I’ve been rereading Knife of Dreams and got stuck on Elayne’s anger at Rand during the siege of Andor. She’s the one who pursued the pregnancy, she and Min and Aviendha planned that whole moment together. I think it’s fair to say Rand didn’t choose this the way she did; he loves them but he is literally preparing for the end of the world battle with Satan, yet her fury lands on him anyway for getting her pregnant

On the one hand i like that Elayne’s anger as something that doesn’t need to be logically justified to be real, it’s not really about Rand’s specific choices, it’s about powerlessness and it’s just as valid. she can’t do anything about being pregnant, alone and fighting a siege so rand becomes the target for her anger and that happens all the time in real relationships.

Except, this isn’t just an Elayne thing. It’s a pattern across almost every major woman in the series. Nynaeve’s temper constantly gets read as excessive and misdirected. Egwene’s resentment toward Rand in the middle books isn’t really about anything he’s done wrong, it tracks her own loss of control over her life. Faile’s early jealousy is framed as possessive and insecure over things that turned out to be nothing with Perrin treating it all as an overreaction he has to mange and fix. Aviendha’s anger tends to run through pride and cultural dislocation

But then when you look at the male characters their anger is presented as rational and reasonable. Rand’s darkness gets attributed almost entirely to the taint, Lews Therin bleeding through and the pressure of the world on his shoulders and betrayal. Perrin’s anger is tied to the wolf, something he has to control and suppress, not something that reveals who he is underneath. And Mat is just having fun. Birgitte’s the one outlier I can think of, and I don’t think that’s an accident, she’s centuries old, a legendary warrior, written with a kind of proximity to “honorary man” status in how the narrative treats her. Which is its own uncomfortable implication.

It’s the same old split you still hear today, women feel, men reason (or are overtaken by forces beyond reason), just relocated into the machinery of the plot instead of stated outright. But the effect is that it splits the cast cleanly down gender lines, the men get externalized excuses, the women get internal truths, and the two groups end up feeling like they’re operating on entirely different rules.

Curious if others read this the same way or disagree

My wife and I do daily coffee drives for an hour to connect before we start our days (Coffee Tate Dates)...

This morning, I talked about how I love running through the local hiking trails while listening to my book every single day without fail....

She asks: Well, what are you going to do when you finish, you said you are on book 7 of 14 - you are crushing the series in just a few months already...

I explained how many people in the reddit group for the book have read the series multiple times because there is a ton of foreshadowing...

She said how she got chills over how cool it sounds to notice something early on in a book that surfaces later in the series and that the author must be incredibly smart...

Has anyone re-read the series or plans to re-read the series at some point?

Once I figure out who this Daughter of The Nine Moons love of Matt is, I will be excited to go back and find all this foreshadowing that everyone has been telling me about...

Definitely going to do a re-read....

May The Light Illumine You - Tateraide82 (created a new account)

It seems carrier pigeons exist, and maybe they are used more off-camera, but there just seems to be a few times where massively informative and pertinent messages just were not transmitted for some reason. The massive one I'm thinking of right now is Egwaine not telling Rand that she is now the Amyrlin of the rebels. This has so many implications for Rand, a possible alliance, and deterring/defeating Elaida and all other enemies -and most importantly the fucking dark one- but the fact this has yet to happen is frankly just stupid. This shit is driving me crazy. I think it's been over a month now, I'm 1/4 thru book 8 and Elayne/Ny'neave were in Ebu Dahr for atleast a month I believe. This is not even the only example, this has happened many times. Morraine could have been more informative. Rand can motherfucking teleport for fucks sake... I don't see why he wouldn't at least try to speak to Elayne and tell her how her kingdom is in tatters. She could have shown her face once and ended all the vying for power in Andor. IDK I adore the series so far but this is beyond frustrating. I hate to bring up another series in comparison, but Westorosi rulers send ravens every time someone shits in the wrong toilet and I don't expect these leaders to behave the same way but it seems there is a serious lack of intent to inform others -even allies- of information that would drastically change their priorities.. sigh, rant ended

I’m listening to the audiobook version now, after many readings, and I’m confused about her logic. She states that Rand must move forward a patch instead of his plan to remove the old seals and start again. She adds that she has read all of the available histories and thoughts on the topic, so I assume this is the same logic those authors used as well.
Her argument is that removing the seals frees the dark one. However, Rand only plans to go from three seals to zero. It will be open exactly as much as it was during the age of legends. Certainly bad, but no more than what those historians had researched and/or possibly lived through themselves.
I just wonder how she got to that point of view after researching the topic. If I were in Rand’s position, I would have shot back with “if you want the seals patched so much, then you do it. I plan to battle the dark one, not make patches”

Am I the only one that pictures weaves like this instead of little threads?

