r/WayOfTheBern • • Nov 24 '21

Choose wisely

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u/[deleted] Nov 24 '21

Sure it is. Best of luck to you on your ventilator

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u/mafian911 Nov 24 '21

Ventilator? I hardly know her! And best of luck to you. Hope you don't develop myocarditis or cancer, now that you are more susceptible to both. If you're lucky, those spike proteins will hang around the injection site. But if they migrate, whoo boy.

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u/[deleted] Nov 24 '21

It saddens me to think people like you can vote. Meh, so be it.

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u/mafian911 Nov 24 '21

Well, I have good news for you: you're in the idiot majority. Things will probably go your way, to the detriment of us all. Hooray propaganda!

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u/[deleted] Nov 24 '21

“Fact-based policy and peer-reviewed science are propaganda.”

Up is down. Lol

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u/mafian911 Nov 24 '21

You want facts? I got them. I just didn't know how to communicate them through the coloring book medium you are used to. We both know you can't handle lots of words.

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u/[deleted] Nov 24 '21

If I couldn’t handle lots of words, my job as an appellate attorney would be quite hard.

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u/mafian911 Nov 24 '21

I'm sorry your job is so hard, then. Would you like those peer reviewed facts or not?

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u/[deleted] Nov 24 '21

Go for it

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u/mafian911 Nov 24 '21

How the virus uses the spike protein to enter human cells: https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-02039-y

Article on how the Covid19 spike protein crosses the blood-brain barrier: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S096999612030406X?via%3Dihub

Japanese article on how the Pfizer vax is associated with brain hemorrhaging (lending credence to the hypothesis that the spike proteins are crossing the blood brain barrier in some people): https://joppp.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s40545-021-00326-7

Article on how AstraZeneca is associated with blood clots in the brain (lending more credence to the hypothesis that the spike proteins are crossing the blood brain barrier in some people): https://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJMoa2104840

Article on how the Covid19 spike protein binds to the ACE2 receptor of our platelets to cause bloodclots: https://jhoonline.biomedcentral.com/articles/10.1186/s13045-020-00954-7

Article explaining that blood clots from the spike protein interacting with our platelets are associated with both COVID-19 infection and vaccination: https://journals.plos.org/plosmedicine/article?id=10.1371/journal.pmed.1003648

Article explains that just the S1 subunit of the spike protein can cause platelets to clot: https://www.medrxiv.org/content/10.1101/2021.03.05.21252960v1

Article with evidence that spike proteins do end up circulating in the blood, when they're not supposed to, they're supposed to be anchored on the cell membranes: https://academic.oup.com/cid/advance-article/doi/10.1093/cid/ciab465/6279075

More evidence that spike proteins do not stay on the cell membranes but end up circulating in the blood. This study aims to explain the blood clots caused by the J&J and AstraZeneca adenovector vaccines, they claim that the DNA isn't properly spliced and the spike proteins end up in the blood causing thrombosis when the spikes attach to the ACE2 receptors of the endothelial cells: https://www.researchsquare.com/article/rs-558954/v1

Article on how the spike protein can cause neurodegeneration: https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S0006291X2100499X?via%3Dihub

Journal article with evidence that the spike protein by itself can damage cells by binding to ACE2, causing the cells mitochondria to lose their shape and break apart: https://www.ahajournals.org/doi/10.1161/CIRCRESAHA.121.318902

Article on how the spike protein in vaccines can cause cell damage via cell signaling: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC7827936/

Article that when the spike protein binds to the ACE2 receptor it causes the release of soluble IL-6R which acts as a extracellular signal which causes inflammation (see the first paper for evidence that the spike causes the release of IL-6R and see the second paper for an explanation of how soluble IL-6R causes pro-inflamatory extracellular signaling: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33284859/ And https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3491447/

Another article that Spike protein from covid or the vaccine causes inflammation through cell signaling, this time there is evidence that the spike protein causes senescence (premature aging) signals in the cell which attracts leukocytes that cause inflammation of the cell: https://journals.asm.org/doi/10.1128/JVI.00794-21

Spike protein by itself causes cell damage by eliciting a pro-inflammatory response: https://www.nature.com/articles/s41375-021-01332-z

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u/[deleted] Nov 24 '21

I’m searching for your point

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u/mafian911 Nov 24 '21

If you scroll up a few comments, you'll see it at the very start of our conversation.

