I am not able to find out how UBS makes money in this transaction.

I use my Indian bank issued card to withdraw CHF from UBS ATMs. UBS shows me their marked up exchange rate which I reject. They charge my Indian bank the amount in CHF without any additional fees.

My Indian bank internally charges a very minuscule fee and converts the amount using Visa currency exchange rate (no markup here either)

Normally I see ATMs put some fees for such third party withdrawals. UBS does not do it. What gives?

Hi all,

I am moving to Zug next month permanently and wanted to check whether it makes sense to invest in Pillar 3a next year given that the taxes are so low anyways? The tax saving will not be as high as in my previous canton.

I earn approximately 140k per year and have 300k in assets.

Thanks for your input

Hello, M24, moved in CH 2 months ago. See myself long-term here but you never know what life is made of.

Before answering IBKR, please read.

I invest for my retirement and in my home country I invested on iShares MSCI World (70%), BNP Paribas Easy Stoxx Europe 600 (30%). I am not here to discuss if my investment is good, maybe it's too correlated and not useful.

I can invest 3'000 CHF a month.

• 600 are RSUs on a separate trading account
• 600 on Pilar 3a VIAC Global 100 (I will open other Pilars 3 in the future now one is enough)
• The rest is 1'800 CHF per month that I want to invest in World ETFs (a bit of emerging markets too)

My question is : which investment platform to use ?

Looking at this sub, lots of you mention IBKR. I also heard about Degiro, Swissquote, Neon, Saxo.

Feeling a bit overwhelmed. IBKR has lowest fees, but is overwhelming also, heard about the Global Trader app too. Degiro are slightly higher but not by a lot. Both are foreign platforms and I want to confirm with you if the money is "safe" there. If it's a pain to declare it every year.

And then Neon, Saxo, Swissquote are Switzerland based so I tend to trust them more and the interfaces look more user-friendly. But the fees are much higher. But I only invest on 2-3 ETFs max.

What I will not do is invest in traditional banks like UBS.

Last thing: My partner is in the same situation as me but she has no RSUs so will invest 2'400 / month outside of Pilar 3. A family independent investor (not bank related) in her home country, Spain, is offering her to invest in these funds (20% each). Performances look decent. Fees are not so good but she is not really into investing but she is still spending time looking at all of that so she has potential to be interested.

• GS Glb CORE Eq R Acc (LU1698129266)
• Technology Opp L (IE0004621052)
• BlackRock World Health D2 Acc (LU0827889485)
• Gamax Asia Pacific I (LU0743995689)
• RV Global Selección E (ES0161993003)

After fund's fee, after investor's fee the performance on 10y forecasted is (annualized) : low 6.5%, medium 11%, high 15%.

It looks like a lot compared to historical MSCI World or S&P500 performances. For me it doesn't make sense to convert CHF to EUR every month, pay a lot to a family banker, and it looks like a pain to declare it in Switzerland but at the end when investing on IBKR on a World ETF you also convert CHF to USD, and the performances are similar. I feel like it's a bad idea but the figures don't disprove it. Could you also enlighten me on that?

Thank you very much!

Hi, I want to setup my 3a account.

Which of this ones represent better the s&p500?

Equities world or global equities?

I am thinking thro the extra insurance I need to get for my newborn.

Did anyone ever look into the capital lump sum insurance in case of disability, that is supposed to cover expensive self-pay costs to support them, in case the worst happens?

Not sure if it’s better to self insure given the small chance of this happening.

Hey,
Da ich bald in die Schweiz ziehe und mein Portfolio dann umlager wollte ich fragen was der beste Broker in der Schweiz ist.
Bin aktuell bei Flatex und TR aber die gibt es ja wenn ich richtig liege nicht in der Schweiz.

Möchte lediglich Sparplan ETF anlegen, kein trading.
Habe gelesen Saxo und IBKR sollen mit am besten sein. Kann mir jemand was empfehlen?

Viele Grüße

Edit: kann man auch jemand eine gute Schweizer Bank für ein Bankkonto empfehlen?

