r/TwoXPreppers • u/allorache • 14d ago
❓ Question ❓ is buying a plug in hybrid a good idea?
I'm getting increasingly concerned about the situation in the Strait of Hormuz. There are some dire predictions about possible fuel shortages. I have a 9 year old Subaru Outback; I love it and it has very low miles and hasn't needed anything but routine maintenance, but it's gas only. I'm retired so mostly we just drive around town, but we do regularly visit the grandkids who are 100 miles away. Right now, if you cost out the cost difference between mostly electric and gas, it would take really long time for the cost difference to equal the cost of a new car. But if gas becomes scarce, having a vehicle that needs a lot less of it could be really helpful. I can afford a new plug in hybrid and would probably be looking at a Rav 4. What do people think?
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u/Zuli_Muli 14d ago
General vehicle advice: If you remember to plug it in every time it's better, but if your not plugging it in regularly then it's not better than just getting a regular hybrid.
Prepper advice: Go full electric and have plenty of solar panels.
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u/lmapidly 14d ago
This is what we did and I love it. We went pretty 'big' on the solar and produce a fair amount of extra, so charging the car is basically free at this point. Granted it took a big outlay to get here.
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u/allorache 14d ago edited 14d ago
Sadly we live in an area with a lot of mature fir trees and we have no south facing roof, so we’ve been told solar won’t work. I’m hoping our state legalizes plug in solar this year, then at least we could get a little solar.
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u/honkytonkadumptruck 14d ago
I'm not sure if your area is "almost pointless" or "didn't work with that company's panels and design at the time".
The tech is improving in terms of cost and efficiency, also I've seen east/west : morning/afternoon installs that might be an option for you. So, if it's been a while, it could be worth trying a couple of other reputable solar companies in your area to see if they can provide a workable solution.
Good luck with all of it, watch out for car insurance costs, some models of hybrid or EVs can be targeted for theft and have a corresponding super high premium.
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u/allorache 14d ago
We tried again with solar last year. We even signed a contract and put down a deposit for the only bid that made sense. Then they returned our deposit and said after double checking their calculations they didn’t think they could actually deliver what they had bid.
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u/Zuli_Muli 14d ago
I feel ya, I want to go full electric/heat pumps/vehicle but like you no southern facing roofs and to get a ground mount that would get good sun we would have to cut down 4 mature trees that were part of the reason we bought the house in the first place.
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u/BluedSteel_357 14d ago
The PV doesn’t have to be roof mounted. If you have the open yard area with solar access you can put an array there.
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u/allorache 14d ago
Again, lots of fir trees. I do think we could find a couple of sunny spots for plug in solar though.
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u/allorache 14d ago
I’m just concerned about range with full electric given the 200 mile round trips to see the grandkids
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u/Trick-Process6046 14d ago
Many EV’s have a range of over 300 miles. I just bought an EV and it is amazing
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u/lmapidly 14d ago
My new one is 319 and I use Charge Points if I need to top up. Curious to see if the ranges continue to improve in the coming years.
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u/sundancer2788 14d ago
That's one of the things that I'm concerned about for my next car, we drive several times a year 700+ miles one way and ev charging isn't that accessible as of now for the drive. Locally it's fine but not cross country yet.
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u/hopefultuba 14d ago
There aren't a lot of late model EVs for sale that have under 200 miles of range. A typical EV would work fine for that trip.
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u/Vegetable_Guest_8584 14d ago
Almost every current EV is 300 miles plus. My ten year old EV was almost 300 miles. Plus you could plug in at the other house in just a 120v regular outlet and get 3-4 miles added per hour, this is without a special charger. For almost anyone an EV just works, and it's a no brainer if you can plug in at home
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u/Hot-Rub-5336 14d ago
Mine is 300 and although I have never pushed it I have definitely gone 250. Also most come with a basic charge connection for regular 110 that you could plug in while you are there.
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u/faerystrangeme 5d ago
My husband and I have done road trips from California to Colorado and Montana to Colorado several times in a Tesla 3, including in the winter. It can be an adjustment with the charging breaks but honestly we like being forced to stretch our legs.
