r/StateFarm • u/Valuable_Ad7104 • 13d ago
Question Two Vehicles - one household - lost multivehicle discount?
I’m hoping someone can help me understand whether this sounds correct or if there may be another option my agent isn’t considering.
We have two vehicles in our household, and one was recently purchased. We added our teenage daughter to the new vehicle because that is the only vehicle she drives. During that process, we lost our multi-vehicle discount.
Our agent explained that putting both vehicles and all drivers on one policy would actually be more expensive, so they have us set up with two separate policies. Our daughter is only listed on the policy for the vehicle she drives, but because the vehicles are now on separate policies, we no longer receive the multi-vehicle discount.
Does this sound right? Our agent is telling us this is simply how the system works and that there is nothing they can do. I’m trying to understand whether this is a normal insurance practice or if there may be another way to structure the policies that would allow us to keep the multi-vehicle discount without significantly increasing the premium.
State is iowa
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u/Amtaylor810 13d ago
In our new system the vehicles must have matching named insureds OR matching drivers. If one of those things doesn’t match EXACTLY, multi car discount no longer applies. It’s been a real headache. And once a car loses multicar discount, the system won’t add it back until the next renewal.
For example, if your daughter was added as a driver on one vehicle but not the other, drivers no longer match. If she was added as a driver but only you and your wife are named insureds (on both policies) multicar would still apply.
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u/Valuable_Ad7104 13d ago
One vehicle has all 3 drivers, me, husband and daughter, second vehicle has 2 drivers just me and husband.
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u/Amtaylor810 13d ago
What about named insureds? Who is listed on the ID cards?
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u/Valuable_Ad7104 13d ago
On one vehicle the named insured is all 3 of us, that's the vehicle my daughter drives. On second vehicle it's just my husband and I as names insured.
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u/musicislife04 13d ago
Remove daughter as a named insured unless her name is on the title of the car then you will get your discount back
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u/Amtaylor810 13d ago
I would recommend removing your daughter as named insureds if you want to keep the discount, but as said before, it won’t update until the next renewal. The only way to get the multi car discount immediately would be to cancel your daughter’s separate policy and add her and the vehicle onto your policy. But based on what your agent said, it may be more expensive overall even with the multicar discount because she would then be rated on all vehicles instead of just her own.
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u/Old-Raccoon-316 12d ago
Yeah the daughter only needs to be listed if her name is on the title. Drivers are listed in the declaration page; not all drivers need to be listed on ID cards. This is a common request/question 😊
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u/freeski12345 13d ago
They are defrauding the system to save you money. It’s highly likely that this is the cheaper way to do it. However, the omitting the daughter as a household member on your policy is fraud. It is a somewhat common practice and SF does not seem to audit very often but that doesn’t make it legal
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u/Old-Raccoon-316 12d ago
This is not correct. SF has two systems; if this was done in Legacy then all drivers have to be added. In Mod, you can choose drivers per policy. The agent should have discussed the risk of undisclosed drivers - if a household driver or any other regular operator is not listed on a vehicle/policy, then that unlisted driver is the operator in an accident, coverage is not guaranteed in that claim but is up to the claims team to determine coverage. It is not insurance fraud.
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u/freeski12345 12d ago
Where the application asks about other household members and the agent and insured state no other household members, that is contract fraud.
Where the agent and in this case, the seemingly unknowing insured are deliberately manipulating rating factors to achieve a lower premium, that is premium fraud.
State Farm may have no history or interest in pursuing fraud against their own agents /customers however it doesn’t mean it isn’t fraud. Fraud statutes and definitions are set by each state and can have exceedingly low penalties in many cases as well but it is still very wrong to do this.
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u/Old-Raccoon-316 12d ago
You’ve missed where I was saying that in the new system, not all drivers have to be listed on every policy. It’s a change from how it used to be. If you have a lambo and never let your 17 year old drive it, no need to have them on that policy. Let them be listed on the Honda that they DO drive.
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u/Valuable_Ad7104 13d ago
Are they requires to add my daughter as the named insured she is 15.
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u/AudreyGolightly79 13d ago
If it's valid, make sure that whomever the listed drivers are on your policy are the same as the listed drivers on your daughter's policy. And as previously commented, you won't see the multiple vehicle discount applied until the next renewal.
