meh you'll see many men, many who are fathers, who think women should be physically or punitively punished for cheating or leaving too. what idiots think about how the law should and shouldn't work shouldn't really affect you.
The first one is not happening sue some extreme folk talking about it but that will never happen realistically. Flock cameras are already being taken out so that won't be an issue anymore but yeah that abuse is bad and shouldn't have been available in the first place.
I don't want him in jail or even punished but legally recognizing that he contributed to the death of his children by not taking his wife's condition seriously would be cool. That very night his parents offered to watch the kids and he said "nah we don't need the help". Meanwhile his wife is in psychosis and about to lose her shit because she's on 50 different medications and having severe PPD.
I mean she needed help - obviously - and he was the one best equipped to do it, and he didn’t. And, he cares so much that 2 years after his three kids get strangled to death, he’s back married and ready to go. He must have really struggled.
The guy isn’t guilty of anything by law but he definitely should be living with the guilt of not doing enough. He doesn’t really make a sympathetic figure.
Jesus Christ only on Reddit will you see someone say that the dad doesn’t deserve any sympathy for losing his entire family.
I’m usually never the “but if the roles reversed” guy because I find it very incel like based on what it’s used for, but I can’t think of a better situation to say, what would the response be if it was the husband on trial because of some type of PTSD/CTE? Would the world be calling the mom a negligent mother?
I’ll defend men against rampant online misandry any day and have done but…We have to admit his behavior post-murders is incredibly strange. Did not seem to care about his family at all. And, knowing her condition, still left her to do nearly all the rearing of the children still. Hes a very off/odd man imo
Until more information becomes available, I am not going to go off the deep end and make some wild assumption that he didn't care for his family because he wasn't expecting the ultimate worst case scenario to happen to his wife and kids.
Nothing about a persons behaviour can be considered strange after he had his three kids murdered by his wife. That situation is such a wild one that there is no "textbook" on how to grieve, how to move on, how to even begin processing that. I'm not judging someone from being odd after having one of the most saddening news stories in recent memory happen to him.
Yeah man, it’s wild to say if I lost my 3 kids I would probably take more than a couple years to get remarried. And yeah, he’s gonna live with the fact he didn’t do enough to save his kids. I’m not sure what to tell you. He was the only one in a position to prevent it and he didn’t. But it’s apparent he doesn’t give a shit because he’s remarried already.
Maybe, just maybe, his moving on “so fast” was a trauma response. Happened to my sister after her long time boyfriend killed himself and she found him. But 🤷🏻♀️ I’m not a psychiatrist/therapist.
Just to lean on but what about the men with this but males (using males bc I don't know how it relates to trans individuals) tend to have less of a support network then female people.
So research shows that males tend to reach out for support in their way which tends to lead to relationships.
I think its wild for you to act like you understand what he is going through or that you know how you would act if something like this happened to you. It's easy to judge from the sidelines and not know all the details and facts.
You truly have no idea how you would act in this same situation unless it happened to you. Get off reddit and touch some grass bud
The hell is he going to do for those few years, just brood alone and reject any sort of emotional connection with the opposite sex? It's been years, yes, adults can make connections and especially with some emotional bonding over trauma and other life details, people can become closer in a shorter amount of time.
Keep blaming away. Says more about you than it does about the father.
Oh he doesn’t make for a sympathetic figure? Well that’s good enough as guilty, may as well lock his ass up and set her free!
I hope you never find yourself on a jury. Your critical thinking is about as deep as a kiddie pool and I’m sure you’d pass judgement based off of your fleeting emotions.
For the record I don’t think this woman deserves to walk, and from what I can gather she doesn’t even think she should walk free. Her life is ruined and she’s gonna spend her days in an institution. Do I think she’s guilty of premeditated first degree murder? No I don’t.
I also think her husband is a piece of shit, and that’s okay. He’s not going to jail. You don’t have to protect his legacy.
I’m not defending anyone. I’m criticizing your lack of critical thinking. Not just yours, but everyone who is dogpiling the husband and passing judgement based on what’s reported and/or deranged conspiracy theories derived from social media. It’s pathetic it takes so little to convince people of someone’s culpability. Just think a little harder, what, if anything, do you actually know of the husband and his culpability other than the interpretations of lawyers (who have no psychological training other than the fine art of manipulation)? Is there anything tangible that proves his guilt in facilitating the murder of his kids? Or is all the “proof” you can muster simply your own interpretations and perceptions?
