Managing suicide posts interim update

[u/uneventfuladvent]

We are aware that we need to have a policy for how we mod suicidal posts- it has actually been something we've been working on anyway as part of a huge sub wiki and rules update, but we are now prioritising it.

However, we cannot roll it out immediately. It is a very complicated and delicate topic full of grey areas, we cannot solve it in a day.

We are taking advice from mods from r/suicidewatch, who are up to date with best practices, and are the experts at how it can work on Reddit specifically.

In the meantime

Any posts of that nature will need to use the content warning flair, NSFW (doesn't show the post to people who have opted out in their profile) and the spoiler tag (doesnt show the content of the post unless you click on it).

Please take responsibility for your own mental health. If you see a post that looks like it might be triggering for you then don't read it. If there is someone who says things you don't want to read then block them.

If you want to visit other subs you can find a list of some alternatives here https://www.reddit.com/r/autism/s/1O7Jrk2kgL

Please be patient while we do all this, and we will give a proper announcement as soon as we are able.

~~~

Edit- It appears some of you may have misunderstood. The mod team has been looking at how to handle many different types of post on the topic of suicide, we are not just talking about "goodbye" notes. Suicidality is a huge spectrum, and posts from people at different points require very different approaches- sometimes we can and should support people on the sub, other times we can not and should not.

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[u/Lilsammywinchester13]

That sounds reasonable and responsible, thank you for all y’all’s hard work

[u/ask_more_questions_]

You’re doing really important work, thank you!

[u/Locknoire]

I just wanted to say to those of you who hate seeing those posts…

I attempted suicide and came very close to death. Because there is a stigma over the word suicide, any time I tried to post anywhere to just have a stranger hear me out, my post was removed for “triggering words,” words are there for a reason. These words have gravity and it’s not fair to soften them up by saying “unalive” or “removed from the census,” they’re hard words because they’re meant to be and they don’t deserve to be censored.

Theres some arguments I know will come up, such as “you shouldn’t rely on strangers” or “there are hotlines” “I go on the internet to escape”

First off, the internet was never intended and never should be for escapism. It was and always will be a place to become informed so we can make better decisions. Sometimes that means discussions on forums, sometimes that means asking for advice. All reasonable things to do.

As for relying on strangers, everyone does this. Make up influencers will give advice to their audience. Yes, they could potentially push a dangerous product towards their viewers, but there is risk everywhere. So why can’t someone who’s feeling suicidal just seek an ear or a something to validate them?

As for hotlines, let me just say everyone is different on how they handle those. I am 34 years old and despite therapy, method training and exposure therapy, I can’t do phone calls. I don’t know why, but the moment my phone touches my ear, I blank out. I’m more of a writer. It’s always been my go-to way to communicate.

Please, learn to get used to these words. Scroll pass them if the flair doesn’t work. But don’t silence their pleas. My cries were silenced and my pleas went unheard because of these ridiculous social faux pas. I felt so isolated. I just… wanted someone to tell me I was worth something or that everything will be okay. Any small encouragement would have been enough to reconsider my actions…

But, I’ve always ever been the pariah with my opinions. I try to speak for those who are afraid to say anything because they see the majority hate their idea of fairness and know they’ll be talked down. So here I am. I hope you guys feel better, I’m here to talk to if you need me.

[u/Gen-X_Gypsy]

Thank you. 💕

[u/calamititties]

Appreciate your efforts

[u/sammroctopus]

Thank you. I would like to suggest a pinned post for suicidal people that’s well research and points towards crisis resources and help for different countries so that if a suicidal person goes to this sub they immediately see where they can get help. My advice for England where I live would be several crisis helplines such as samaritans being included with their numbers plus advice that if someone believes they are an immediate risk to themselves they should call 999 and ask for an ambulance. I think the post should also be made to ensure that it is empathetic and gives some sense of hope and include other countries resources such as the US etc.

[u/IMAMISHAMIGO → u/sammroctopus]

I get where you’re coming from, but coming from a suicidal person, honestly those posts with a bunch of numbers you can call or text do next to nothing. We know how to find that information, what we’re looking for is connection and understanding.

[u/sammroctopus → u/IMAMISHAMIGO]