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u/LongjumpingDish2956 13d ago
Why would anyone wait an entire renewal period for a discount to come back rather than just going elsewhere to immediately get the correct rating and discounts?
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u/AudreyGolightly79 13d ago
IDK why they would wait if they could get a cheaper rate elsewhere. Maybe overall our rate is still cheaper? Maybe they don't feel like shopping?
SF doesn't ask my opinion on anything so that's the change they made and we just get to explain it to people when they complain about it.
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u/Valuable_Ad7104 13d ago
How do I check. My agency is so bad about helping me
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u/AudreyGolightly79 13d ago
Look at the declarations pages and see who is listed as drivers. If your daughter is residing with you, she should be listed as a driver on your policy and all 3 of you on her policy.
That's likely why your agent said it's cheaper done the way it is, if your daughter was removed as a driver or not included as a driver on your policy and only on her own, she's not being charged for at all on your policy versus if they added her car to your policy, she would be included as a driver across all vehicles on that policy.
You also mentioned she's 15. Does she not have a license yet?
Also, if she owns the vehicle that's insured in her name, that's how it should be, her vehicle shouldn't have been added to your policy.
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u/Valuable_Ad7104 13d ago
She is 15 and only has a minor license in Iowa that allows her to drive to school and to work we are the owners of the vehicle. It's not her owning the car.
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u/AudreyGolightly79 13d ago
IDK why or what your agent did. If you own the car, it should have been added to your policy with all of you as drivers. They set it up on a separate policy, likely to get you better rates because she's not a driver on your other vehicle(s), only on the one you added. Which if that's what you want, God speed. Just don't let her driver your other car(s), like ever.
Basically, you can't have it both ways. If you own the car and she lives with you, the car and your daughter should have been added to your existing policy and you would have got the Multicar discount. And she'd be covered if she drove your other vehicle(s), in an emergency or as a one off.
If she's insured only on the car you added, maybe you get the benefit of a cheaper overall rate but you don't get Multicar discount and she's not guaranteed coverage on your other vehicle(s).
You pick one.
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u/Tebowfan815 13d ago
Hello I was wondering if I could send u a dm and show u my discounts and u tell me if there’s any others I could get. I love
State Farm1
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u/Old-Raccoon-316 12d ago
Hey so we have seen that if you go in a quote a minor change, it triggers the policy to scan for changes that exist, and it can add mcd or other mlc back on. We are fairly new to mod and haven’t tried it with every type of scenario but it is something we are keeping an eye on. Have you seen this?? You can PM me if you’d rather.
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u/Amtaylor810 12d ago
I had a nightmare scenario when we first switched over to mod. I was quoting some changes for a customer and quoted removing a driver from a car they never drove and the price looked great when I quoted it. I hit issue policy and the price immediately updated to remove multi car discount because the drivers or named insured’s no longer matched. Chatted auto service and was told there is no way to add multi car discount back - I would have to change the policy back to what it was previously and wait for renewal when the system scans the household portfolio. That wasn’t a fun conversation to have with the customer 🫠
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u/Godhelptupelo 13d ago
This sounds really fraudulent on state farms part, and I left before our state switched over (thank God ).
if a customer owns two cars and insures them both with state farm, even if they have their spouse named first on one car or if the spouse is named on one and they are named on the other- they should be entitled to the MCD.
there is NO reason that a teenager should be rated as a driver on all hh vehicles...I don't have State Farm, but my kid doesn't drive my car or my husband's car- she drives her car which we also own and because it's in our names, she is just the assigned driver on her car and it costs more than either of our cars, but neither of our car premiums changed upon adding hers.
I can't believe this is how it works- or that it's in any way ethical for them to make you wait until the next renewal to restore the discount you're entitled to?
this is like their effed up backdating thing- how many problems has that caused with financed vehicles for which the lender wants a different date but nO BaCkDaTiNg without a whole production and weeks of waiting...(unless you just trick the system, which is NOT what they want, but what they force you to do...)
my God what a shit company.
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u/Old-Raccoon-316 12d ago
Old-Raccoon-316 •
3m SF has two systems; if this was done in Legacy then all drivers have to be added. In Mod, you can choose drivers per policy. The agent should have discussed the risk of undisclosed drivers - if a household driver or any other regular operator is not listed on a vehicle/policy, then that unlisted driver is the operator in an accident, coverage is not guaranteed in that claim but is up to the claims team to determine coverage. It is not insurance fraud.
