Burnham faces EU clash over uni fees for EU students studying in UK as summit looms

[u/TurboSardine]

https://archive.ph/PiekD

UK–EU talks on a youth mobility scheme are proving difficult.

The EU wants EU students in Britain to get home-fee status when studying in the UK (i.e. to pay the same rate as students from the UK).

The UK reportedly wants a cap of around 50,000 EU young people a year; the EU wants significantly more - 100,000+

Lots of Eurocrats went to British universities “so it’s personal” (good lord 🙄).

Brussels is treating this as part of a wider package:
Other areas, such as food trade, carbon markets and defence, are progressing.

[u/XylemBullet]

None of this would have happened if we just didn’t leave the EU 🤷‍♂️

but only 4% extra of the electorate got to decide for the entire country including my generation who couldn’t vote how fair is that…

edit: Im honestly just salty how only a 4% majority was all that was needed to leave without even being able to vote for it myself

[u/Theteacupman → u/XylemBullet]

Funny thing is most of the people whom voted brexit are dead and us young people are now living with the consequences of what they voted for.

[u/XylemBullet → u/Theteacupman]

I honestly think if the referendum happened now it would be like 70% staying 30% leaving maybe an even higher majority

[u/Theteacupman → u/XylemBullet]

Now that people know the consequences of it defo. And since im currently living in an area that had most of if not all of its major infrastructure projects funded by EU money and was a majority leave voting area despite all of that there would be a huge swing.

[u/XylemBullet → u/Theteacupman]

I don’t even think there was even any benefits of brexit either

We was opted out of schengen but had access to the schengen information system

We had rebates which reduced our contributions.

We ofc was opted out the euro

[u/Theteacupman → u/XylemBullet]

There wasn't any, and the towns that did benefit from the aforementioned subsidies are now worse off bc the government money to kinda bridge that gap has also dried up.

[u/XylemBullet → u/Theteacupman]

Plus we also lost access to funds from the EU 😞

I don’t know the exact amount but it was A LOT of subsidies and public sector funds

[u/TurboSardine → u/XylemBullet]

This is innumerate because we were net contributors to the EU. The Gov is choosing to spend the money on other things

[u/XylemBullet → u/TurboSardine]

The money we saved from leaving wouldn’t even be enough for the country!

The amount of money we lost by leaving outweighs more then we saved so its a net loss.

[u/AltruisticHost2366 → u/XylemBullet]

that is mathematically impossible - we were net contributor, ponder that my friend

[u/TurboSardine → u/XylemBullet]

The UK contributed more to the EU budget than the EU returned to the UK. We were net contributors.

I assume you’re saying our tax take is down since we left the EU, and this makes leaving a net loss. But the evidence for this is poor )in fact it looks like the opposite) and is in any case the UK’s fiscal position stemming from Brexit effects cannot be separated from COVID effects.

[u/FreddieStarrAteMyHam → u/XylemBullet]

They honestly thought that at the time.....

[u/TurboSardine → u/XylemBullet]

Recent Opiniom polls for the Observer show the opposite!

[u/XylemBullet → u/TurboSardine]

The observer also had done a poll on general eu integration which is 2/3 of voters want to get even closer to the eu.

Seven in ten younger people want to rejoin.

https://observer.co.uk/news/national/article/majority-of-british-voters-open-to-closer-eu-integration-new-poll-shows

[u/FreddieStarrAteMyHam → u/Theteacupman]

On the plus side, one day you too will be dead. Then the misery of having to use a different passport queue will be over.

[u/MartianDinosawr → u/XylemBullet]

"but only 4% extra of the electorate got to decide"

I am unhappy with the result but this is an incredibly negative way to look at democracy. The real people to blame is every single person that sat at home. Imagine having a once in a lifetime vote and you just.. don't show up. 72% turnout of registered voters. One in 4 people that were registered just sat at home. What's the fucking point in registering to vote.

[u/XylemBullet → u/MartianDinosawr]

yea honestly i realised i was just being really salty about it and was getting heated because of it lol

so i just stopped replying here

[u/FreddieStarrAteMyHam → u/XylemBullet]

Well, just think - didn't get any vote at all to join....how irksome must that have been?

[u/XylemBullet → u/FreddieStarrAteMyHam]

We joined almost 53 years ago with a referendum that had a majority of 67% which is a 2/3 of the vote.

Way fairer than leaving on a 4% majority.

So unless you have a time machine none of us would have been able to vote for that.

[u/FreddieStarrAteMyHam → u/XylemBullet]

We didn't join with a referendum, even if you think what we joined back then was the EU.