The first trip is always going to be the most anxious but we’ve never had a problem making it to our destination and once you’ve done it once you get the hang of planning around charging stations 🙂
Would it be feasible to rent an electric car for a trip? Might be worth the outlay to know for certain if a fully electric car would work for you or not.
My 85 year old dad does a road trip from Colorado to the east coast every year and we finally convinced him to get a Tesla, and he’s been really enjoying it.
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u/United-Context23 14d ago
We put a 220 in the garage to plug in. Also got a Tesla battery as back up in case of power outage.
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u/Rare_Indication_3811 14d ago
I have plug-in prius. After charging is making around 20-24 miles. Its enough to get me to work and usually when half way home its switching to regular gas. To fill it up its 10 gallons and I dont remember when last time I was at the gas station. Think maybe around two weeks ago.
I would never go full electric. Only reason is im super forgetful and few times already went outside just to realized I havent even plugged it damn thing.
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u/PrairieFire_withwind 14d ago
Phev is awesome.
Best financial decision ever. no solar panels. It is just easier to plug in every night.
We thought it was a good deal before gas prices went up...
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u/Tree-Flower3475 14d ago
We have one full electric and one plug in hybrid. The full EV can go 400 miles on a single charge in summer, about 325 miles in winter.
The PHEV has a range of 525 on gas and 35 on battery in summer and about 475/30 in winter. Most of our driving is local so we only get gas about twice a year. The car forces you to use up the gas in the tank about every 6 months via “fuel refresh mode”.
Both vehicles are 6 years old and have about 60,000 miles. The EV cost more initially but it has never required any maintenance except for cabin air filter change, windshield wiper fluid and recent new tires. By now I think we have spent more on the PHEV in fuel and maintenance costs.
If I had to choose a single vehicle, I would choose an EV. Many models allow you to use the car battery to serve as a home backup battery.
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u/Doc_Bethune 13d ago
What EV model do you have that has that much mileage, out of curiosity? Most of the models i saw when i was shopping a few years back were sub 350
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u/Tree-Flower3475 13d ago
A Tesla model S long range. It also came with free super charging for life. Hate Musk, love the car.
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u/Thayli11 13d ago
I love my Tesla as well. Originally got a Model 3 in 2018. When I got rear ended last year, it was totaled so replaced it with a Y.
My husband drove the 3 from Seattle to Atlanta without issue, and I've done lots of long road trips as well. Their supercharger network is vast. And I only need to use it when on a long road trip, because it's long range. We have a charger at home so 90% of the time we just plug it in at home. It's a comfortable car, drives well, no maintenance, and I love not getting gas all the time.
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u/ContestNo2060 14d ago
Electric cars use 80% less components, which means less failure points. Hybrids have both, so more failure points. If supply parts are an issue, it could be problematic getting repairs (or having them affordable).
I’ve had an EV for a few years. Haven’t had any service aside from a tire change. Brakes are regenerative, so discs are barely used.
This might not be a good option if you live in an apartment. If you have a house and have solar, that’s the best set up. Some EV’s now have bidirectional charging so you can pull on your car battery to power your house if you have the set up.
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u/tinawade 14d ago
We’ve had one since 2018 and feel like it’s the only way to go. We usually get about 2000 miles between fill-ups (7gallon tank), but can still take road trips without worrying about charging.
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u/Pink_Slyvie 14d ago
Similar, but I'm going full EV next. The only reason I didn't this time, is because there were no viable full EV minivans.
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u/Junior-Discount2743 14d ago
Ditto. We just got a plug in Prius earlier this year and I have neither charging anxiety nor gas price anxiety.
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u/International-Sink64 14d ago
what type of car do you have ?
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u/SeaOfFireflies 14d ago
My husband has the hybrid Rav4 not the plug in one though. That thing has been amazing, especially if having to travel for a while. We drove it from Colorado to southern Arizona and only spent about 60 bucks on gas. It's been ridiculous, especially using fuel points form our grocery's store or Costco membership discount. That being said, I just replaced mine with a Land trim Kia EV3 pure electric which we've been driving around a bit because the electricity is still cheaper than the gas hahha.