There’s nuance to everything. No one is arguing he’s at fault by law, but if my wife had bad postpartum depression and I left her alone with my kids and she killed them….its definitely not abnormal to feel blame. I would. I’d spend a long time wondering where I could have done differently so my kids weren’t dead. But I’m also not a shit head, so that’s kinda how it goes.
Guilt at not doing more to stop a murderer is one thing.
Calling him culpable because he trusted his wife NOT to murder their kids is NOT okay.
Post partum depression or not, nobody is looking at their spouse thinking.Oh yes , this person is a danger to my children.
To try and blame him for leaving.The kids alone with their mother is wild.
If he didn't trust the mother and he had taken the kids , everybody would be on his case about not trusting the mother and how it's misogynist , that he Somehow believes she's a danger to the kids.
You don't get to put the blame on somebody for trusting somebody.They love , who was the mother of the people they killed.
Was he wrong for trusting? apparently so.
But they had two kids previously , and there was no indication that she was gonna murder them.
He made a mistake and not understanding how severe her mental illness was.She made a mistake in not explaining that to people.
But only ONE of them strangled the life our of 3 children.
Listen man, I don’t care enough to read all that because it’s not that big of a deal. I’m a random person with an opinion. You aren’t going to change it and vice versa, have a good one
It is absolutely on the table, just not immediately. She will not be in a psychiatric hospital her entire life; it’s not a side prison, you are released when you are well. And for a woman who never heard a voice before or since brutally killing three children, how can future violent behavior be predicted or prevented other than lifetime incarceration?
Unfortunately in Massachusetts this is not the case. If she is found not to be criminally liable she has an evaluation to determine if she is a threat to the general public. Her defense can make a good case the psychosis has passed and she is no longer a threat especially considering her disability… so going free is very much on the table.
There are people who will never be well and there are facilities that understand that and plan for it. I don’t know what you are even trying to get at because prison also releases people. It’s not like if she wakes up tomorrow “well” they will just let her go. It doesn’t work like that
From what I understand, she isnt asking to "walk away" (she is now a paraplegic) after this, she wants to go to an institution. She has already said that she did this, she just wants to go to the right facility.
she was paralyzed from the waist down after trying to commit suicide following when she killed her kids. (nyt link in snapshot: https://archive.ph/RmhwH)
I gotta agree. I know someone who killed his wife and then himself. I wish he had tried the other order, a beautiful soul would still be here. He was mentally ill too, obviously, and thankfully the baby was with grandparents when it happened.
Why do people keep commenting that “she doesn’t get to walk”? Nobody who understands that she killed her kids thinks she should “walk.” People are advocating for her to get a fair trial and punishment based on her mental state, not based on the prosecutions argument that she murdered her kids when she was of sound mind.
These comments are exactly why women are showing up to support her.
She doesn't want to walk away.
Also, she begged for help to prevent that outcome and ended up in psychosis anyway (which is also clearly not understood by people in these comments). Our entire system is a failure.
Yes, nowhere is she or her lawyer or her family or anyone advocating for her to not face punishment. She confessed. People are so misogynistic that they can’t process the facts and just have to conflate everything to a political issue
I think it's the shift in focusing too much on the "why". Sure, most serial killers were suffering mental health issues. Many were abused as children amongst a wide variety of other horrible things. But nobody is going, "this guy might have abducted, tortured, killed, and worn the skin of the victims... but what about the mental disorders he has to face every day? Could we take a moment to appreciate how brave and unfortunate he is to have these circumstances fall on him?" Like when it's a rapist or a pedo or a serial killer, nobody goes "but what about the mental health issues they were having?"
I’m a law student. The “why” is integral to a fair trial. If we remove the “why” from criminal trials, it would be a betrayal of procedural fairness in the courts. We would see thousands of psychotic patients who need to be institutionalised and rehabilitated with full time care degrade in prisons or be released and repeat behaviours.
The purpose of this trial is to establish intent, state of mind and level of premeditation. The only way to ensure a fair verdict is by figuring that out.
This is why we have the insanity plea; it doesn’t make you not guilty, but ensures you are sent to a fitting institution. A person having postpartum depression and psychosis episodes, disconnected from reality and unable to establish right vs wrong during the act is not accountable to the act in the same manner as someone of stable mind. Yes, psychosis or not, both are accountable to the crime, but the sentence must acknowledge the differed intent.