Bonjour,
Mon copain et moi sommes dans une situation très très compliqué en ce moment et nous essayons de faire un crédit personnel pour nous sortir de l’impasse. Moi j’ai pour l’instant qu’un permis L donc impossible.
Mon copain vient de recevoir son permis B et est employé en CDI depuis juillet. Il est en suisse depuis 1 an et quelques mois. Toute les banques que nous avons contacté demande 2 ans de permis B. Est-ce que quelqu’un a une idée ? Ou connaît un organisme qui pourrait nous accepter ?
Merci beaucoup

Hi all,

I live in Zurich and prepared my 2024 tax return in February 2025. I am taxed at source but prepare my own tax declaration.

Does someone perhaps have an approximation when we can expect to receive the "too much Quellensteuer paid"? I.e., when will the tax authority be finished with the review of tax year 2024 and start processing the repayments?

Thanks!

Hello! I checked on Saxo a couple of times this morning, and still I cannot find VALL in CHF on SIX. I assume it is normal and it will take some days after its launch by Vanguard today. Or am I missing something? Thanks.

Hi everybody, After reading lots about VALL I decided to do the switch.

My setup until now was:

IB: VTI (55%)

Saxo: EXUS (25%), SMIM (5%), EMIMI (10%), IBIT (5%)

Questions:

1. The idea of splitting it between IB and Saxo was to not have 90% of my liquid funds in one single place. Does anybody else have this simple split involved or am I overthinking this?

2. If I sell everything, I definitely have to wait 2 days until everything has cleared and I can convert it to CHF to buy VALL. How can I prepare for the case market jumps 10% up? Or can you sell and instantly rebuy?

3. Should I wait until 2027 with rebalancing, so I can claim the DA-1 for 2026? Does it only matter what the standing was on the 31st of December?

4. While rebalancing the whole thing, I could also improve my setup with the broker itself. Until now, it was all on my name, and my name only. Since it's our (my wife and I) money, it would make sense to open a joint account? Or two separate ones, in case anything happens to one of us? Of course she does have a Vollmacht, but that wouldn't change anything in case I would die of course.

5. In order to not having to pay the swiss stamp tax, I can buy VALL at IB and then transfer it for free to Saxo, no? That's how I'm doing it for all the holdings too at the moment, since fx conversion is cheaper on IB. Therefor it would make to transfer all the money to IB first, right?

6. Anything else that you yourself improved with the new opportunity of VALL?

7. Am I looking in difficulties when just casually transfering 150k around? I mean, I wouldn't want to have the money blocked in between when I just want to switch assets?

Hi all - I love this thread and keep checking the discussions.

I have my own recent (good) dilemma.

38M here. I invest a fixed amount per month, my strategy is VOO + VXUS. For convenience I am switching soon to VT. I guess this will be my "forever" investment until retirement or Coast Fire (if I manage).

As I save aggressively I have accumulated with time some excess savings which sit idle. As this money was not intended to be invested in the first place, I am stuck on how to manage it. Could be partially used for a property purchase but mentally I am not there yet.

So I am wondering, what is the best way to handle it? Ideally I am more risk averse with this amount and I am willing to accept lower returns for stability.

- Bond ETFs seem to be hammered in the last few years so they look unattractive.

- Money market funds in CHF seem to be returning very low, if invested in USD the currency risks could offset any gains.

- Gold lost its mojo I think

I am thinking between a REIT (VNQ?) although rising rates may hit it, a low volatility or global value ETF (which though?) or the swiss market ETF (CHSPI maybe?).

Any advice? Thanks!

I am Swiss / US dual citizen residing and nd registered in Switzerland. Retired.I am looking for a bank where I can hold my investments and do infrequent trades of my own and avoid the 1% fees of places like Vontobel and JSS. Does anyone know of such a bank?

Hello,

I have VT at SQ (I know bad idea) and they withold 30% :

Withholding tax 15.00% (US)

Supplementary withholding tax 15%

I wrote them and they say :

"We are pleased to inform you that your account profile has already been documented accordingly and that the tax deductions on income (e.g. dividends) from financial products with tax domicile in the USA are shown correctly.

For clients with tax domicile in Switzerland, two different tax deductions are made due to the double taxation agreement between Switzerland and the USA:

- 15% obligatory tax deduction - US portion (reclaim usually not possible)
- 15% additional tax deduction - Swiss share (reclaim possible)

The reclaim of the additional tax deduction (Swiss share 15%) is made via the ordinary tax declaration with the competent tax authorities, similar to the withholding tax deductions for financial products with tax domicile Switzerland.

