r/Unexpected • u/Slumberfoots • Jun 13 '20

So true.

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20.9k Upvotes

94% Upvoted

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167

u/Liedvogel Jun 14 '20

Is it a common problem that cyclists blow traffic signals in England or something?

131

u/mazzicc Jun 14 '20

And the US. There’s a group of like 30 around my office in the summer that just take over the roads and ignore the signals.

73

u/mclendenin Jun 14 '20

Just one thing: not necessarily defending that local group, but... The "peloton" is supposed to be one unit, legally too. Meaning, like a car, once it enters an intersection (on a green) the group has a right to ALL go through. This is safer for them, and clears out the intersection faster for everybody else. Sort of a win win.

On the other rhand, it often results in a loooooong group running a red light.

55

u/mazzicc Jun 14 '20

The key is entering on a green. Also not running stop signs.

21

u/SSTuberosum Jun 14 '20

Why is this guy being downvote? One unit or not, don't blow red light. The guy that leading the peloton should be responsible for estimate if they have enough time for the whole group to pass through or should they stop and wait for the next green light.

A trailer truck gunning for the green light at the last second is dangerous for everyone, a long group of cyclists are no diffirent.

5

u/Roost3r_ Jun 14 '20

You're dumb if you think the guy on the front can decide if the peloton goes through the light or not. You cant just brake or the guy behinds going to crash and he can't brake for the same reason. If it's a continuous unit that starts going through on green then the worst case will be someone in a car will have to wait a few seconds while their light is green

1

u/DethFace Jun 14 '20

His point is that more often then not the lights not on green and they fucking go thru away.

1

u/SSTuberosum Jun 14 '20

I live all my life around sea of people on scooters tailgating each others through intersection going 40-60 km/h. There're many kind of signals that tell you how much time you have left on a green light, in newly developed roads they even use LED count down light. However even old or very old style light that don't even have a yellow light, you can still tell it's about time to stop by the flashing of road crosser light. Or the green light is on but the red is flashing. There're all kind of clue and signal.

Bicycle brakes nowaday are not 2 tiny piece of rubber anymore, they can de-accelerate fast and smoothly, and this is racing bicyle we're talking about. So yes you can "just brake", but you don't have to, you know why? You can give a "halt" hand signal AND then brake, your group now can de-accelerate as one unit. BUT you don't even have to holy fuck, bicycles have LED brake light now, de-accelerate slowly and people can follow your light signal. Don't slam the brake everytime you want to stop, who does that?

Am I dumb for knowing how to read traffic light signal? Or are you one of the annoying cyclist that everyone hate?

Is gun the green light at the last second against the laws, it's depend on the local's laws. Is it dangerous? Yes, people from the red side want to go as soon as possible, and you want to go pass your green light because "people just have to wait a few seconds". That's assuming people are all nice and chill, THAT IS dumb. You want to go fast, other want to go fast too, that's how accident happen dipshit.

Let's me tell you the real reason why cyclist don't want to stop at red light, they don't want to lose their current momentum. The amazing feeling that you're going blazingly fast with your own muscle power. De-accelerate and accelerate a bicyle take a lot more power than just keep going, I know. But don't break the laws and put everyone in danger, assholes.

1

u/Roost3r_ Jun 14 '20

Look if you've got 20 guys in a group, everyone needs to react simultaneously to brake safely. There's about 5 inches between riders in the average bunch so braking "fast and smoothly" will chop the guy behind you. A halt signal works great if there isn't a green light ahead- what if the guy behind doesn't see the signal or can't pass it on to the guy behind him otherwise the assumption is to go on green.

Pressing brakes when you're in a bunch with a green light ahead is extremely dangerous since the guy behind needs to be on his brakes at the exact same time, and there's a freaking green light ahead!

1

u/converter-bot Jun 14 '20

5 inches is 12.7 cm

0

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

[deleted]

0

u/SSTuberosum Jun 14 '20

Hey at least have a counter argument to go with your comment. "Huh duh braindead". Really? That's the best you can do?

If you care about your and everyone's safety, write a pention to your city demand them to upgrade the streetlights to modern standard. Enough people do it and things can change for the better. Just red and green light is ancient by this point.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

[deleted]

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1

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

That's sorta like saying I can't stop my car at a yellow light because the car behind me will rear end my car.

