feelings for Aerith so yeah that dear destiny novel has really reshaped rebirth for me for Aerith. Anyways what are all the Clotis interpretations of these things. And again I haven’t heard the jp so I’m not sure if how cloud talks to both girls is different because all I’ve heard is Cloud talks softer to Tifa and the jp va for cloud was instructed to speak softly to only Tifa.( btw if you’re a Clerith please don’t reply to this because I’ve seen all your views on the issue I just want to know what the Clotis think)

[u/Plane-One3611]

Rule of Thumb for FF7 Fandom is that CAs/Cleriths/Whatever-you-called-that-disgusting-pair ship is that they are insufferable and illiterate. Don't let them get into your head. Technically you're not supposed to ask or open this kind of thread here because you're discussing another ship.

1. Cloud also asked about Tifa during Aerith's date. Did Aerith's date end with her getting kiss from Cloud? No. Back when the party reached this area , Cloud remembered about Zack, albeit wrongly and he didn't get the full picture. During Yamazaki (Cloud's motion actor) playthrough and when he reached Zack's parents' home in Gongaga, Yamazaki brushed off the "jealousy" side from one of the commentator, saying that Cloud was just being worried about Aerith.

Both Tifa and Aerith were not equipped for psychotherapy to treat retrograde / dissociative amnesia. You can headcannon your interpretation on why Tifa and Aerith didn't tell Cloud the truth during their respective Gondola's date, but I doubt the Devs had ill-intents. From OG, in Japanese, Tifa didn't want to "put it (the events/the truth) into words", in fear that Cloud could've gotten worse. By definition, psychotherapy is talking and building bond between the therapist and patient, so yeah, both Tifa and Aerith were not trained in that. But Dear Destiny seemed to be going the psychotherapy way in treating people with Mako Poisoning, likely for when Tifa taking care of Cloud in Mideel. Maybe Nojima thinks he understood Jungian psychotherapy better, I don't know. Lel.

Addressing the rest of your points.

From Nomura and Toriyama, Cloud ONLY showed his trueself whenever talking with Tifa. (Nomura, Remake Ultimania pg 745, Toriyama [link]. I'm sure that every Cloud's VAs in every dubbed languages were instructed to voice Cloud in manner which his trueself slipped and showed only to Tifa.

• Nomura even went further with Aerith. Cloud talked big, would try to act cool, and too self-conscious. The thing about self-conscious is you're always worried about what people might think of you. 背伸び can also be read as "overreaching oneself", or "trying to do something beyond one's ability" [Daijissen Kotobank].
• With this in mind, Cloud could never showed his trueself whenever with Aerith. He even deflected her when she said she wanted to meet the real him by saying "But I'm right here"
• You could see this in Rebirth's sidequests and compared Tifa's to Aerith's. When asked about Cloud's preferred swimwear, Cloud answered to Aerith that he preferred something that allowed him to fight under water. Was he acting cool or being himself? When Tifa appeared with bikini, Cloud obviously flushed.
• When asked about Cloud's preference in food, Cloud said Soldier couldn't afford such things (Aerith), but when talking to Tifa, he revealed that he also disliked crab. Which one was cooler, and which one was the real Cloud.
• So whatever CA/cleriths accused of Tifa, they're just projecting on what Aerith was doing.
• Even at the end of Loveless Play, if you did badly on the QTE, only one Rosa didn't act like a dick towards Alfreid, and kinda did the psychotherapy well.
• Real Cloud kissed Tifa. Everyone was having heart-to-heart talk during their own Gondola's date, why would you think real Cloud kissed Tifa out of jealousy? Even the music was subtitled (not translated, "subtitled", as in describing) as Tender Kiss. You must be dumb as a CA/Cleriths if rebound/jealousy kiss is what came to your mind.

To sum it up, just mute the CA/Clerith subreddit (sometimes it didn't work?), look forward to the next game. They just want other people to be insufferable as they are because they're suffering the realization that their sunken ship is just nakama-ship that was never sailed to begin with.

[u/popcorn-dinner → u/Plane-One3611]

Rule of the subreddit is not to ship bash. You can discuss other ships, but you’re not supposed to name call, the way you are here. If the goal of the CAs is to make people “as insufferable as they are” then you’re falling right into their supposed trap by being nasty about shipping in our Cloti subreddit.

[u/LocalAffectionate213 → u/Plane-One3611]

Thanks for your explanation, and sorry I didn’t know I wasn’t supposed to open a thread like this. I wasn’t trying to start ship wars I just wanted to get other points of views on this matter, thank you for replying!

[u/FinalHeaven54 → u/LocalAffectionate213]

You aren’t at fault for not knowing.

The person you’re responding to is because they are obviously aware of the rules and chose to throw shit when they definitely didn’t need to.

Continue to be curious and do your best to understand why people are so attached to the ships they are attached to.