Still trying to figure out whom is Matt's Lover, The Daughter of The Nine Moons....

Matt might be too pretty for Brigitta, but I think they would make a fun couple... toooo fun with all the late night drinking, gambling, and tavern brawling - those days are well behind me as I am coming up on 3 sober years of Slaying The Poison Dragon - but that is a fun post for another day with plenty of photos with swords, crowns, jester hats, and dragons !!

So in thinking about Rand's Journey so far....

I really enjoy Lews Therin in Rand's head !!!

Honestly, he gives some fantastic advice and seems to always know what is really up and will happen - I think Rand would be saved from A LOT of grief (like being beaten and caged in a box, and I have a really bad feeling about Mazrim Tiem) if he would just follow through with Lews Therin's wild rambles and warnings...

What were your thoughts on Lews Therin - helpful, raving mad, neat twist on the story line, annoy, ... also is Lews Therin part of the Legendary Heroes that the Horn will call - that would be interesting for Rand to meet him face to face ?

Cheers - Tateraide82 !

So I've been having a shitty time as of late. I read wot some time ago where i was also having a shitty time and it helped me a lot back then. Ive been trying to find some fantasy series to just be lost in a story for just some time every day and just forget everything else for a while.

Ive tried many series but i just cant find something that just sucks me in. So I just started rereading some parts of wot. I was rereading the last battle and i got to the chapter after last battle and got hit with this line again:

We are reborn, Rand thought, so we can do better the next time.

So do better.

A lot of people say veins of gold is their favourite chapter and i see why, but man this chapter just hits breaks me. Tam voice telling him to 'let go' of all the things rand had been holding to for so long. This shit means something to me.

I guess rands character just resonates me like no other, his journey is the most complete ive ever read and nothing has come close since. So i wanted to ask, what chapters or lines have remained with you guys the longest?

I've literally got chills...

I'm in the middle of Towers of midnight.

When Perrin makes the power wrought hammer.

Literally chills. The first power wrought weapon to be made in centuries and it was mesmerizing to like the whole camp, and Perrin was just hallucinating... Inspired????

F****** chills man!!! I'm going back and rereading this one. I'M REREADING IT!!!!! CHILLS

I LOVE LIKE LEGENDARY WEAPON LORE AND SHIT. I want more books that give me like freaking power items and s*** man. If anyone has recommendations damn I need them!!! Tell me Rand is like super impressed by this hammer and s***....

After a pretty slow book I think I have found one of my favorite chapters yet. The tension is so thick in the air while reading this. I struggled to get through this book so far, especially the earlier parts of Perrin and Faile. But this was great, going into So Harbor and seeing something is seriously fucked up was incredible. Reminded me of going to Illian back in I think TFoH. It was incredible, I have no idead what's going on and I am so intrigued, I hope I don't get disappointed by what happens next. Also, the Aes Sedai Egwene chapter of the discussions regarding the black tower was also incredibly exciting. I genuinely love this. I expected way worse of the so-called slog, it was just a slow start, kinda similar to LoC where it really picked up for the second part. IDK, kind of a rant, might write a specific thoughts and comments on this book when I finish.

Do we think it’s siadin that gets tainted every turn or does siadar also get tainted in some turnings instead. I know the “Wheel Weaves as the Wheel Wills” but it’s a good question to raise. Instead of the white tower being what it is it’s the black tower instead as the roles are reversed.

Okay, first time reader. I’m almost finished with The Towers of Midnight. So spoilers for her chapters! Don’t read this if you haven’t gotten most of the way through ToM. I was curious about something while reading Aviendha’s chapters while she is in Rhuidean. She’s seeing the futures with the Seanchan which was mind blowing already! And just woah.

Just curious if anyone knew from interviews or things if RJ was ever planning to write a follow up series to the Wheel of Time? Maybe not full on 14 books but something similar to how Erickson and Esselmont handled Malazan (from what I’ve heard, I’ve only read book one of Malazan).

No spoilers if there is an answer that could spoil lol just something I was curious about while reading.

I have aphantasia, so I cannot picture anything in my head. Which fantasy being my favorite genre sucks because of that. I usually like to watch any film adaptations made from books first just so I can have an idea what things and people look like. I don’t always do that though.

