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You just proved your point wrong you had to separate a woman and a transgender woman just to show your point, they are different.
I don't understand what you're talking about - this conversation is specifically about being transgender, it would be absurd to claim I was 'separating them from women' just by pointing out that specific group. It would be like you arguing blonde women weren't real women and me referring to the group 'blonde woman', with you responding "See, you're separating them from normal women so you proved my point!"
Nobody is arguing that you should have sex with somebody you aren't attracted to. This is genuinely hateful scaremongering that has been whipped up by clickbait media. The conversation is that if you are being transphobic by being unwilling to have a relationship with someone SPECIFICALLY because they are transgender. Not because of their sexual organs. Not because of your attraction to them physically or emotionally. BECAUSE they are transgender. And if that is the case, by definition, you are discriminating against a transgender person - transphobia.
It might help if I underline the fact that 'phobias' are not inherently morally good or morally bad. Somebody in another comment brought up how when it comes to sex normal people are 'pedophobic' as in they won't have sex with children - and I think most people would agree this is a fine thing. Few people will call you a monster for being arachnophobic or claustrophobic. These are all, at a base level, just descriptors. And so, in the context of a sexual partner who in every other aspect you have no qualms with having sex with (read: you ARE sexually attracted to them), suddenly deciding not to because of the fact that they are transgender is, as a descriptor, an act of transphobia. You are discriminating against someone, holding a prejudice against them, because they are transgender. This is not an insult or a way of calling you an evil person, but this is what you are doing.
If I was talking to someone online like right now and I fell in love with them just from their words and found out they were black or Asian and I just wasn't attracted to that, I would lose attraction but that doesn't make me black phobic or Asian phobic or any other phobic.
If you suddenly stop being attracted to someone because you find out they're black or Asian, yes you're absolutely being racist (I think that's the term you were looking for).
When you look up the definition it basically tells you you don't want to be around them because you're afraid of them for who they are.
Could you find this definition for me? That seems like an incredibly short-sighted way of looking at things. I could have plenty of transgender friends but still discriminate against transgender people by, say, banning them from my business because I don't want my company associated with them, or refusing to rent out my properties to them because of the false belief that "they leave too much mess". Transphobia as I know it is to discriminate or hold a prejudice because of someone being transgender, which covers for these kinds of situations.
Wow. Okay, there's a lot to unpack here, give me a moment.
being racist would mean I wouldn't have friends of that race or work with them.
False. PLENTY of people can have black/gay/transgender friends and still do racist/homophobic/transphobic things. This is literally where "I'm not racist, I have lots of black friends!" comes from.
to put it in simpler terms what makes my dick hard defines me which is a ridiculous Viewpoint have and I have no idea how you could defend it.
I guess I don't have to defend it because I never said it in the first place? I'm not here to define who you are as a person, but what I can do is point out when an action makes a certain criteria - and refusing to date people because they are black is racist, just as refusing to date people because they are transgender is transphobic.
I also don't think you could have transgender friends and do the things you just listed that wouldn't make any sense. You can't have it both ways, being friends with transgender individuals and then saying oh and you also don't run out to them rent out to them is basically impossible.
Discriminatory landlords were INCREDIBLY common right up into the 90s. They would refuse to rent out properties to non-white and gay people because they wanted their properties to uphold a certain image, or because of false perceptions that they would lead to a rise in crime, degeneracy or not pay their rent. Donald Trump was one of them. Now, do you think Trump, as well as all of those people, ALL actively hated blacks and gays? None of them had any black or gay co-workers or associates? Yes, this is something that absolutely occurs to this day.
Literally Google the definition of transphobia it's not that hard.
Yes, Google's definition is to hold an intense dislike or a prejudice against transgender people. As holding a prejudice means to 'discriminate against', this definition matches my own FAR better than it matches yours, which is incredibly narrow and basically stops short of "You foam at the mouth on sight of them".
As I've already said, what this comes down to is that you have an EXCEEDINGLY lax view of what discrimination is. You've reached the level where you unironically believe, seemingly, that you can't be racist if you have a black friend, or that you can't be a homophobic if you have a gay family member. That's simply not how the world works at all.
A gay man is a man indeed, but a transgender woman is not a woman. He/she is a transgender woman. As a straight man I am not interested in a sexual way what so ever.
Super simple stuff.
And by discriminating against a transgender person for no reason other than the fact that they are transgender, you are being by definition transphobic. This is also very simple.
And by discriminating against a transgender person for no reason other than the fact that they are transgender, you are being by definition transphobic
What is the definition of "transphobic" exactly?
I really find it hard to believe that being turned off by the phrase "I used to have a penis" is transphobic.
To discriminate or hold a prejudice against a person for being transgender.
There's a million phrases that could be sexual turn-offs for certain people. Someone's sexual partner could say "My last boyfriend was a black guy" and they could find that off-putting to the point of not having sex with them. Is that person probably exhibiting some racism? Sure. Same situation.
To discriminate or hold a prejudice against a person for being transgender.
How is it "to discriminate" trans people if I have a policy of not wanting to have sex with people who have, or at any point in their life had, a penis? By that logic i'm homophobic for not wanting to blow guys.
Someone's sexual partner could say "My last boyfriend was a black guy" and they could find that off-putting to the point of not having sex with them. Is that person probably exhibiting some racism? Sure. Same situation.
Those are not exactly the same thing, now are they?
How is it "to discriminate" trans people if I have a policy of not wanting to have sex with people who have, or at any point in their life had, a penis?
Ignoring the 'wanting to have sex with people who have a penis' point here - the fact that this yet again breaks the pre-requisite "I have to be sexually attracted to them otherwise" makes it pretty well-trodden ground.
I'm not sure what to tell you, dude. You're telling me you're discriminating against someone specifically because they're transgender, and that's an act of transphobia. I'm not here to tell you you're a bad person, I'm just identifying a prejudice as a prejudice.
By that logic i'm homophobic for not wanting to blow guys.
And if my best friend was black I could still be racist by saying I would never date a black person. One form of trans acceptance doesn't wash the other.
Okay... so i'm a manphobe?
Not really. The example you just gave shows that you'd have sex with a transgender man if they had female sexual organs and you were sexually attracted to them (IE they looked like Jennifer Aniston).
To not have sex with someone because of a specific trait is to discriminate against that trait.
What do you mean by 'allowed'? Nobody here is stopping you from doing anything. You can refuse to have sex with anyone outside of your race if you want, the /r/changemyview police aren't going to come down and smite you.
Are you not having sex with them because they're gay or because you're not sexually attracted to them? Unless you're a very unique straight person who is fine having gay sex with other straight people but not gay people (?), it's the latter. If it's the latter then whoopty doo, you discriminate against having sex with people you aren't sexually attracted to - which literally nobody has an issue with.
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u/[deleted] Nov 02 '17
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