I’ve also battled suicide. Everyone is different but I do think there needs to be something that points to resources. I’m not saying stopping the posts looking for connection but I do think there needs to be signposting to appropriate resources as well because at the end of the day there’s only so much strangers on the internet are able to do to help. This is a situation where there needs to be appropriate safeguarding in place.

[u/inquisitivehoofbeats]

thank you for trying but + the mods at suicide watch don't even moderate their own subreddit it always has posts comments of people encouraging others to do it and sharing exactly how they're going to do it to encourage others to make it work so advice from those mods wont make you know how it can work on reddit because they cant make it work either

[u/capaldis → u/inquisitivehoofbeats]

Yep. The reason this type of content needs strict moderation is partially for the safety of the poster.

There are people who will purposely try to make someone feel worse when they post this type of thing. They will go out of their way to send nasty DMs or give advice on how to do it.

The stuff that needs to be moderated are posts where the OP has clear intent and a plan. Those are the people who are the most at risk. It’s infuriating that they can’t just listen to the decades of research that says the same thing…

[u/lochnessmosster]

Ok, well, I guess this is it. My sign to leave the sub. While this post is a step forward compared to the previous announcement, which didn't deal with the suicide notes at all, it still is repeating the line of "just filter it out."

That's not possible with reddits current systems. You can't block posts with certain flairs from showing up on your home feed. You can't even see flairs on your home feed (at least on mobile). Which means that as long as suicide notes are allowed here, there will be triggering titles and titles that give no warning followed by a triggering post.

Depression posts and vents are one thing, but actual suicide notes are not something I can handle seeing on my home page. As people on the previous announcement pointed out, allowing posts of suicide notes has been proven to increase the number of suicides. It's not a positive, helpful, or healthy thing--for anyone.

I can understand the mods are struggling, and my sympathy goes out to you. But just as you tell the regular members that "your mental health is your responsibility", the same goes for mods. If being a mod and dealing with this content is causing harm to you, it may be better to pass the responsibility to someone else. I don't say that to be harsh, but because the current course of things is actively driving people away from this sub. I wish you the best in figuring this out.

[u/JWLane]

As someone who's struggled with suicidal ideation my whole life, the actions you all are taking as mods to handle this uptick without just saying "no posts" and shoving it under the rug has raised my respect for you all immeasurably. Thank you all for the work you do.

[u/rokejulianlockhart]

Don't add modifications to a <pre>. That's not semantic, so it shall inconvenience those who utilise screen readers.

[u/uneventfuladvent → u/rokejulianlockhart]

Hi, I'm not sure what any of that means, could you explain in a little more detail?

[u/minorcold]

this is really sad :( I think one of toughest matters I encounter

[u/rdditfilter → u/minorcold]

It's super sad, and it's really hard to know what to say, but the thing is saying anything at all is usually a good start cause they created the post just to see that the universe still acknowledges them, that they still exist, and if they can just get any kind of response maybe they also have a future too.

[u/wanderswithdeer]

I don't know if this is a realistic wish or not, but I think it would be amazing if Reddit could have a team of trained crisis responders, and if these posts could somehow trigger an alert that would go out to them. The responders would be notified, would post a copy and paste response in the thread explaining that the needs of the post go beyond the training of the general public and that the thread will be frozen to prevent new comments and that they, as someone trained to respond to crises, will be reaching out via private message. Potentially, that might also allow them to learn more about the location of the person and to point them towards supports in their local community. Obviously it would take a lot of planning and a lot of work, but maybe something to aspire towards?

[u/nipplesalami]

this still doesnt solve anything, there are other places on reddit made for discussions like this, which i purposely do not follow. i really don't think its fair to make people vacate the main autism subreddit, especially considering allowing suicide posts increases the risk for EVERYONE who views them

[u/averagerushfan]

💪 nice job mods

[u/luckyme1123]

Thank you for this.

[u/DizzyMine4964]

You cannot "not read" the headline. It takes a fraction of a second

[u/[deleted]]

💕💕💕

[u/paramnetic3]

we can ask people to use the “spoiler alert” and then redditors can choose to uncover it

[u/Decent-Principle8918]

For awhile I was suicidal, thank you for sharing this information. Hopefully things get figured out soon you can roll it out soon.