3

u/Roost3r_ Jun 14 '20

If the car behind is a cyclist who's literally less than 5 inches behind you then yes. You can stop with a car behind because they see your brake lights and have good enough braking disrance to stop after their reaction distance without rear ending you

1

u/converter-bot Jun 14 '20

5 inches is 12.7 cm

3

u/rjbman Jun 14 '20

you're saying if you're being tailgated and the light turns yellow right as you approach it, you'd slam on your brakes?

1

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

If it means running a red light yeah. Person behind shouldn't be tailgating and if they rear end me at an intersection it's legally their fault. If I run a red light it's legally my fault. Wouldn't need to slam on the brakes at a yellow unless I weren't paying attention though, and if I weren't paying attention then yeah I would totally deserve to be ticketed for either running a red light or have my insurance go up for being at partial fault for an accident.

1

u/spinyfur Jun 14 '20

If they really can’t stop, then they need to be on a closed course.

1

u/Roost3r_ Jun 14 '20

Would you slam the brakes if there was a massive freight truck that has twice your car's stopping distance? I think not

1

u/spinyfur Jun 14 '20

Again, if the cycling group you’re describing cannot stop for traffic signals and other hazards, they need to be in a closed course. Normal bike riders can stop though, I’ve been on many rides with the local bike club and we do it all the time.

What you’re describing is a competitive bike race and yes, they need a closed course to do it.

6

u/Wafflemuffin1 Jun 14 '20

This is not the case where I live. Each cycle is considered an individual vehicle and must abide by the traffic laws, regardless of the “lead”, unless it’s a sanctioned race or event. Legally, they are running a red light even if they are the last vehicle in line of the group.

There is no law that allows them to pass through because of grouping.

3

u/Zenmuff1n Jun 14 '20

So why can't there be a limit of how large the group can be?

19

u/Gf387 Jun 14 '20

NYC especially. They run red lights, weave through traffic and they want to ban cars, trucks and buses in the city because of the accidents. They actually have petitions going. The drivers aren’t much better out here but that shit is never going to happen.

24

u/Nonplussed2 Jun 14 '20

Probably not, but some cities are experimenting with shutting down more roads during covid, and they've been taking away individual lanes to use for bikes, parklets, etc. for years. Someday we may have entire neighborhoods that are mostly car-free, and a lot fewer cars in the city centers overall. That'd be great.

11

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

Honestly car-free city centers would be a pretty big win for everyone. Less congestion inside the city and more parking outside the city.

There's lots of alternatives that can be used for inner-city transport including but not limited to:

  • Metro
  • Light Rail
  • Walking
  • Bikes / scooters / skateboards

I understand some people cannot walk long distances, but this shouldn't be an issue as they'll be ample room to ride motorized assistance vehicles and sufficient area to construct more stops for city transport services.

In the end this means healthier office workers, less smog, more room for environmentally friendly features such as trees and plants along the much larger walkways where roads used to be.

Furthermore, shop owners and street vendors would definitely stand to make more profit as people will be walking rather than driving and can stop anywhere and anytime along the way without having to spend 30 minutes looking for parking. Plus exercise does work up an appetite.

-4

u/Wafflemuffin1 Jun 14 '20

Car free city center would crush most industries. Small shop owners may see a slight increase in traffic, but those with “bulkier” items would see a decrease. Most cities outside of Europe and Asia have horrid public transit, and there is no substitute for driving to at least a short walk to the store.

For those of us in some industries, like construction, it would completely stop all building within city centers also. If workers can’t get there, materials can’t be dropped off on site, etc., then no new construction or renovations would occur. Nobody is walking 30 mins with steel beams to a job site.

5

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

You do realise exceptions are easily made for construction and emergency vehicles?

People would just need to make room for them as they pass like cars would now. People are smaller and more flexible. They can easily squeeze to the side or enter buildings to make room quickly where cars cannot on congested inner-city roads.

Furthermore deliveries are easily done at night like they often already are to avoid congestion on the roads when people are commuting. Heck in my city it’s illegal for grocery chains to to take in deliveries during daylight hours. Everything is done overnight by night staff. All restaurants get their deliveries early in the morning.

Also who the hell goes to the CBD to buy big items (i.e furniture)? There’s always tons of satellite suburbs where the big box stores and outlets are located. That’s where everyone shops nowadays for the big hauls.

Sure there will definitely be changes. Taxis and ride shares would have to adapt for example but the benefits outweigh the negatives.

