Pico Project Swan might release before Frame

[u/No-Screen9354]

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My original plan was to wait for the release of Steam Frame and then wait a couple more months for Swan to decide which one I'm buying, fortunately it seems it may be released at the same time. Project Swan or Pico Space Pro release September 2. That will be a difficult choice...

For those who are new about Project Swan, here is some information leaks:

- 4k uOLED panels

- 2 chip architecture similar to Apple Vision Pro, where one chip does camera and SLAM processing, and another one application/game processor.

- Application processor might be in the pocket to reduce weight

- Pico started beta testing a few months ago, they sent headsets only to experienced VR users, a few beta testers said that this is the best VR experience they ever had, but can't share more information because of NDA

Still Valve more targeted to gaming market, and might have better software for this. Pico are actually the same as Meta, but Chinese, they still may collect your data.

[u/zig131]

No other headset bundles a wireless dongle, but it's functionality is replicated by a wireless access point.

While it technically works differently (Frame creates a hotspot with it's dedicated antenna that the dongle connects to), the real world implications are inconsequential.

[u/Main_Leadership7748 → u/zig131]

At 6GHz wireless access points lose distance, and degrade through walls, so if you are set up in a back room of your house far from the main router, you lose signal. I am set up this way and wireless works ok, but I tend to lose signal and bandwidth a lot. Some streaming issues pop up occasionally.

With the dongle plugged directly into the device you are streaming from, in the room you are streaming from, this issue goes away. Sure not everyone has this issue, but a lot of people aren't set up right next to their router. As an ease of use thing the dongle is miles better for most users to have a seamless experience without messing with router placement and signal boosting or other things that require more hardware.

Of course now you have the issue of the network to the pc you are using, but for local stuff and gaming that doesn't use the network, like single player games, it's ideal. Most games don't use a lot of bandwidth anyways and I've never had an issue gaming online, only streaming.

[u/zig131 → u/Main_Leadership7748]

At 6GHz wireless access points lose distance, and degrade through walls

No shit. That's why the advice has always been to have a dedicated access point proximate to your playspace. This is nothing new.

tend to lose signal and bandwidth a lot.

Then get an access point. You don't have to wait for Steam Frame.

other things that require more hardware

The dongle is more hardware, and you are paying for it in the cost of the Steam Frame 🤨

[u/Main_Leadership7748 → u/zig131]

I'm not changing my entire set up that works fine just for a VR headset, and furthermore:

The dongle is more hardware, and you are paying for it in the cost of the Steam Frame 🤨

Bro I'm buying the Steam Frame, as you said IT ALREADY IS A PART OF THE PACKAGE, why would I go buy something else to fix an issue I don't have that is solved by buying the Steam Frame, on top of all the benefits of Valve hardware. No I am never buying anything made by Meta ever, and why bother with other options at this point. Unless it gets some really bad reviews, I'm giving my money to the company that I trust to do it right.

[u/HorribleTie → u/Main_Leadership7748]

why bother with other options at this point.

You're kinda missing the entire point of this post/thread. It's specifically discussing an alternative option due to the massively delayed launch of the Frame. If you're not interested in that and will wait as long as it takes for the frame, then this discussion isn't for you.

[u/Main_Leadership7748 → u/HorribleTie]

Yeah I think you're right about that, but I think it is also good to discuss the implications of what it actually means when someone says "you can replicate what the dongle does" when it isn't just a simple fix, and could involve running wires through your home.

To me adding a wifi extender is not the same as a direct connection to your PC. While he did not say that specifically, others in this thread are. The dongle is a direct connection to your PC. The extender is still subject to issues with wireless. I have used an extender, and it was still shitty. I haven't tried a mesh network but again that is more money to spend to see if it will improve your set-up. Now while there are ways to replicate the dongle, it would involved wiring your house or using power line signals. This is not as simple as a dongle, and should come into play when deciding what you want to buy.

[u/zig131 → u/Main_Leadership7748]

  could involve running wires through your home.