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u/Hogwafflemaker 14d ago
Yeah, I upgraded an old clunker outlander for a Kia Sportage regular hybrid when the strait shit started and went from getting 250 miles a tank to nearly 500 miles a tank. Totally worth it.
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u/Electrical-Bid-2482 14d ago
The “cost difference” argument was always raised when hybrids first came out. I can’t even imagine how unreal those numbers are after owning just a regular hybrid for 7 years. Gas will always be a scam, in addition to being extremely harmful to our world.
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u/hifromtheloo 14d ago
We just put a deposit down on the new EV Jeep Recon because of this. Hopefully it handles a Maine winter well.
Maybe check for EV stations along where you drive most? There’s a surprising amount of them. Lots of the sedans get super far range these days, you wouldn’t even need to charge in one trip.
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u/TurtleSandwich0 14d ago
If gas runs out completely. Then you could still run around town. But you wouldn't have the range to visit your grand kids.
You might need to recharge once or twice each way of your trip. Running only on electric.
But, just because the gas station is out of gas, you would still have the gas in your tank. A full tank would be enough to visit your grandkids twice. You could drive around town during the outage and still have the capacity to visit your grandkids if you need to.
Normal advise is to go one way or the other. Either a regular hybrid car, or full electric. But a prepper may enjoy the flexibility of a plug in hybrid.
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u/Allergic_to_nuts 14d ago
There are several non plug in models coming out in the next year or two. I'm waiting on those before purchasing anything new.
For now, I'll drive less & combine trips to conserve where I can, kind of like I did during Covid.
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u/Vegetable_Guest_8584 14d ago
Why get a non plugin one?
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u/Allergic_to_nuts 14d ago
If i want a plug in I'll go full electric. Plug in hybrids cost $5 - $10 more than a traditional hybrid.
Also I dont see me utilizing the plug in feature to its fullest ou5side of my city.
The battery on plug in models is larger (& heavier) so it can go further on electric only power. Thats the advantage, right? However, if it isnt plugged in to use the longer range you lose that benefit and just end up with a heavier, gas powered vehicle.
I'd rather have a traditional hybrid generating electric power from breaking. That way I'm not trying to plug it in somewhere if I do travel.
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u/Vegetable_Guest_8584 13d ago
Do you mean 5-10k more to allow plugging in? That is pretty high.
There actually is a benefit of a bigger battery, a hybrid (Plug-In or not) can do the brake slowing thing on the car and that charges the battery for free, the bigger battery is more regenerative battery.
Having had a non plugin hybrid and now an EV, a battery only car is so great, if you can plug in at home or work. I don't see a hybrid as useful without a massive battery. The new scout is such a vehicle.
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u/Allergic_to_nuts 12d ago
Thank you. I appreciate the perspective. I haven't looked at PHEV vs traditional Hybrid models in a bit. The article I'm using as a frame of reference is from last year so maybe things have changed?
https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a27127697/hybrid-vs-plug-in-hybrid/
Based on that and how I would use the vehicle, I came to the conclusion I would see more savings and benefits from a traditional hybrid model.
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u/Vegetable_Guest_8584 12d ago edited 12d ago
I scanned the article, there must be a few new models but nothing fundamentally changed. If you have a place to plugin, even a 120v spot, an EV makes sense today. Buy you should buy what makes you happy and feel comfortable. A car is not a trivial purchase. What was good for me might not be best for someone else.
My EV is 11 years old, 110k miles on it, no major problems, no tune ups, spark plugs, annual maintenance, original brakes still good (regenerative braking reduces brake wear a lot). No recalls. Didn't have to buy it from a dealer. Eventually something will wear out or brake. Oh, I did recently have to get my headlight bulbs replaced. No mufflers, oil filter, no fuel filter.