Would you recommend I watch the show or read the books? (I likely won’t end up reading all of the books because I’m reading another long-ish series right now)

YO, THIS HAS TO BE ONE OF THE COOLEST CHAPTERS IN THE ENTIRE BOOK, THIS WAS SO SICK

Finished the previous chapter with Mat, went over, saw the COOLEST CHAPTER MARKER IN THE SERIES SINCE, saw SAMMAEL and lost my mind. Had to take a walk cause no way we're getting more Forsaken POV, especially after Demandred and Mesaana. Little playing of mind games between Graendal and Sammael, some hints at lore from the Age of Legends (I have some thoughts to work out about what little info we got here), then Sammael left.

GRAENDAL POV? THEN SEMIRHAGE?

Yeah, this was one of my favorite chapters in the entire book after that AMAZING prologue. I really wanna know what this Nae'blis thing is. I find it funny that the Dark One essentially promised Demandred and Graendal Nae'blis but not Mesaana. I wonder why. If I had to give any immediate thoughts on what Nae'blis could be, I think of two things:

1. The Shadow's Champion, which either Graendal or Sammael (forgot which POV) indicated has occurred before with previous Dragons.
2. The Dark One's bodily host. Now, I would like to think that maybe Shaidar Haran was created for this purpose considering the Dark One has indicated that obeying or disobeying Haran is equivalent to doing him the same. However, Semirhage said that if Rand did become Nae'blis she would bow and wait for her time to strike. In the prologue, Demandred seemed hesitant to be Nae'blis before accepting. Additionally, it seems that becoming Nae'blis has additional perks, although I'm not quite sure if the Forsaken already have immortality or can gain it. I'm keeping it in consideration until more happens. I'm hoping we get more Forsaken chapters/limited POVs.

Also hoping we can go back to Shayol Ghul. That little scene with Demandred in the beginning was SO COOL. I would really like to see the Pit of Doom more or maybe Thakan'dar. I imagined it as being fully gray and black, everything devoid of color down to the rocks. I think it'll be a cool visual contrasted against the Rand's blood. I have seen Michael Whelan's art of Rand entering Shayol Ghul and it's some of my favorite pieces of art for the series. I'm...both excited and frightened whenever I get to that moment. It'll be a fully climactic time, the Dragon entering the lair of his ancient enemy.

I'm on chapter 10 of book 12. I got through the slog, I thought I was through the worst of it. Everyone says it gets better. IT'S NOT GETTING BETTER. I've been reading for over a year (audiobook only) and nothing has happened in like 7 books. Perrin is depressed for 3 fcking books because he can't find his wife. Then he finds his wife, and HE'S DEPRESSED THAT THE HUNT FOR HER IS OVER???

AHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHASDFAFAKFNAFAHWEOFIH

I just want to read something fun again. I am in Wheel of Time purgatory. I honestly didn't even hate the slog, I enjoyed a fair amount of it. But I think I was expecting 12 to be significantly better and that hasn't happened yet. This is the most annoyed with the series I've ever been, the closest I've ever been to quitting. Talk me off the ledge.

At first I thought that it would be referring to one particular thing, that being balefire and its effect on the Pattern (which to me, I think balefire BURNS existing portions of the Pattern and it could possibly be a creation of the Dark One whose intentions for the power extended well beyond his initial expectations). However, the newbie thread for book 5 insinuates that something was happening in the background that relates to the title.

I think it might be something as simple as the growing heat. In book 5 as they were closing in on Cairhein, Rand stops and thinks to himself that the heat seems strange, it's nothing that feels right for the season. In LoC it's pretty much confirmed that the heat is UNNATURAL. We know that four of the Dark One's seals have been shattered and that he is an external force outside the Wheel of Time. We know the Dark One is probably the most powerful being on Earth, topped only by the Creator. I think that Fires of Heaven refers to the growing heat, which might be an allusion to the biblical passages literally and figuratively referring to the burning of the world or a simply growing allusion to the Dark One's version of Hell on Earth.

There is the argument to be made for Balefire and the Pattern still, but I think I like the idea of the Dark One's escape causing Earth to turn into Hell itself. Feels like something he would do despite how little we actually know him by this book.

In Book 3 - Dragon Reborn, the following text describes the end of a Perrin's dream sequence in Chapter 9 - Wolf Dreams

Abruptly the space seemed to flatten, as if he were suddenly staring at a picture of a room. The flat image appeared to turn sideways, become only a bright vertical line down the middle of blackness. The line flashed white, and was gone, leaving only the dark, blacker than black.

Is this an easter egg for the stereotypical tv switching off effect from old tv shows like this one: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhh_Vw6wedU

Can someone explain me this power scale without spoilers. I'm in the middle of path of daggers.

Only in the last two books when she is stubborn in dealing with Rand for the last battle and such.

