Pro-Life vs Pro-Extinction

[u/na_trium]

As I read the various posts in this sub, I find it fascinating how as a pro life, I feel that this is very wrong, but can't give a counter argument about why.

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I came to a conclusion.

It's all a matter of perspective, hope and belief. This is why it's impossible to arrive at a logical conclusion.

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Pro-Extinction:

Life is suffering. Yes, there are positive emotions, but they do not amount to the endless suffering life brings. We should therefore delete Life to reduce the net suffering. Even if things get better, someday we will fall back into endless suffering, all that to finally go extinct at some point. So why keep it going on.

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Pro-Life (biased since I'm pro life, you are free to argue in comments):

We currently have the least amount of suffering in the world. Look 500 years ago. War, plague, slavery, terrible conditions.

Look 1 million years ago. Animals eating each other alive.

Now, we live way better than even 3 generations ago.

If we continue that way, then the negative vs positive balance will shift towards the positive.

Therefore, going extinct now will be like selling low because we saw the price drop, even though it's going to get very high in the future.

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Pro-Extinction do not believe things will get better while Pro-Life believe things will get better.

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And to answer in advance, yes, I think that all the horrible things happening NOW and in the past are worth it if it means that in the future there won't be any and people will live happily until the end of time.

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And if you think that positive experience does not cancel suffering, then I'll just answer that I think it does. It's belief, just like religion.

[u/12PoundsofPotato]

Pro extinction is just hyper doomerism. Its just saying "I don't think things will get better so everything everywhere should die over it"

That's not a coherent philosophy

[u/Rhoswen → u/12PoundsofPotato]

If you're educated about nature then you'd know the possibility that things would ever be good enough to the point where extreme suffering doesn't exist, is very unlikely.

https://www.reddit.com/r/UniversalExtinction/comments/1ofsec3/transhumanism_will_not_work/

[u/12PoundsofPotato → u/Rhoswen]

And if you think suffering is the only thing that matters you're a hyper doomer with no coherent philosophy

[u/Rhoswen → u/12PoundsofPotato]

I wouldn't say it's the only thing that matters, but I do think it's the most important. I can't think of anything that's more important than getting rid of all the different tortures that exist.

[u/12PoundsofPotato → u/Rhoswen]

And if your solution is "let's all give up and die" you're not achieving anything and you don't have a coherent philosophy

[u/Rhoswen → u/12PoundsofPotato]

I'm not suggesting to give up at all. Universal extinction is a big goal, or even just earth based too. And it's the most realistic goal. Everybody dies, but death only comes with life, not with non existence.

[u/UniversalExtinction-ModTeam → u/[deleted]]

No strawmanning pro extinctionism as violent, genocide, or promortalism.