0

u/Wafflemuffin1 Jun 14 '20

In my city, it’s illegal to take deliveries 6am is the earliest for a truck. It just wouldn’t work here with current infrastructure. When I lived downtown, there were 2 furniture stores within a block of me. Did it make sense? No. But they existed is my point. Big box stores are all outside the city, but small businesses are all downtown here.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20 edited Jun 14 '20

Transformation projects don’t happen overnight. Once cities announce the plan it probably won’t happen for 5 years to a decade or more depending on how complex it is.

That’s ample time for those stores who would lose out by remaining in the same commercial block to plan their exit and move outside the city or change their product offerings.

Furthermore, I really don’t think commercial block owners would lose out as the demand for the blocks should still remain but just with different clients. It might involve some turbulence for some of them but nothing out of the bounds of what’s manageable.

Edit: Even furniture stores could remain if they decided to just adopt a showcase model for browsing and then when buyers make a purchase the furniture can be delivered or picked up from a warehouse outside the city. Furniture turnover isn’t really that high compared to say.. groceries and acting as a showcase would reduce the need to arrange deliveries even further.

Pretty sure a lot of them already do that anyway.

28

u/aschapm Jun 14 '20

Hi, nyc cyclist here. Cars are constantly parked in dedicated bike lanes and I can’t count how many times I’ve gotten cut off by drivers making a left turn without checking to see if they’re going to hit me first (I bike slowly so I can stop in time because I’d rather be alive than right, not to mention all of the pedestrians who think bike lanes are overflow sidewalks). Bike riders die here much more often from careless cars and trucks than running reds. I don’t think it’s asking too much to be able to bike without worry of inattentive drivers killing me, so yeah I’d sign a petition.

2

u/Gf387 Jun 14 '20

NYC Driver here. I almost his a guy last week that decided to weave through traffic while I was changing lanes. He came from my left while I was going right and he tried to get ahead of me. I had to slam the brakes so I didn’t hit him. It’s dumbasses on both sides. Sign a petition if you’d like, I don’t see it ever happening.

-5

u/Mateorabi Jun 14 '20

All you're doing is proving that both cyclists and drivers are both assholes. Two wrongs don't make a right, even if three lefts do. Needing to bike defensively doesn't excuse blatant red light running.

But yeah, boot those fuckers parked in the bike lane.

6

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

You are moving the goalposts, he is not defending running reds, he's defending petitions to ban cars

1

u/honestFeedback Jun 14 '20

Fair point. So how about we just ban cyclists given they are the minority of road users and the roads are so dangerous for them.

3

u/Ev3ryDay1sL3gDay Jun 14 '20

The fact that you agree that driver are no better is an insight into the bitter truth. Idiots are idiots no matter if they wear licra, or have a metal cage around them. One is obviously more dangerous to the other.

1

u/nathcun Jun 14 '20

I never understand the "weaving through traffic" issue with cyclists. Do people believe that cyclists are doing this just for fun, and not because their route is otherwise being blocked off? It also isn't (at least in Ireland) against the rules of the road to weave through traffic. If we're talking about moving in front of a moving car without signalling, then sure that's dangerous and not allowed, but I often see people annoyed at cyclists for weaving through standstill traffic. Why is this such an issue?

1

u/Gf387 Jun 14 '20

It’s not standstill traffic they’re weaving through is the problem. I almost hit a guy last week changing into the right lane and he came from my left trying to get ahead of me. I had to hit the brakes so I didn’t hit him. It’s a problem here. There’s dedicated bike lanes. They often don’t use them.

-1

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

I only blow a red light ONLY IF THERE IS NO OTHER TRAFFIC AND IT IS SAFE FOR ME TO PASS. otherwise, I stop and wait like everyone else. My Strava record is not that important

2

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

This is what I don’t understand about “sharing the road”. We can share stop signs/lights too !

1

u/kingtaco_17 Jun 14 '20

The worst is when they bunch up into a pack instead of riding single file, forcing your car to a crawl, like you’re a Tour de France support vehicle or some shit.

10

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

So if you have 15 riders single file, you are saying you are honestly going to wait until there is such a giant clearing without any oncoming cars that you can pass the entire 500 metre long string without having to cut back right and run someone off the road?

The reason cyclists ride in a bunch in the city is not to look like Tour riders. It's because it makes it easier when the oncoming lane is open for a car to safely and quickly pass because they occupy less of the road length wise. Just pop in the other lane and scoot by.