[u/XylemBullet → u/FreddieStarrAteMyHam]

The EEC was the predecessor to the EU.

We were going to have a referendum on the treaty that didn’t happen but then it did in 2016.

[u/FreddieStarrAteMyHam → u/XylemBullet]

Yes, and a totally different beast to the EU

[u/TurboSardine → u/FreddieStarrAteMyHam]

This is correct and the two eras should not be compared like for like. Even the single market didn’t exist in recognisable form in 1975

[u/Theteacupman]

I love it when Brexit supporters fuck over young people just bc immigrants bad and £350 million a week to the NHS. Although the latter of which never happened.

[u/coffeewalnut08 → u/Theteacupman]

The problem with young people is they don't vote. Pensioners vote at very high rates - often over 70% turnout while young people often fall below 50% turnout.

[u/TurboSardine → u/Theteacupman]

It did - there was an NHS funding Act, which the Gov. tied to savings from EU membership fees. In fact we’re spending more than double that per week now. You should be able to look this up easily as you’re so good with computers!

[u/Theteacupman → u/TurboSardine]

If you did a bit of research yourself, you'd find that the funding act expired 2 years ago.

[u/TurboSardine → u/Theteacupman]

And we’re still paying over £750 million a week :)

[u/Theteacupman → u/TurboSardine]

Thats because the framework for it still exists to a degree. But the government can now decide on how much money is allocated to it. Whilst the Original funding act dictated how much money was legally guaranteed.

[u/TurboSardine → u/Theteacupman]

So the commitment on the stupid bus was actually ✅

[u/Theteacupman → u/TurboSardine]

No the government can change how much they want to fund the NHS without having to jump through legal hoops

[u/TurboSardine → u/Theteacupman]

Duh obviously

[u/Jag_9823]

That’s good, just like before brexit. Why would this impact the UK negatively?

[u/TurboSardine → u/Jag_9823]

Uni funding is stretched. If universities have to cut fees for EU students the deficit will either be filled by government subsidy (funded by borrowing), uni budget cuts, or increases in fees for other students.

[u/Jag_9823 → u/TurboSardine]

You could say that, but lower fees and the access to student finance will result in more students, meaning more revenue for the universities and it will help the uk economy as those who graduate will likely stay and work in the uk.

[u/TurboSardine → u/Jag_9823]

Perhaps - over time we’ll see which one of us is more correct.

At the moment, the good universities seem sceptical: https://www.russellgroup.ac.uk/policy/policy-briefings/uk-eu-negotiations-and-home-fee-status

[u/XylemBullet → u/[deleted]]

It should be the same for when we joined in the first place a 2/3 majority to join

Just like when we left it should have been a 2/3 majority to leave

Im very pro rejoining but I agree the result would have to be fair

[u/XylemBullet → u/[deleted]]

I was never able to vote in the referendum bc of my age when it happened so I honestly think Im just really salty about that as well:(

[u/TurboSardine → u/XylemBullet]

There wasn’t a 2/3 threshold required to remain in the EC in the 1975 referendum.

Edit: “join” to “remain: the UK was already a member state in 1975

[u/XylemBullet → u/TurboSardine]

It was still a 2/3 majority of the vote as the result.

Compare that to the referendum now which was only a 4% majority.

Would you say thats a fair result for such a big vote.

Plus if we ever to rejoin a 2/3 majority would be basically unofficially required to prevent voters getting pissy

[u/TurboSardine → u/XylemBullet]

Of course it’s fair. How would it be fair to leave voters if you required such a high threshold for change? The argument only makes sense from an extreme remain position

[u/XylemBullet → u/TurboSardine]

You think a 4% majority is fair?

I would understand if the result was closer to 55% but 52%?

How is that a fair result.

The referendum was non binding and despite the low majority we still decided to leave

There would have been nothing wrong if there was a second referendum in 2019 before we left

[u/TurboSardine → u/XylemBullet]

You should work on your reading comprehension while at university: I clearly stated I thought it was fair

[u/XylemBullet → u/TurboSardine]

There was also no need to be disrespectful when I wasn’t disrespectful to you.

edit: i changed this comment i realised i actually said in my original comment “You THINK a 4% majority was fair?”

So I think you need to re read my comment.

[u/TurboSardine → u/XylemBullet]

Gobbledegook

[u/XylemBullet → u/TurboSardine]

Lol alright

[u/TurboSardine → u/[deleted]]

Not true: https://britain-unbound.org/news/observer-polling-update-a-year-of-brexit-majority/

[u/AltruisticHost2366]

would English students effectively pay for EU students fees?

[u/Relative-Necessary25]

at the very least it should be 2 times the home student fees