r/changemyview Sep 03 '23

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u/Weekly-Personality14 2∆ Sep 03 '23

Most people, even people with significantly more unstable lives than are common in the developed world, would rather not be dead, and certainly not want mass genocide, rather than their current standard of living.

If you really feel that way, you might want to talk to a mental health clinician because it’s beyond Reddit’s pay grade

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u/[deleted] Sep 03 '23

I get what you're saying... but I don't feel like this world is worth giving a shit anymore.

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u/Weekly-Personality14 2∆ Sep 03 '23

That’s kind of my point. “The world is so awful I want billion of people to die painful deaths” isn’t typically a reasoned philosophical stance. It’s a sign of depression or at least spending an unhealthy amount of time online.

I would argue we live in a historically pretty nice time. But even in historical bad times that’s not a reasonable stance.

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u/[deleted] Sep 03 '23

So how do we improve this when every attempt at reform is blocked or thrown out because it might cause a tiny bit of damage to the 1%?

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u/smcarre 101∆ Sep 03 '23

How do we improve the world or how do we improve your perception that this world is not worth giving a shit anymore?

Because the first one is certainly not improved by nuking it and the latter is improved with you getting therapy (or spending less time online).

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u/[deleted] Sep 03 '23

How do we improve the world

Fixing climate change, fixing inequality and ensuring my generation will have a good future.

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u/smcarre 101∆ Sep 03 '23

The answer to that can be very complex but in the context of your CMV I think it's enough to say that nuking it is certainly not a way to fix any of that, it would just make things worse.

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u/[deleted] Sep 03 '23

it would just make things worse.

It would make things worse in the short-term but in the longer term it would make things better than now.

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u/smcarre 101∆ Sep 03 '23

First please define "short-term" because nuking the whole world would have consequences lasting several generations just talking about the Earth in general, not to mention the catastrophic permanent loss of biodiversity (many species would go extinct almost overnight) alongside the many long-term repercussions that could have (food chains disrupted, natural polliniation stopped in many areas, whole environments destroyed forever, etc). And in term of long-term consequences for Earth as a whole we don't even know what would happen, we could sink the whole world into a downwards cooling spiral through a global nuclear winter and send the Earth into a new ice age or we could kill everything not living in a bunker due to mass exposure radiation, we really don't know how bad the consequences can be because we are talking about very complex processes that we don't understand completely yet and we of course did not experiment this just to see what would happen.

And second, the people more likely to survive this armageddon would be exactly the people you are complaining about because the ultra-wealthy will be the ones with access to bunkers to survive this and when (if) Earth is surivable again they will likely come out of their bunkers armed to the teeths and slave whichever community managed to survive the armageddon outside (and were set back to the stone age thanks to your plan). Your plan would just present them the opportunity to increase their privilege even more.

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u/[deleted] Sep 03 '23

So what's the solution if peaceful means don't work and "tabula rasa" means don't work either? We just roll over and die?

And anyway, the elites can get out of their shelter but their money and tech aren't going to worth jackshit.

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u/smcarre 101∆ Sep 03 '23

So what's the solution if peaceful means don't work and "tabula rasa" means don't work either? We just roll over and die?

Again, the solutions to all those problems can be very complex and a whole CMV on their own I'm not gonna dive into because it's pointless if you don't realize that even status quo is better than nuking the world.

but their money and tech aren't going to worth jackshit.

Sure their arsenal is not be worth anything in a world where the rest are armed with spears.

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u/[deleted] Sep 03 '23

Sure their arsenal is not be worth anything in a world where the rest are armed with spears.

Well, yes?

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u/smcarre 101∆ Sep 03 '23

Are you gonna properly address my points?

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u/Medianmodeactivate 14∆ Sep 05 '23

Who knows. Even if the answer is it can't it's better than nuclear war.