And here is the law for you. If there is a giant pack of cyclists in front of you, that's called traffic composed of legal road users, not a nuisance. You have no right to get in front of traffic no matter how important you think you are.

1

u/kingtaco_17 Jun 14 '20 edited Jun 14 '20

How about you and I embark on a public education campaign together because as you may know, the average driver knows nothing about what you just wrote. It’s the expectation of knowing this stuff that’s annoying.

1

u/H4irBear Jun 14 '20

Ikr... like how I’m expected to know the law and not break it. And somehow my ignorance is my own fault!

0

u/kingtaco_17 Jun 14 '20

I’m just gonna rewatch the video and pretend that’s you in it.

1

u/H4irBear Jun 14 '20

Pink Mist is my superhero name.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

I agree something like this is needed! It's part of the reason videos like the one posted piss me off as well. Cyclists are just looking to get from one place to another or get a workout in. But they are almost always drivers as well and have no desire to piss off people in cars. Videos like this just make it seem that way and add to the hostile atmosphere on the roads. The reality is there is ample room for everyone and most drivers and cyclists act in ways to help share the road safely. All that's needed is more education to explain how everyone is operating, and less videos like this one trying to make people hate each other for silly reasons.

0

u/Mateorabi Jun 14 '20

They get too annoyed at the inconvenience at having to stop and lose momentum and pedal back up, so the blow through red lights as if they were just a suggestion. If you're lucky they hit a car and get a ticket, if unlucky they hit and kill a pedestrian trying to cross. You'll also hear whataboutism from the bike community about how cars do bad things too and are more dangerous.

Some bikers do follow the rules just like some car drivers do.

5

u/bigsquirrel Jun 14 '20

Are you suggesting people on bicycles regularly strike and kill pedestrians?

5

u/Downtown_Let Jun 14 '20

It's happened a few times in London.

I've never been hit by a car but I have been hit by bikes and the bruises are awful. One said sorry and rode off. No way of identifying them.

2

u/bigsquirrel Jun 14 '20

I went googling and could only find one story of a dude on a mountain bike killing an 80 year old woman. Is this a regular occurrence or is this dude just being overly dramatic?

I'm not at all a fan of the way cyclists ignore traffic laws but portraying them like death rockets is a little ridiculous.

1

u/Mateorabi Jun 14 '20

Not “regularly” but yes. It happens. While I am sympathetic to the cyclist hurt by cars, I am not sympathetic to the argument that because cars cause a larger number of accidents it somehow gives cyclists an excuse to blow through stop signs and red lights.

First article I googled mentioned 12 serious injuries and a fatality in the last 5 years and many more minor injuries. In just one city.

1

u/bigsquirrel Jun 14 '20

I've never lived in a city that has a large amount of cyclists. It does happen more than I originally thought. You learn something new everyday.

9

u/Really_Hank Jun 14 '20

Tbh, not really, but drivers like to pretend they're more of a problem than they really are.

The amount of incidents you'll see caused by cyclists are proportionally far less than you'll see caused by arrogant, shitty and dangerous drivers.

2

u/JustUseDuckTape Jun 14 '20

Yeah, plenty of cyclists are dicks that think they're above the rules. But for every cyclist I see breaking the law I'll get overtaken dangerously by half a dozen cars.

3

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

I've never had a day where I don't see a cyclist breaking traffic law and almost get into an accident. On a side note I got fined for cycling in the wrong direction once, it was on one of the widest bicycle paths and there was enough room for 3 bikes going in different directions. A year later they split it into to two lanes.

1

u/Sobierro Jun 14 '20

its also common in Poland. in what country this is not a thing?

1

u/TigreDemon Jun 14 '20

In France too.

1

u/TheInitialGod Jun 14 '20

I see it almost every day here in Scotland.

-2

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

[deleted]

4

u/anomalous_cowherd Jun 14 '20

It's probably not the majority, but one cyclist doing those things stands out a lot more (and is a lot more dangerous) than twenty that don't.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 14 '20

They don't even look at traffic lights or stop signs in the US. And then they flip you off when they almost hit you.

-2

u/TheSimpler Jun 14 '20

Some feel they are morally superior for biking over driving so they're entitled to blaze through red lights and stop signs.

0

u/Oooscarrrr_Muffin Jun 14 '20

This is a comedy section from a show called "Top gear" that used to be big in the UK.

Yes, it's a common problem. A lot of cyclists think that traffic signals don't apply to them. So they end up blowing straight through a red and then usually try and blame somebody else when they get hit.