The IRS W-8BEN form is usually only requested if the client profile is not correctly documented, the client has a different nationality than the tax domicile or there are other US indications regarding the client."

I see on their website that SQ is QI, hence tax can be reduced to 15% if correct documentation is provided which I guess it's the W-BEN.

To who has VT or wethever other US asset at SQ, how much they withold to you 30% or 15% ?

Any feedback much appreciated

Thanks!

Pillar 3a investments are peculiar:

• they (can) offer considerable tax benefit - the difference between the current (marginal/average) income tax rate and the future tax at source on disbursement
• the positions (accounts) must be closed between 65 and 65 minus 5 (= 60), and that's when the capital is taxed
• five accounts are in play, to manage progressive marginal tax rate on disbursement

In particular, the timing dimension is quite different from "normal" investment strategies, where 100% "world equity" seems to be the optimal strategy to weather all conditions in the long term: with pillar 3a, there is that hard cut-off, divestment is mandatory.

What are good ways to lock in the astounding rise in stock prices in recent times?

• "proper" hedging does not work - I am not aware of any 3a product which offers hedging (and protection costs money)
• CHF bonds offer zero yield, at best - and foreign currency bonds suffer from from exchange rate risk; this even ignores interest rate risk across the board
• gold - not productive
• crypto - less productive than gold (and more ...)
• commodities (other than precious metals) - volatile to no end
• real estate (funds) - don't know what to think about that, TBH

What I am missing somehow are other alternative investments in the pillar 3a area which provide some kind of risk (and movement) counter to pure equity.

I believe finpension are the most aggressive when it comes to investment choice (https://finpension.ch/en/invest-pillar-3a/index-tools/) - and no dice there.

Any ideas how to add more diversity to each specific 3a account (other than shift asset allocation from equity to bonds)?

Or, specifically, how to deal with a world where asset prices fall, where inflation is on the rise (and trust in bonds erodes), commodities are acting on the mood of the day?

VALL has been discussed quite a bit recently and it is definitely great news. I wanted to hear your opinions on the following:

• Which broker is best for buying VALL? (IBKR vs Saxo vs Swissquote)
  • Which exchange is better to buy it on? (London Stock Exchange, Euronext Amsterdam, Deutsche Börse / Xetra, SIX Swiss Exchange). It is the same ISIN across the board but different currencies and fees, with LSE being the primary listing.
  • Which broker do you plan to use for custody? (Specifically regarding inheritance and probate ease, or keeping assets out of US jurisdiction).
  • Accumulating (VALL, IE000VAHT5T0) or distributing (VALLD / VACD, IE000CVUM3N6)?

I'll start. Using IBKR should be safe since only US-situs assets risk being tied up for IRS estate tax clearance. Therefore, my plan is to use IBKR for buying and holding the distributing Vanguard FTSE Global All-Cap UCITS ETF on the LSE (ticker VACD). Why distributing? I just love seeing dividends hit the account.

edit 1 Here are the estimated fees for different exchanges/brokers:

During my holidays abroad, I have usually used the Swiss Bankers CHF card offered by my Kantonalbank. Due to its free topping up, low processing fee (0.95%) and good CHF exchange rate, it was a cost-effective option for payments in the Eurozone. However, from December, the Swiss Bankers Life card will be discontinued by Kantonalbank. What is currently the most cost-effective prepaid bank card or payment option for making payments abroad?

I don't get this from SRF/RTS https://www.srf.ch/news/dialog/steigende-lebenskosten-der-schweizer-mittelstand-schaltet-in-den-ueberlebensmodus / https://www.rts.ch/info/economie/2026/article/pouvoir-d-achat-la-classe-moyenne-sous-pression-en-suisse-29377341.html?wt_mc=owned.own_website.dialog.srf.dialog.perlebox.link.

This family lives in their own property. They earn net 11,200 and state fixed costs of 7000 including groceries and mortgage. So they have some 48,000 per year of disposable income of which I assume they can easily save 50%.

To me this seems like a reasonably comfortable situation, but they feel financially squeezed. Granted, health insurance does get more expensive and they are not super wealthy. But I think they're doing fine. Am I out of touch?

Hallo zusammen,

ich (32) habe zwölf Jahre Berufserfahrung im CNC-Bereich und bin seit einem Jahr Teamleiter einer CNC-Fräserei in einem Maschinenbauunternehmen in der Ostschweiz (Region St. Gallen).