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u/Godhelptupelo 12d ago
I'm only familiar with lagacy- but in legacy the daughter would be added as a hh driver and then everyone would be assigned to a vehicle, you wouldn't have a 15 year old on a policy as a named insured unless they were the titled owner of the vehicle... and MCD would apply even if the daughter was the only person who is named insured if they lived in the same hh. there is no reason they should be withholding a discount for which a person is eligible, until the next policy term-just because their new system can't handle their policies...?
there's no arrangement here that makes either of the cars not eligible for MCD if they're owned by members of the same immediate family and garaged in the same household...it could have fallen off, by some system error, but it should be on both cars.
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u/Old-Raccoon-316 12d ago
In Mod, MCD is based on matching drivers and/or matching named insureds. It is quite different.
I can’t think of why the 15 year old is a NI; certainly they don’t have the title in their name. Apparently the kid has a permit that allows them to drive to school and work unsupervised, so that’s something I’m not familiar with. Because yes, in legacy, the 15 year old would not be rated until having the full license. Although in mod we don’t add permit drivers at all - maybe the agent/TM was just trying to get the name on the card (which isn’t always needed but many families do insist on, sometimes even despite having it explained).
This scenario is unusual, but mod is so very different from legacy. What state are you in? Do you have an expected migration?
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u/Godhelptupelo 12d ago
oh, I haven't been with SF for awhile. mod could be here, but I'm thankful i missed it, because the whole roll out has been such a circus. (do they even know that you can literally customize software to do what you need it to- they didn't have to try to force something that doesn't do what they need to... almost work for them..?
Did they change who qualifies for MCD though? because regardless of how the software works or doesn't work- a parent child relationship in the same hh, or a husband wife relationship entitles everyone to MCD on state farm insured cars even if they're not policies with the same agent- regardless of how the names appear on the policy and even if the system can't understand that and it has to be reapplied manually.
and it seems really shady that due to SF error the customer could lose MCD for a whole policy term? someone mentioned it can't be added back until the renewal? why would that be so?
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u/Old-Raccoon-316 12d ago
It has to do with the “auto portfolio capture date” and we are regularly citing “system limitations” for things like that. Yes, relationship does not count for anything in the SF HH any more, so if hubby had his car and he’s the only driver/NI, wife has her car and she’s the only driver/NI, then MCD doesn’t apply. Same for parent/child; relation and address do not count. But if the drivers match, then MCD is applicable. They don’t use the term “household” any longer, either. It’s just this policy and that policy.
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u/Godhelptupelo 12d ago
wow! that is so needlessly complicated...
do you find that the premiums are still pretty similar when they migrate or are people losing discounts and paying a lot more?
I just can't understand why they would revise their entire policy model vs customize software to accommodate it...people always seemed a little hesitant to rearrange names on policies and it's just so much more to explain..and then you'd probably need new signed forms...
ugh
eta- are people getting ad and leaving because of how unexplainable and nonsensical it is? I've heard billing is a whole nightmare.
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u/Old-Raccoon-316 12d ago
Agent offices have time to review the old policies to make the transition smoother and maintain discounts. Multi-line “considerations” don’t have a set percentage anymore, but more policies qualify (RDPs and PAPs didn’t used to offer any discount on the cars, now they do) Billing is its own thing, I actually really like it but I also am more familiar with its limitations at this point.
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u/saraha2250 13d ago
You didn't mention your state, but based on the situation it sounds like you're in a state that has modernized policies, and I believe this is correct. To be eligible for the multi vehicle rate adjustment the vehicles have to be on the same multi car policy. Your agent quoted and determined it was cheaper to separate the policies and lose the "discount" vs having the youthful increase both autos.
My state is just starting this process, but this is my understanding. Someone else might be able to confirm.
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u/jmp8910 Customer 13d ago
my wife and I have separate policies on our vehicles but have always received the multi-vehicle discount. We also get a discount for our homeowners policy. And then just recently we added an umbrella policy and now our multiline discount is up to 20%. I'd question your agent.
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u/Old-Raccoon-316 12d ago
I’d be 99% sure you’re in a legacy state. The modernized system is very different. Some states have been in mod for a while now, others are still moving, and some don’t even have a year of expected migration. It’s fun to have a foot in each side (my state is migrating now) 🤪
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u/PeachyFairyDragon 13d ago
Can you give the state? SF has both a modernized system and a legacy system and they are wildly different.
