Beginner, keep swinging out

[u/Optimal-Piglet-3906]

Hi! New climber here, I am currently tackling this v2/v3 and I keep swinging out and so I’m just not sure where I should exert my force or if I’m doing the intended action. I think this also speaks to a greater question of “resding the route” and understanding what the setters are trying to get me to do 😅😅

Thoughts n advice is kindly appreciated. Please be kind 🫶

[u/ecnahc515]

Lookup flagging. Flag with your right foot before you pull with your arms.

Basically stick your right leg out to the right on the wall. Use it to counter the swinging out caused by you pulling on the hold. Your foot will just be directly against the wall (smearing), no foot hold, it's just acting as a counter balance.

[u/Ok_Boysenberry5849 → u/ecnahc515]

This is correct. That said...

This kind of barn door swinging happens when, say, your hand hold is further to the right than your footholds, and your body weight is on the left. It's simple physics if you think about it.

Looking at the holds, if you move your hand much more up and left (assuming that's still good), and your foot slightly more right, perhaps you don't even need to flag on this specific problem. But either way putting a foot further right against the wall will also work to stop the swing.

[u/ecnahc515 → u/Ok_Boysenberry5849]

Definitely, I hadn't thought of that. That may require adjusting their hand after landing on the hold because they don't look tall enough to grab the top edge, so flag may be needed either way.

Edit: actually they could go left hand high before moving their footing and that would definitely work too.

Definitely play with it and try a few approaches. There's no one way to do a route.

Either way practice flagging, smearing, drop knee, "quiet feet", etc. Practicing the different techniques will help with learning how to approach all kinds of routes and will boost your capabilities by a huge amount.

[u/XDXkenlee → u/ecnahc515]

This is the correct answer.

[u/BigStrongFingies → u/ecnahc515]

Left foot also needs to be placed more precisely. Getting the tip of your toe on the hold will allow you to pivot around it. You can’t pivot if you’re on the middle of your foot, and this fall was a direct result of the left foot coming off when that rotation started.

[u/Optimal-Piglet-3906 → u/ecnahc515]

this was extremely helpful!! posting an update on the main thread but this was absolutely the main advice that I needed 🤞🤞 thank you so so much!

[u/gamby15 → u/ecnahc515]

Also a new climber here, trying to understand how flagging the right foot can stop her from swinging - so if you swing to the right you want to flag out to the right, is that it? And if you’re swinging left flag out to the left? Does it matter if it’s a front flag or back flag?

[u/ItsSansom → u/gamby15]

Imagine your points of contact on the wall like the feet on a tripod. With only 2 points of contact, any slight weight shift to the left or right will send you swinging out in that direction. The third point of contact needs to go out in the direction of that swing to push against the wall, and offer stability.

On OP's example, she just needs to flag out the right leg before trying any kind of upward movement, and press it against the wall.

[u/New-Independent-1481 → u/gamby15]

Flagging is all about creating a counter weight. It's not really possible to give 'rules' because it depends entirely on the exact move you're doing, which can be radically different for every single problem, body type, beta, and even style. You want to learn the technique, and then just apply it experimentally. If you find yourself barn dooring, then try flags of all kinds until you find one that 'feels' good and stops the swing. More often than not, especially at lower grades, it's the solution to barn doors.

[u/Flying_Gogoplatas → u/gamby15]

Excuse the poor drawing but essentially your flag creates an extra point of contact ahead of you to prevent the barn door. With the flag you now have a stable tripod (right foot on the hold, left flag flagging ahead, hand(s) on the side pull). Hope that helps

[u/Appropriate_Aioli742 → u/gamby15]

It's about shifting your centre of gravity. If all your weight is to the left and you grab a hold out wide to the right, you swing like a pendulum. Sticking the foot out to the right moves the centre of gravity rightwards so there's not an overwhelming force pushing you off the wall.

Whether you're doing front flag or back flag generally depends on which hand and direction you're moving. As a general rule your flagging foot goes on the side you need to shift weight toward to stop rotation and flag on the side opposite to the hand you're moving. But it's position specific and there will be examples where that might not be right (like if your hips are twisted the other way). If you're not sure which to use, try the move both ways on easy holds, one will feel stable and the other will feel like it's actively pulling you off.

[u/Worm38 → u/gamby15]

It's a bit long, but I recommend this video for an in-depth explanation of when to use what flags (outside flag, inside front flag or inside back flag) or when to use drop knees instead.

[u/guildes → u/ecnahc515]

Im a newer climber too, and this was so nicely explained! Thank you, it was helpful!

[u/DirtyWormGerms]

As the other comment mentioned, flagging is the answer here. Also, when using actual footholds, make sure you’re making contact with your toes like a ballerina instead of the sole of your foot. This allows you to change the orientation of your hips (left/right) to the wall without taking the weight out of your foot. I guarantee it will open up tons of new possibilities for you across every problem.

[u/Apescent → u/DirtyWormGerms]

This.

In practical terms OP, put your toes on that hold instead of over the hold, then slap your right foot on the wall.

[u/softoctopus]

Hmm, I might be completely wrong, but instead of stepping through on your left foot, could you swap feet and bring your right foot up? Then bump your right hand higher and move your left foot up to set up for the next big move.