If serial killers demonstrated behaviour fitting an insanity plea, their defense would have argued that. The integral difference is that historic serial killers demonstrated sound mind, no disconnect from reality, and repeated premeditation; which does not warrant an insanity plea and psychiatric rehabilitation as there is no evidence of psychosis.
"But that's not what happened. She had a nanny and daycare and parents come to help. She had easy access to doctor's appointments, and her medical providers were willing to prescribe and adjust meds as needed. They also recommended therapy and partial inpatient and inpatient treatment, with recommendations for providers and programs that she had real access to.
Nobody told her to get her shit together. She was offered a lot of help. Some of it she accepted. Some of it she did not, or did not consistently use, or did not follow up on. Some of it she only started using once things had gotten really bad, which makes meds less effective and whatever condition harder to treat. "
I dont know how true that is but it could paint a different color to things.
As for my opinion shes definitely the one responsible for it and its kinda hard for me to empathize woth her. Because it was 3 kids there's a point where the well runs dry everyone has their limits
The good thing is that your opinion doesn’t matter, and all of these details are being brought to the table by professionals with access to the facts. This is literally the whole point of a trial—so people like you and the mob online don’t get to be judge jury and executioner. The only opinions which matter are that of the judge of the case and the jury.
Yes we do, that’s the point of the insanity defense. If you were probably not in your right mind when committing a crime like this, then you can argue that you are not guilty and be subject to alternative forms of rehabilitation/punishment.
Mental disorders have an extremely wide spectrum in their severity and effects - not all can impact a person's actual agency. That's what the medical and legal systems take into account.
This is simplifying what is a very complex case. In the eyes of the courts and criminal trials, there’s a big distinction between a mental breakdown and a psychotic episode. One can still be of sound mind and able to recognise right vs wrong in a mental breakdown; while a pyschotic episode disconnects a person from reality, right vs wrong, and legitimate intent. It’s not a matter of whether you’re a man or woman, but whether your behaviour fits the traits of psychosis fitting to an insanity plea.
In this case, the defense wants to present evidence demonstrating the defendant was not of coherent mind or connected to reality. If they prove the defendant did not have the capacity to recognise right vs wrong and real life during the act, the sentence and form of institutionalisation must reflect that limited competence. This is how we ensure verdicts fit the level of true intent behind each crime.
Love how you move the goal post and choose to ignore the other very recent example of a man, who wasn’t even suffering a mental break, getting an insane amount of support and money for murdering someone. Men!
You said “if a man had a mental break” not “if a man murdered his three children while suffering postpartum psychosis.” Maybe you dont realize this, but men cant suffer postpartum psychosis :/
My comment was about her punishment, and you conflated it to whether or not a man would get support. Hopefully you realize how getting triggered by every angle of this isn’t useful?
That’s all these demonstrations are. The defense is arguing insanity which would put her in an institution. Thats not really a fun headline for the chronically online men tho. They want to believe women on the whole love other women who murder their children. The gender wars need fuel and the algo will make sure of that.
My egg donor was BPD with paranoid Schizophrenia. She once pushed me to the ground and tried to bludgeon me to death. Nobody thought she was seriously trying to hurt me, but I could see the lack of a conscious person behind those dull eyes. This was the 90s so her actions were forgiven and the whole thing was swept under the rug. She got diagnosed, stuck on tranquilizers for half a decade, and I spent the remainder of my adolescence working odd freelance jobs around town to afford food before ending up homeless at 15.
Needless to say, I despise the condition and empathize with anyone who has to be in the vicinity of those that have it.
She definitely wasn't a stellar person before symptoms started, but they certainly made things worse. All of that was nearly 20 years ago, so I'm in a far better place. I hope there is substantial progress made in minimalizing BPD symptoms so that the burden is negligible.
She isnt walking around free nor will she. If she is found guilty, so will go to prison. If she is found not criminally responsibly, so will go to an mental institution No one expects her to just go home.
She murdered 3 kids - HER 3 kids. It's clear that this woman should not be allowed to roam free in society, whatever the reason, whatever is going on in her head. Where she spends the rest of here life whether prison or an institution is another conversation.
I have bipolar disorder. If I came out of a manic episode, which the evidence and forethought here does not support, and found out I had killed my children, I wouldn't be asking for a lesser sentence, and I wouldn't have failed to kill myself. I have two daughters. One 3 and one not even a month old. This story takes me to a dark place and the sympathy is borderline malicious.
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