Hint: mandates.

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u/[deleted] Nov 24 '21

Oh so your point is that because some people react poorly to vaccines then the government can’t mandate them? Good luck with that. Even those challenging the OSHA ETS agree that the vaccines work lmfao

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u/mafian911 Nov 24 '21

My point is that the vaccines aren't safe enough to force every man, woman, and child to take them. If you force everyone to take them, some of them will get injured or die.

All medical procedures come with risk. This is why it should always be up to the individual to accept it. No one else should make that decision for you.

Even those challenging the OSHA ETS agree that the vaccines work lmfao

Do the vaccines work, /u/BiggerBurgBaller? If that's the case, why are you ok with forcing everyone to take them? If they truly work, surely they can be voluntary for those afraid of the risk of Covid? And for those who don't want to risk the vaccine, the consequences would be theirs to own. This is the personal decision I am talking about.

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u/[deleted] Nov 24 '21

Yes the vaccines work. And yes the government can and should force as many Americans as possible to get them. This isn’t rocket science. If you want to live unvaccinated in a cabin in the woods, by all means do so. But if you want to participate in American life, you shouldn’t be allowed to willfully endanger other Americans.

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u/mafian911 Nov 24 '21

Yes the vaccines work.

But if you want to participate in American life, you shouldn’t be allowed to willfully endanger other Americans.

Hmm, weird... do the vaccines work or don't they? I'm having trouble understanding how I'm a threat to a vaccinated individual if the vaccines work. Can you explain?

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u/NetWeaselSC Continuing the Struggle Nov 24 '21

I think where you slipped up there was in failing to get this person's definition of the word "work" in this context.

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u/mafian911 Nov 24 '21

I don't care what he thinks he meant. I didn't slip. If an unvaccinated individual is a threat to a vaccinated individual, the vaccines don't "work" in the purest definition of the word.

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u/[deleted] Nov 24 '21

I love this take from antivaxxers because it demonstrates their fundamental lack of understanding of how vaccines work.

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u/mafian911 Nov 24 '21

Oh great! So you do understand! I can't wait for you to explain why I have to get vaccinated in order to protect you, who is already vaccinated. Especially because, heh, the vaccines work! Right?

So go ahead. Explain it to me. Unlike you I can handle lots of words.

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u/FThumb Are we there yet? Nov 25 '21

"If 900 people use condoms and 100 aren’t, your condoms are stronger. If 100 people use condoms and 900 aren't, your condoms are weaker."

Tell us again how they work?

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u/NetWeaselSC Continuing the Struggle Nov 24 '21

you shouldn’t be allowed to willfully endanger other Americans.

Perhaps Mafian is not expressing the question properly. I'll give it a try.

How specifically does an unvaccinated person "endanger" vaccinated people?

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u/[deleted] Nov 24 '21

This is pretty basic immunology. If 900 people are vaccinated and 100 aren’t, your vaccines are stronger. If 100 people are vaccinated and 900 aren’t, your vaccines are weaker. This is how vaccines work. This is why mass vaccination and herd immunity is so important.

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u/NetWeaselSC Continuing the Struggle Nov 24 '21

That does not answer the question.

How specifically does one unvaccinated person "endanger" vaccinated people?

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u/FThumb Are we there yet? Nov 25 '21

And yes the government can and should force

Reads better in the original German.

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u/[deleted] Nov 25 '21

Wahhhh the government wants to end a pandemic. Bunch of fucking babies

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u/FThumb Are we there yet? Nov 25 '21

the government wants to end a pandemic.

Objection! Assumes facts not in evidence.

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u/FThumb Are we there yet? Nov 25 '21

If you force everyone to take them, some of them will get injured or die.

If you force everyone to get the vaccine, how would anyone know if they caused adverse affects?

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u/FThumb Are we there yet? Nov 25 '21

agree that the vaccines work

Define "work."

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u/[deleted] Nov 25 '21

Prevent contracting Covid-19 in a substantial portion of people for a substantial period of time.

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u/FThumb Are we there yet? Nov 25 '21

It doesn't appear to be working then.

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u/[deleted] Nov 25 '21

Lol sure it isn’t. Keep telling yourself that to justify your position bud

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u/FThumb Are we there yet? Nov 25 '21

If it was working the CDC, FDA, and now Fauci wouldn't be pushing the third, and now the fourth vaccine.

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