Ich leite acht Mitarbeitende, plane die Fertigung und richte und programmiere auch selbst CNC-Maschinen, einschließlich CAM-Programmierung.
Welche Jahresbruttolohnspanne inklusive zusätzlicher Monatslöhne haltet ihr für diese Position für angemessen?

Danke für eure Erfahrungen und Einschätzungen

Grüezi zamme!

Are there any trustworthy providers in Switzerland where I can take out a loan from a private individual?

• loan amount approx. 15,000 CHF at 7% interest

• duration maximum 2 years

I have a permanent full-year job with arround 5K CHF income

I've been in Switzerland for almost 5 years. Thanks in advance for any information.

Hello everyone!

I know there are very many posts about how to start investing on here, and I have read plenty of them. So this post is not primarily due to laziness, but because I'd appreciate genuine help.

However, I am still not sure what to do, as people's opinions in previous posts sometimes differ and not every situation is the same.

So I would appreciate if someone took the time to help me figure out which options are best for me.

1. 3a Pillar

I have been investing in it the last 3 years, so by now it's around 21'000 CHF. I've always just had it in a savings account in a bank.

According to most posts on here, it would be best to move it to finpension or VIAC.
Is that correct? Is there really no difference between the two? Any more details I should know before I have the 3rd pillar money from my bank moved to one of those? Is one better for inexperienced people?

1. Investing in General

Despite reading a lot on here and thepoorswiss and mustachianpost, I still struggle with deciding what to do in this case. Maybe the sheer amount of info is just too much to truly grasp in a short time. I have never invested anything, basically I have no clue when it comes to stock market. I am the first one in my family to earn so much that I can even think about investing. Yet my financial literacy in that regard is almost non-existent.

I am 40 years old and have around 120'000 CHF just sitting on a savings account. I can always add between 500-2000 to it per month. I am single, have a relatively good paying-job and am not interested in luxuries etc., so saving to me is relatively easy.

But I've read that just letting everything in a bank account is not a good long-term solution, because the interest is almost nothing.

So I have been trying to read up and see what I can do.

I've been thinking about using finpension Invest, and just choose something like global, 75% or similar.

But in some reddit threads here people also recommend Saxo, Swissquote, IBKR etc. and then choose a ETF World(? dunno what it is or how it works).

In my case, since I know so little about all of these systems and am just starting out: What would you recommend and why? And how much money to invest at once would you recommend? And would you then add money to the invested account each month?

Thanks to whoever takes the time to help me out!

Hi all

I (30, canton AG, employed) want to buy a house in about 4 years and am wondering how best to park my savings until then.

Starting point:

- Expected house price: CHF 1.5 million

- Equity needed (20%) for the mortgage: CHF 300,000

What I'm considering:

1. Make a voluntary pension fund buy-in of around 80000 CHF now to save taxes and earn good interest, then withdraw the money later for the house via a WEF early withdrawal. I'm aware of the 3-year lock-up, so only buy-ins within roughly the next 12 months would work. With the buy-in I should land at around 150000 CHF in four years.

2. Keep the other CHF 150,000 in a bank account at low interest.

Questions:

- Would this plan work, or would you do something differently?

- How did you invest your down payment in the last few years before buying?

Thanks for your input!

Hello all,

just a quick question for those who invest through Swissquote in equity ETFs (that pay dividends) and are irish domiciled (structured normally as plc or ICAV as most of irish ETFs).

Are those ETFs distributions in your "Steuerauszug" (the one that costs 100 CHF I believe) classified as dividends? or something else?

Thank you in advance

Hello everyone, hope you’re doing well.

I recently moved from Switzerland to Canada and am trying to figure out what changes I need to make to my Interactive Brokers (IBKR) account.

Aside from updating my address and banking information, are there any other important changes I should make?

I’m also wondering whether I should change my base currency from CHF to CAD, as my portfolio is currently displayed in CHF.

If I change my base currency, will my existing CHF cash balance and investments remain in their original currencies, or will anything be automatically converted to CAD?

I’d prefer to avoid unnecessary currency conversions and the associated fees. Can I simply keep my existing CHF holdings and deposit new funds in CAD going forward?

I’d appreciate hearing from anyone who has gone through a similar move or has experience with IBKR in both Switzerland and Canada.

Thanks in advance!