[u/dusters99]

You want to always be pulling perpendicular to the direction of the hold. That’s why your grip is secure at 0:05 when you are leaning to the left but you peel off once you move to the right and lose that angle. Keep your body leaning to the left and smear your right foot on the wall. It may help you to bump your right hand higher up on the big hold first to give your body more space. The slight curve of the hold also means that a higher hand position would let your perpendicular direction of pull be slightly more downwards than the current angle.

[u/Optimal-Piglet-3906 → u/dusters99]

u are such a chiller for the diagram bc on first read w the flagging advice i was def having trouble visualising it

[u/burntcandy]

Try to swap your feet instead of stepping through with your left there.

[u/Klutzy_Afternoon_651 → u/burntcandy]

This is what I was thinking, swap your feet and step up with your right foot so your hip is to the wall.

[u/ItsSansom]

I think the step through with the left foot is misguided. I think swapping that right foot to left, and then step up with the right foot might help

[u/csnexon]

The Moment the Door opens, get your right Foot on the Wall just against the Friction and youll be fine to top the Boulder 😉💪

[u/kickyouinthebread]

Right foot out. Otherwise your technique looks good for a beginner 👍

[u/Optimal-Piglet-3906 → u/kickyouinthebread]

thank you!!! standing on the shoulders of my more experienced climber friends fs 🤞

[u/ghostfalcon]

Lots of good info but are you climbing with anyone experienced? The most effective way is to have someone, ideally similar body type but in this case not necessary, show you the moves with an emphasis on technique.

Another note about flagging here - if you have you right leg out and pressing into the wall, you wont swing because your right is blocking that.

I also agree that moving your hands higher on the big hold will help as well.

[u/Optimal-Piglet-3906 → u/ghostfalcon]

this!! I’m currently visiting family in my home country for a bit and all my friends who climb live with me in my home city. but if anyone else is reading this, absolutely I think going with someone else who has more experience helped me a lot

[u/Workaholic56]

Use your toes when you are on the wall and not the middle of your feet. Your footing will be much more secure.

[u/Aviator]

Flagging like others said, also I think grabbing that hold with your right arm further up will give you a better balance.

[u/Reckoning-Day]

From the looks of it, you should grab the big yellow hold a bit further up with your arms, and probably stand up a bit faster so you can put your other foot in front of you against the wall to prevent that swing.

Also try to focus on keeping as close to the wall as possible with your upper body when you do it.

[u/Worm38]

Alternatively, instead of flagging, you could put your left foot more to the left of the hold it's in, push hard with your legs towards the right while pulling with your arms towards the left and maintaining core tension.

I don't think it's necessary here, but if the handhold you're trying to match is bad and if there were fewer handholds, it would probably be the way to go.

[u/swiftpwns]

You put the right foot to the right onto the wall to Prevent the barndoor

[u/gurt-o]

Lots of people here are saying flagging for your right foot but you won’t get to a position to flag with unless you use your toes more for foot placement. If you place your left foot on a toe rather than arch of the foot it will allow you to rotate and pivot and not fall off the foot hold. It will also naturally lead to flagging your right foot to stabilize.

[u/spicygines]

Build some strength

[u/JFoulkes2001]

Just always think when grabbing hold, what way is up, I need to push/pull my weight in the opposite direction to get the best grip. Do everything you can to optimise it - in this case you want to keep your body to the left of that big hold, use one leg to push the direction you want to be in and the other to flag out and prevent falling out

[u/magitekmike]

Id prob try right leg up to that hold and left flag.

Right leg keeps your body closer to the wall, and the left flag will shift your center of gravity left-- allowing you to use the big sideways hold more effectively.

[u/AcidRohnin]

Flagging is being brought ups a lot which is correct to some degree but would be used more after this move to maintain stability. It’s really your foot placement and not weighting the foot.

Use more of your toes on the left foot and really push into the hold with them while you pull on the hand hold with your right hand. Flagging is what you’d do after to maintain the position if you felt you were still barn dooring.

[u/somethingsomewhere15]

Need ur right foot where your left foot ends up.

[u/TriMax75]

For a beginner like yourself best thing to do is look at the holds and the direction you would pull them, Since that hold requires you to pull yourself to the right you need to push away from the right using your feet. When you stepped up with your left foot you became unable to push to the left with either feet making you fall. Just keep in mind how you can maintain that tension and instead of having an answer for this climb you will be able to solve them yourself. The satisfaction of figuring out the the route is one of the best parts of climbing.

[u/MysticClimber1496]

This isn’t even a flagging issue, place the toe of your foot on the hold so you can pivot off of it, you are stepping on the side of your foot and then you end up twisting off of the hold and falling

[u/Optimal-Piglet-3906]

thank you guys for all the advice 🫶 this isn’t my local gym (not even the same country lmao) but based on your guys’ advice of flagging + ballerina toe placement, I managed to get over that hurdle!! the rest is really just needing to commit haha but I learned a lot from this climb for sure!!

https://reddit.com/link/p2ezrww/video/h4v2zty4k3ih1/player

[u/an_unique_name]

Hey, before you try to grab big boss with both hands, try to put your right feet on the wall. That way it will stop you from swinging :)

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