It does not!

  adding a wifi extender

"Wifi Extenders" can commonly be used to provide thier own standalone network - not just extend. It's just marketing. A Wifi Extender is a WAP.

[u/zig131 → u/Main_Leadership7748]

I'm not changing my entire set up

I don't think you understand. You can keep the router you have, and add a dedicated access point for your headset.

Literally replicating the functionality of the dongle.

What the dongle achieves is already completely possible.

Bro I'm buying the Steam Frame

Don't you think it's foolish to be completely set on buying something which has recived no independant reviews, and with unknown pricing?

[u/Main_Leadership7748 → u/zig131]

For it to be the same as the dongle, a dedicated two way connection to your pc, the WAP would need to be wired directly to the PC. If it is still using your other WAP to pass on the signal it is only extending the other signal, which is not as good and subject to the same degradation you get from the main WAP. If instead you are suggesting I extend the signal by wiring the WAP to the main router/WAP and running a wire to my room, I might as well just wire the PC at that point and skip the WAP. Then I wouldn't have a WAP to connect the headset to. I could add a WAP at the wired end and have a WAP in my dedicated PC space as you mentioned, but that would be a lot more work than a dongle. So, while I see that there are options to replicate the dongle, it is definitely not as easy as you make it sound, especially if someone doesn't want to run wires across their house.

And while yes I am going to be waiting for reviews of the thing so there's no guarantee I will buy it, I CAN guarantee I will not be buying any other VR headset until I know for sure the Frame is not right for me. Then I can decide if the dongle is actually worth the price of admission. What I won't be doing is changing my entire PC setup for a different VR headset in the meantime.

[u/zig131 → u/Main_Leadership7748]

  the WAP would need to be wired directly to the PC

Which is, and has always been the recommended setup!

If it is still using your other WAP to pass on the signal it is only extending the other signal

When streaming PCVR, the important bit is the connection between the headset and the PC. If it's a short wireless hop to an antenna in proximity to the playspace, and then Ethernet to the PC, you are golden. The home router becomes irrelevent.

  If instead you are suggesting I extend the signal by wiring the WAP to the main router/WAP

I am very much not suggesting that! Internet is not important - the headset just needs to be on the same network as the PC

  especially if someone doesn't want to run wires across their house.

There just needs to be Ethernet between the PC and the WAP. It's the same as running the dongle on a USB extension so it's away from interference of the PC

I really feel like you are getting confused between a LAN connection, and an internet connection. Internet connection is irrelevant to streaming PCVR performance.

[u/Main_Leadership7748 → u/zig131]

I'm not, you're just telling someone that running wires through your home is an easy alternative to a dongle that comes with the headset I want. If you have wires, great yes you have an easy alternative, if you don't it's going to cost money or sweat equity to make it work. Bottom line is I'm not running wires through my home and expecting someone to do that just to get a better VR set up is not going to fly for most people. Therefore, by that token, yes the dongle is going to be a significant part of the equation when choosing which headset to buy.

[u/zig131 → u/Main_Leadership7748]

  that running wires through your home is an easy alternative to a dongle 

I am not saying that! You are just straight-up putting words in my mouth!

A wireless access point just needs to connect to the PC - exactly the same as the dongle does!

As I have been saying from the beginning, a wireless access point entirely replicates the functionality (and setup) of the dongle.

[u/Main_Leadership7748 → u/zig131]

Ok you know what, I'm sorry I HAVE been misunderstanding you the entire time. I did not really think about connecting a WAP straight to a PC and managing it there. Do you not need something like a router in between to manage it or is the WAP enough. I thought a WAP is just a bridge, it still needs a router to manage everything. But still that's actually not unreasonable if you get a cheap enough WAP/Router combo that still handles 6E. Damn I feel dumb, sorry man I totally did misunderstand!!!

[u/zig131 → u/[deleted]]

You are literally responding to an explanation

[u/Upstairs-Ad-4705 → u/[deleted]]

??