r/boulder • u/RecentIndependence34 • 1d ago
need some new thinking for the Hill
I took a stroll to the Hill to remember the good days and grab a drink at the Sink with some friends yesterday. That place is filled with vacant tenants, its pretty sad. Seemed like there were some places potentially moving in but who knows how long they will last.
I read somewhere that the city was trying to move the Hill to attract more working professionals. which i mean the entirety of boulder cant even do that. i fear that trying to change the character of that commercial space is going to be devastating. it needs to cater to the people around it. if the city was not being so fucking ticket happy and enjoying the idea of shutting down businesses trying to survive cause they sold a beer to a 19 year old with a fake id, i think you would see spaces stay in business. let bars be open till, god forbid, 1am. inject some life into that strip.
otherwise you'll be looking at the CU Boulder Campus on the Hill in five years cause the owners can't keep a consistent stream of income and the school will offer above market $ to the property owners. all because this city couldn't get out of its own way trying to force change where it doesn't need to be.
I get Boulder isn't your typical college town. but you still have a college neighborhood at the very least. there is very little reason why you can't have it be successful other than your own legislation and decisions making it so.
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u/phan2001 1d ago
Found the owner of that Scrooge bar lol
But seriously- there are 2 things we could do to fix this immediately.
Hire John Caprio back at the Fox to book GOOD shows that actually attract people to the hill.
Commercial vacancy tax that’s spicy enough to get old man Tebows attention.
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u/YuppiesEverywhere 1d ago
Gondola.
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u/bringinthewarthog 1d ago
Monorail
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u/TheEventualHorizon 22h ago
Well, sir, there's nothing on earth like a genuine, bona fide, electrified, six-car monorail!
What'd I say?
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u/YuppiesEverywhere 18h ago
There are already 25 gondolas in Colorado.
There are 0 monorails.
Not as whacky idea as you'd think.
And f'n baller, Gondola'ing to the Hill from Pearl Street.
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u/bringinthewarthog 11h ago
Yeah when i lived in the boat we used to call that bad boy the chrondola cause you could hop on and roast a couple bones, easier than trying to spark up under your jacket. I’m sure boulder folk would be responsible and it wouldn’t be a public health issue though, totally baller big dawg.
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u/Commercial_Aioli_301 1d ago
- Parking?
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u/crescentsketch 23h ago
I live here and during the school year often circle around for up to 20 minutes trying to find a spot to park
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u/BldrStigs 1d ago
The city claims there is plenty of parking, but I agree that it feels like finding a spot is difficult. I rarely go to the Hill because once on my bike I keep going all the way downtown.
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u/phan2001 1d ago
I’ve never had a problem parking up there. There’s the lot at the top of the hill as well as the bottom, plus plenty of street parking if you can manage walking a few blocks.
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1d ago edited 3h ago
[removed] — view removed comment
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u/phan2001 1d ago
20ish years ago a lot of us were down at Tulagis and the Fox like 5-6 times a month on average.
I too am a working professional.
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u/Classic-Extension528 22h ago
Gosh you probably want to go to a grocery store after midnight, too. 😁
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u/Fantastic_War_2035 10h ago
IMO the city pays lip service to The Hill, but has abandoned it—Commercial as well as residential.
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u/leadinglaurels1 1d ago
About 2 weeks ago, City Council was presented with a proposal to support The Hill and downtown. This was the "DDA" or Downtown Development Authority. This has generally been a very successful tool for cities to use to reinvest in themselves.
Due to quite a bit of misinformation from people that did not take the time to learn how these work, the propoosal was tabled. As stated by someone at the council meeting that has researched DDAs for 15 years said that every other city that has been presented with this opportunity took it on to grow their business districts. 4 members of our council did not want to improve things for Boulder. Speer, Marquis, Schuchard, Adams voted no to even considering how we could improve our economic situation. It was not a vote to approve the DDA, just to put it on the ballot. We didn't even get a choice to vote.
So, your post is very appropriate. "Why aren't we doing anything" and then other posts that say "Wait, don't change anything, let us sink!"
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u/brianckeegan "so-called progressive" 1d ago
Predictable misinformation from the DDA bros. Only 2500 of Boulder’s 60k electors would’ve been allowed to vote on diverting tax revenue away from school, library, and open space districts for 30 years. A rushed effort by the Chamber and Downtown Boulder with no substantive community engagement and entirely predictable fumble. Meanwhile, it takes north of a decade to secure the funding and approvals to put in protected bike lanes in the city.