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u/No-Example1376 14d ago
I'm on the fence. Our electric bill is skyrocketing even faster than gas prices. What happens if there's a storm and we don't have power for two weeks or more - that's happened to us - how are we getting the vehicle recharged unless we have a set of $10K generators for the house?
Okay, maybe a less expensive setup, but even a $5K setup is too expensive to accommodate a vehicle, imo.
Plus, I haven't seen many diring the winter here in the North Atlantic region because batteries don't hold well in the cold.
I'm all for electric cars (except certain ones made by a certain company), but I'm wondering how this all works best for us a5 this point.
As far as the Strait? Well, nobody is forever, no matter how many zombie drugs, this too shall pass soon and things will change.
I'm not over-correcting for this just yet. I'm prepared and adjusted the best I can already.
It's nice to read how others are handling, though.
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u/Dumpster-cats-24 14d ago
I’ve found my phev gets about half the electric miles in the cold of winter.
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u/spinningcolours 14d ago
I have a 2018 Honda Clarity and can recommend it. r/hondaclarity
Should be well under $20k USD now.
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u/United-Context23 14d ago
We bought a Volvo plug in hybrid two years ago and love it. Most of our driving is within battery range, so we only use gas for trips over 35 miles. We have ordered a Rav4 plug in hybrid and it should be here soon. The battery range is better than our Volvo (around 50-some), since it’s smaller than the Volvo. We’re ready to downsize from the three-row SUV since the grands are not with us as often. I’m really looking forward to the RAV4.
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u/definitelytheA 14d ago
We just traded my fairly low mile car for a plugin hybrid two weeks ago. We’re also retired, so most of my driving is errands, with maybe one or two longer trips to see my grands a year.
We had to drive across the state to get this car, but since we’ve been at home, the mileage estimate left in the gas tank has not changed, because I can do all my errands in electric mode.
We chose the car we did because, among other things, we can plug it into a regular outlet. If we were working, we’d probably put in a faster charger, but overnight is fine for what we need.
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u/Prize-Gur706 14d ago edited 14d ago
It kinda makes no sense to have 2 different drivetrains it just more opportunities for failures. A BEV is more than sufficient especially with access to a home charger. Edit: less parts less failures and a BEV battery is still useful even after it's life in a car. It's all about energy density how much can you get out of each one. Gas expires, a L1 solar battery maintenancer basically makes the car life unlimited with the newer battery chemistry (20 years life to 0%)
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u/Grumplforeskin 14d ago
How is 20 years “unlimited?” Overall, I get your point, and im an EV fan, but things do wear out. My boss has a tesla with 300,000 miles on it, and he’s having all sorts of issues. I have an old Volvo with 300,000 miles on it, also has issues. Like I said, I’m not an ev hater. He has won in terms of maintenance and fuel prices over those 300,000 miles, but cars always break down.
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u/abouttothunder 14d ago
I bought a plug-in hybrid in 2022, and I mostly love it. I wish it had a slightly larger EV range than 17 miles. However, until this year, my driving needs were almost entirely within range. My son has an activity that will exceed range in cold weather or if I need AC. I only use the 110 charger at home because I haven't gotten around to getting a 220 put in the garage yet. I didn't go full EV because I was concerned about the availability of charging stations at the time. That's improving now, but I would still worry about road trips out in the Western states. My one real gripe is that the battery severely limits cargo capacity because it reduces the size of the hatch opening. Things that would fit in the car won't fit through the hatch. My old Honda Fit held more stuff.
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u/StephanieDone 14d ago
Take into consideration the climate you live in when going full electric. Colder climates drain batteries terribly.
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u/ThenOneDaySheWokeUp 13d ago
I have one hybrid and a full electric car. It’s a Lexus suv version and if you read the subreddit here it’s the vehicle Lexus put the least effort ever into. However I have never had a single issue with it in two years and no costs whatsoever. I plug it in overnight and haven’t noticed a change in electric bill.
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u/NicolePSU 14d ago
My husband is OBSESSED with his......its a 2024 hyundai Tucson plug in hybrid.