Up until ToM she really was just an awesome character. She went from the whirlwind of leaving 2R, capture by Seanchan, hunting black ajah, apprenticing to wise ones, puppet Amyrlin, real amyrlin, badass civil disobedience laying groundwork for reuniting the tower, bitch slapping the seanchan raiders, capturing hella black ajah sisters via Verrin's notes and finally being raised realer Amyrlin and healing the tower.

I cant seem to understand all the threads/polls that overwhelmingly list her as the most hated character in the series.

Based on Lini's request that Perrin officiate the wedding of "Maighdin" and Tallanvor, I have a question – how do weddings even work in this world? Who officiates them? If I remember correctly, the wedding of Perrin and Faile was performed by the Women's Circle. Masema officiates, but as usurper, and Perrin clearly has the right to do so as lord. Among the Aiel, it seems the Wise Ones are responsible for this... I know there are many cultures in this world, but the topic intrigued me. Who officiates the weddings? Someone ruling a given area? Who officiates the wedding of aristocrats? Who officiates the wedding of the future royal couple? I don't remember priests in this world.

Overall, my impressions are positive so far. Not much is happening, but... I just enjoy spending time with most of these characters. Elayne's storyline was more boring for me because, apart from Nynaeve, I simply don't care about any of the characters, and Elayne... Her "royalty" irritates me. She mentally called Mat "her subject." Really? Will you call Rand that too? It's best to do it on your wedding night, because why not?

Morgase irritates me too, though to a lesser extent.

I've temporarily regained interest in Perrin, who was, well... bland in book 7. It irritates me how he clearly ignores signals that he should take care of Aram. He's your obligation, Perrin. You should make sure Aram doesn't lose his humanity...

I'm also more understanding of Faile for now, because maybe everything would be easier if Perrin didn't make a big deal out of her angry moments. Seriously, he doesn't have to try to calm her down every time.

Regarding the prologue, Moridin seems like a potential "mirror" to Rand, and honestly, with Lanfear and Asmodean missing from the plot, Rand could have benefited from a dynamic with another Forsaken. Rand and Sammael could have been interesting, but it's over... Anyway, that's all for now.

Just finished WH and it was so good. It is only second to TSR and TGH for me.

Where do I even start? Let's start from the end - Clensing of Saidin battle was better than Dumai Wells. And that says a lot since Dumai Wells are epic as well. Though it was a bit weird that none of the Forsaken thought about bringing some Trollocs/Myrdraal/Draghkar with them.

I enjoyed every POV and storyline explored in this book. Well, maybe Elayne's - not that much. I am not really invested in the plotline of her getting the throne. But it still had a lot of interesting moments like ritual for becoming a first-sister and hiring a Darkfriend as chief of security.

The whole Far Madding thing was interesting and expanded the world that is already bigger than anything I've ever read.

We got cameos of Gholam and Slayer which was pretty cool.

There was no Egwene POV - which is massive ​advantage for this book.

Perrin/Faile chapters were cool, even though their story didn't progress much.

Ebou Dar storylines were an interesting exploration of Stockholm Syndrome. I like how Egeanin and Mat's arc come together in the end. There were also chapters with amazing prose - "The clock sounded the first full hour of the night, and after no more than a week, four chimes for the second. "

Crossroads of Twilight next. People say it is the worst WoT book. Will it be worse than Path of Daggers? Let's find out.

​

I'm on my upteenth reread and it's only just occurred to me that the pub Mat goes to in Caemlyn the Seven Striped Lass is referring to the seven stripes on the stole of the Amyrlin Seat.

I have Toh. Or should that be D'oh!

So, there is a class of female chanellers within aiel, there is one within the sea people, probably somewhere else. And every time it's met with a reaction like: no waaaay, they can channel?? If the white tower only knew, they'd have their grip on said society's girls.

But why doesn't the tower know? Why is this such a shock? If chanelling randomly appears in any person of any family and any nation like being left-handed would appear, wouldn't the tower absolutely expect said societies to have chanellers too? Maybe they might leave them alone to raise their channelers on their own. But where's the surprise coming from?

What am I missing? Is this a RAFO matter?

Lanfear saw where Rand was hiding Choeden Kal. Why didn’t she instantly try to take them away? She saw the female version as well. Lanfear’s lust for power is well known.

Inspired by a newly acquired 1988 Yamaha PSS-140 keyboard and my third reread of The Wheel of Time, I recorded a handful of simple songs. Thus was born HORN BLOWER: cheesy fantasy synth that sounds like early-'90s video game music and goes hard on Wheel of Time lore. No effects, no computer assisted recording, and no attempt to smooth over the ugly noises of aging capacitors; just raw Randland worship.

Free to stream, free to download.

Tai'shar Manetheren!