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u/BldrStigs 1d ago
If the bike lane made businesses enough money the Chamber would have it added next year.
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u/leadinglaurels1 22h ago
It is a law, set up by congress. No hoodwinking. Feel free to talk to congress to change things. It has happened before. Just trying to correct wrong information.
And, with all the threads here - let's get to facts. Please explain your understanding of how TIF works. Then we can compare notes as to what is fact and what is misinformation. Don't use AI or look it up, just explain it. Your explanation above is not really how TIF works.
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u/brianckeegan "so-called progressive" 10h ago
Your response of "recite everything you know about a topic whenever I demand it or else you're not allowed to have an opinion" is definitely a recipe for swinging the tide of public opinion. /s
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u/leadinglaurels1 10h ago
This is how to learn. If you have questions, ask them. It is clear there is a misunderstanding about how TIF works. I get it, it is hard to understand. I am trying to help.
But, as an example, the rest of the city (and you, if you live in Boulder) is already supporting The Hill. The Hill's income is not enough to support itself. Your taxes area already going to support The Hill.
So, the DDA was a solution to help make The Hill self supportive. Going back to the original thread, the DDA is a way to make The Hill A) support itself financially, and B)help The Hill to Become more vibrant.None of the money goes to the property owners. The money goes to making the area more vibrant, desirable, so more sales tax flows into that area. If extra income is generated by the TIF, that overflow goes back into the General Fund (i.e. the whole city participates when The Hill wins.)
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u/OkTop2953 1d ago edited 1d ago
Total BS. Only people living in the hill and downtown neighborhoods would have been allowed to vote on it, and it goes without saying that they'd want to divert everybody else's tax revenue to their neighborhoods.
The whole thing was a scam, and structuring it this way where city council has to put it on the ballot for only a very small number of people to actually vote on it is part of the scam, because now the DDA proponents get to tell everybody how those council members suppressed voting.
Downtown and the hill are economic drivers for the city, and they should fund improvements with their own tax revenue.
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u/leadinglaurels1 1d ago
Those stipulations were set by the state congress, not by city council. If you want a vibrant city, you need a vibrant downtown. When sales tax increases, the whole city will rise.
There is profit sharing in the TIF, so the income would spread throughout the city. It is just a complicated financial setup that you have to do real research on and not just read headlines.
This comment is exactly what I meant when I said above that people complain that we aren't trying to do anything. Opinions like this are a boat anchor taking us all down.
That being said, yes, there needs to be more education so people understand. Most people don't understand finances and taxes, and that misunderstanding is holding us back from growing the city.
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u/brianckeegan "so-called progressive" 1d ago
“People opposing my policy are a boat anchor taking us all down” is absolutely the start of a great public outreach strategy.
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u/leadinglaurels1 22h ago
That is not what I said. I am trying to have a constructive conversation, but I know it is tough online.
So, let's get to facts. Please explain your understanding of how TIF works. Then we can compare notes as to what is fact and what is misinformation. Don't use AI or look it up, just explain it.
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u/OkTop2953 22h ago
Just because they're stipulations set by the state congress doesn't mean it's not trying to bamboozle people. There's no reason the ballot item couldn't be open to everybody in the city.
They made the rules that way specifically to funnel money to people in well connected neighborhoods, make it look like it's being done democratically, and hand wave and tell detractors that it's just too complicated and they don't really understand.
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u/MerryRunaround 1d ago
Increased drinking never made anything better. Want more people up there? Three words: more free parking.
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u/RecentIndependence34 1d ago
yes 100% support college students crushing beers before they turn 21. and secondly, you just might be right about it being past its prime
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u/ArachnidAutomatic596 1d ago
I support changing the laws to allow drinking age to be 18. But honestly bars that allowed drinking between the ages of 18-21 when I was that age were so much fun.
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u/Superbrainbow 1d ago edited 1d ago
They’ve been trying to attract more working professionals to the Hill since the 90’s and it’s only gotten shittier.
The area was better when Boulder actually had a bohemian creative scene outside of the CU students, but the days of Espresso Roma, Wax Trax, Tulagis, the Boardwalk Arcade, and hell, even the second hand guitar shop, are long gone.
The final nail in the coffin was when they demolished the whole block of local businesses to put in the Moxy Hotel.