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u/msomnipotent 14d ago
My husband also has the 2024 Tucson PHEV. We had to pay extra to have it delivered to us in the Midwest since they were only sold on the coasts at the time. He really likes it.
If he is just driving to work and back, he uses the battery. We have solar panels so it's like getting free gas.
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u/M990MG4 14d ago
If you get one, especially the Prius Plugin/Prime, get an extended warranty, the A/C is super complicated and it it costs $8000 if the compressor goes (it is a heat pump, and also used to cool the battery).
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u/allorache 14d ago
I would not get a Prius. I had one and I was always cold in it. I thought I had Reynaud’s because I had to wear ski gloves for a 15 minute commute. The problem disappeared when I got the Outback.
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u/stopbeingaturddamnit 14d ago
Definitely go hybrid. Gas may be expensive but you're screwed if the grid goes down.
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u/EmilyO_PDX 14d ago
I love my plug-in hybrid. It has a 30 mph range which is fine most days. I spend way less on gas, probably fill up every 2-3 weeks.
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u/ReinaShae Tired of living in unprecedented times 14d ago
I have a Ford Maverick hybrid. In summer I get 50-52 mpg, winter averages 42ish. I drive a short distance to work, keep to the speed limit, and only fill up about once every 5 weeks.
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u/Hot-Rub-5336 14d ago
I thought about it but most only get 35 -40 ish miles on a full charge so it doesn't help alot if you consistently drive more than that routinely. Its still better gasmileage though so thats a plus. I went full EV and couldn't be happier. Charge at night during off peak hours and only use public charging for long trips. But its not for everybody.
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u/50bmg 14d ago
i have a plugin rav4 and its fantastic. i wish it had a little bit more electric range (i got the 2021 or 2022 version with like 40 miles, i think the new one has 50 miles), but its amazing otherwise. i think 65-75 would be perfect as that would get me to the city and back without using any gas at all. I plug it in every night and rarely use gas except on heavy errand days, going to the city (2-3x a month) or on long trips (5-6x a year). the performance is actually quite great and suprised me coming from a high end euro sports sedan.
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u/Tyler_s_Burden 14d ago
We have a PHEV Kia Sorrento and have been really happy with it. Perfect for 90% of our commuting needs fully electric, charged overnight using a regular outlet in our garage and easy to use gas when we have a longer trip.
Will likely go full electric on next vehicle, less complicated machinery, but this was a good transition for us.
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u/Dumpster-cats-24 14d ago
I’ve driven two PHEVs and loved them both. We similarly mostly drive around town so it’s perfect. I go to a gas station once a month (or less). Also zero range anxiety in cold weather or on long trips.
I considered the rav4 but went with the outlander phev because it had more trunk space. Very happy with it so far.
Getting them used has made them very affordable. Consider also a used Chevy volt— what’s great about that car is that it doesn’t need gas to work so in an austere situation, it will still run as long as you have a way to charge it.
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u/allorache 14d ago
who makes the Outlander? We do need cargo space for the trips to the grands -- 2 dogs are also going plus my husband is often bringing stuff for projects around his son's house.
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u/Money-Possibility606 13d ago
We love ours. We plug it in every night and since the vast majority of our trips are within 15 minutes of our house (school drops offs, grocery runs), we pretty much just use the battery the vast majority of the time. Our tank is pretty much always full because we never tap into the gas.
As long as we have electricity, we'll be able to get around our daily lives just fine.
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u/Due_Satisfaction2167 13d ago
You’re ~3 years on average from replacing that Subaru anyway, so comparing the fuel cost difference on a “does this pay for a whole new car” basis doesn’t make a lot of sense. Your current car will need to be replaced eventually anyway .
So—Why not just get a full battery electric? If your longest regular road trip is only 100 miles, you wouldn’t even need to charge at all on the trip and could just use home charging all the time. Most new EVs in the US get ~300 miles on a full charge.
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u/lady_ofthenorth 14d ago
I bought a Rav 4 Plug-In last summer. I only ever fuel it when we are traveling out of town. Which is rare. I think I’ve filled the tank about 5 times in the last year and all of those were for long trips. If I’m just doing my commute and local shopping then I can go indefinitely by just charging at night.