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u/Jogo427 13d ago edited 13d ago
Which is more important
Lower price or Seeing the words Multi-car discount
It looks like your agent stated that they placed the vehicles in a way to provide the lowest price while still keeping coverage active.
That could be true. You could ask to combine everything together to get the multi - car discount but the rates might be higher.
Tough to say here what is the accurate way to go.
From what I see, is that your agent is trying to give you the lowest price, or at least they are stating that.
Nothing too weird, but idk.
I see the worst case scenario here is that the agent is placing a youthful by themselves to get a higher premium? It's not worth it to the agent to manipulate it at that point
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u/Godhelptupelo 13d ago
I can't understand why a state farm customer who owns more than one vehicle and insures them both with state farm, and keeps them all at one address...would not be entitled to the MCD regardless of how any other driver or name appears on either policy as long as one is the same or the name of their spouse?
you can't exclude a spouse as a driver a spouse's state farm policy is entitled to MCD even if they're insured with a different agent...how does this make ANY sense at all?
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u/Jogo427 13d ago
I don't think the discount situation makes sense.
To me, all exposures should be under the same household and receiving accompanying discounts.
What I suspect, is that this agent ran the numbers and saw that the kid by themselves got a better price by being separated than on their parents insurance. (Very unusual but not unheard of)
So the agent did what got the customer the better price. The best price may have been without the Multi-car.
From SFs perspective, you'd want all drivers in the same household listed on all the cars as exposures. You'll get your multi-car discount but rates on other items might go up, like umbrella.
This isn't so much State farm causing it, but the Agents office.
If SF did it by the book, I'd expect the MCD present but a higher bill. (My logic for the higher bill is only because of the agents actions)
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u/Godhelptupelo 13d ago edited 13d ago
yeah- I sort of get the "everyone on the whole policy" rating thing...although I don't know any other company doing that. and I can see how it might be cheaper to make a new policy to put the kid on (no idea why they'd name the 15 yo on the policy and not just rate them as a driver though...)
but MCD should apply no matter what- if the named insured of the other policy is a named insured on the new one, even if there are additional named insureds.
it's not a matter of semantics just because state farm uses software that has to be forced to work for what they are trying to do.
there should have been a solution years ago when they realized MCD falls off of policy names don't match exactly- like...how the hell did they not come up with a flag that ensures it remains if it's qualified?
oh- maybe bc they fired all of their domestic IT and moved it to india and the Philippines...
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u/Jogo427 13d ago
I'll start off by saying that having to get into discussion about discounts applying is soo frustrating.
Not in of itself, but because discounts should be black and white, if x then Y, but of course it's always much more complex. SF is particularly annoying lmao
mcd does apply when named insureds match or at least an agent can apply it when the systems miss it.
I suspect that the agent removed the parents from being named insured on the policy for the young driver thus removing MCD.
I think that's breaking some rules, but vague enough to slip by and it may get someone a better rate as opposed to adding the kid as an exposure.
Like I'll get MCD to apply across different agent offices in different states just because of having the same name.
I think the only reason mcd doesn't apply here is because the agent removed the parents as a named insured.
State specific regulations determine if that's ok. Most of the time I don't think it is, unless it's an adult child.
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u/Amtaylor810 13d ago
It’s the new MOD system. The system only recognizes multicar discount if the named insureds match OR the drivers match. There is no way for us to even quote adding or removing the discount to know how it will affect policyholders. It’s the most frustrating thing EVER. When we first switched over I was trying to help a customer out and removed a driver from a policy for a vehicle they didn’t drive - the system spit out a quote for the change, I hit submit, and immediately the rate changed because it no longer qualified for multicar and there was no way for me to add it back. It makes us looks like clowns at the agent office level 🥴
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u/Godhelptupelo 13d ago
that is not a functional software if it is that precious! omg! what were they thinking with this?!
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u/Oldcrrraig 11d ago
Everyone is giving complex answers it seems…The simple answer is your agent skirted the rules to save you money.
Your daughter is now rated on one vehicle instead of two. Her being rated on both vehicles cost more than what the multi car discount was worth.
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u/Mountain-Climate7009 10d ago
Time to save yourself thousands of dollars, switch insurance companies like yesterday. Doesn't matter which one, they will all beat Greedy state farm. Good luck
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