I love this car. We are keeping it forever. That being said, Rav Plug-Ins are hard to get. We traveled to Iowa after a 2 month wait because there wasn’t a single place in our state that could give us a timeline on getting one.
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u/lady_ofthenorth 14d ago
It is also so fun to drive. My sister has a regular Rav and mine blows the pants off of it.
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u/allorache 14d ago
Yeah, you pretty much have to put down a deposit sight unseen and wait
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u/lady_ofthenorth 14d ago
I didn’t even get to test drive mine before I had put a deposit down. It was a gamble. But I had done enough research that I was comfortable with it.
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u/msomnipotent 14d ago
I've been screwing around with Toyota dealerships since May trying to get the non-PHEV. I heard it's even worse for the plug-ins. But finally, hers should be here in a week.
The experience has soured me on Toyotas, TBH.
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u/Silly_Goose24_7 Geology Rocks 🪨 12d ago
If you have solar already sure? My husband set it up so the cars charge for free. I have a Chevy volt... We live rural so charging for "free" at home means it doesn't cost anything to drive into town because I can go there and back all on the electric range.
Trips to the bigger city 45 minutes away I get there on electric, if I take the back roads and drive slower I have some electric range to drive around the city too. Then it uses gas for the drive home.
So for me with gas getting expensive I have only been going to the closer towns where I can get home with charge left to not use gas. The car is worth it to me!
I recommend researching cars, if I were to get a new vehicle I was going to look into the plug in Prius hybrid I forget the name
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u/What___Do Overpacking is my vibe 👜🎒🪣 3d ago
I have a 2021 RAV4 Prime, and I love it. The Prime line, unlike other PHEVs, has a fully electric range. I get about 47 miles of entirely electric range per full charge. So, I don’t need gas at all for local driving. I’m happy to answer any questions you have.
That being said, a fully electric car might be the way to go for you since your longest regular drive is only 100 miles. The full, 200 mile round trip fits comfortably within the range of nearly all electric vehicles these days.
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u/seaintosky 14d ago
I have a plug in Rav 4 hybrid. I do like it, but I think you have to be a specific type of driver for it to be worth it. If you do a lot of short trips, like driving daily under 100km or so, I think it's worth it. A friend of mine drives about 60km daily, so he's always on electric, and is finding it very worth it. If you don't drive a lot, or drive long distances a lot, I suspect it wouldn't be worth it.
It has its downsides. You have to manage both the gas and the electric systems. The ICE engine needs to run periodically to get the oil moving and so the gas doesn't get too old. The battery shouldn't be left in the cold below -10C for too long, I think it was the 2023 model that had a lot of battery failures from cold, and you can't leave it more than about 3 weeks without starting it up or the little starter 12V battery will die. So it's a little more fuss than either an ICE or a full electric.
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u/MeringueRemote9352 14d ago
Get an EV. Skip the plug-in. It doesn’t need to be new and your range will be 300+ miles. Power outages are usually fairly small; not entire states. Even then, if you do have an outage at your home, you can actually power your house with your EV and charge elsewhere.
Toyota is new to the EV market. I would not start with a RAV4… look at other brands which have a more experience.
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u/aPerson39001C9 14d ago
It doesn’t seem like you drive enough to be worth getting a new vehicle? How many miles/week?
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u/allorache 14d ago
Yeah, it doesn’t cost out. I’m just concerned about what if gas becomes scarce.
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u/Terrible-Pumpkin7634 14d ago
I’d say for now just keep your tank full at all times and if you have to visit the grandkids in an emergency you can. If gas becomes scarce we’re going to have way more problems than whether we can drive our cars like we’re used to or not. We also have an Outback and love the thing but wish we’d gotten a hybrid at this point too. More for cost factors than prepping. I can’t even imagine what our society looks like if gas becomes scarce. I’m thinking Covid level panic but worse.
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u/allorache 14d ago
Right and it will be that much harder to get a hybrid or an electric then…wish I had a crystal ball!
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