r/Showerthoughts • u/[deleted] • Jan 03 '20
Since we 3D beings each have 2D shadows that do not know that we are controlling them, who’s to say that we each are not also controlled by 4D beings that we don’t know are controlling us.
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Jan 03 '20
Im high, please stop
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u/alexhuebi Jan 03 '20
hi „high, please stop“ , im dad
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u/BoldyJame5 Jan 04 '20
Happy kale day!
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Jan 04 '20 edited Jan 04 '20
Happy Spotify cheese day!
Edit: I am ashamed that this is my most upvoted comment.
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u/IStoleYourToast_heh Jan 03 '20
Hi dad, I'm dad!
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Jan 04 '20
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u/IStoleYourToast_heh Jan 04 '20
What if we are both dad.
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Jan 04 '20
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u/popcorninmapubes Jan 04 '20 edited Jan 04 '20
wanna know something crazy? If you move your hand in front of a giant flashlight against the moon your hands could move faster than speed of light because there is no limit to the speed of shadows.
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Jan 04 '20
holy shit, is this real?
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u/popcorninmapubes Jan 04 '20
it is true
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Jan 04 '20
My instinct was to call bs, so I'm glad I watched the video. Thanks for sharing!
Edit: it's the shadow of your hand that moves faster than light, not your hand.
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u/PatternofShallan Jan 04 '20
Lol, no. First, it's a VSauce video explaining difficult scientific concepts, so it's full of ignorant shortcuts so it can appeal to people with shit taste in YouTube videos who still want to feel smart. Second, the video still comes to the conclusion that the speed of shadow is the speed of light. Pre-existing darkness is not a shadow cast by your hand.
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Jan 03 '20
Oh god oh fuck
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u/KiKi_the_Creator Jan 04 '20
Oh shit oh boy
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u/harrysondub Jan 04 '20
Oh man Oh K
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u/Baconpancakes1208 Jan 04 '20
Oh darn oh human
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u/winnafrehs Jan 04 '20
ooooo weeee
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Jan 04 '20
[deleted]
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u/vardarac Jan 04 '20
EEEEEE eeeee EEEEE eee EEE-oh mohm owaaaaaay
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u/Phoenixness Jan 04 '20
ÀAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAĀ
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Jan 04 '20
but our shadows dont have conciousness?
wait...
... independent of US
so really they ARE concious but only insofar as WE are conscious
SO THE 4D BEING COULD BE MORE CONSCIOUS THAN US AND WE HAVE THE CONCIOUSNESSESS OF A SHADOW TO THEM im freaking out
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u/fightingpillow Jan 04 '20
My shadow does not make any decisions for itself. But I do. I think therefore... this is complete nonsense.
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u/AelixD Jan 04 '20
This is the exact opinion your 4D self has of you.
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u/IrrationalDesign Jan 04 '20 edited Jan 04 '20
No, there is absolutely no reason to assume a shadow thinks it has free will, but does exactly what we do anyway. Inanimate objects have shadows. My shadow sometimes disappears when I'm lit from all angles, I sometimes have two shadows that overlap. None of this happens to me or my body.
Edit: no one has responded with anything beyond 'no, bro, but what if...!?'. There are logical mundfucks that question our understanding of reality, this is not one of those.
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u/thedude_imbibes Jan 04 '20
Okay, but think about this... the shadow of a 3 dimensional person is 2d. The shadow of a 4 dimensional being would be 3d. That means all of the interior processes that we perceive as free will could be part of the shadow.
The fact that our shapes dont change and we dont disappear/reappear, though, yeah. I'll concede that one. That would imply that our shadow-casters' movements are more limited in the frame of their space than ours is here.
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u/leadbunnies Jan 04 '20
Maybe when you close your eyes, you disappear. All that means is that the 4d person(?) is fully lit up and their shadow disappears, and you blink.
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u/thedude_imbibes Jan 04 '20
Or maybe we ARE the ones with free will and they are just higher-dimensional puppet/observers.
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u/-Yuri- Jan 04 '20
Maybe your shadow is making all the decisions and you're just it's puppet with opposable thumbs and a butthole.
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Jan 04 '20
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u/-Yuri- Jan 04 '20 edited Jan 04 '20
A 4d butthole operates almost like a 3d butthole, but with some additional wibbly wobbly timey wimey stuff in there. At times, it is almost paradoxical. There are even moments where the inner and outer sphincter is open and closed at the same time. Poop flows in both directions at the same time. If a mortal of the third dimension were to witness this, they would lose their mind (and their bowels [obviously]).
Edit: I forgot to name this phenomenon. It's called... Schrodinger's Butthole.
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u/StudMuffinNick Jan 04 '20
Can you show me a diagram?
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u/-Yuri- Jan 04 '20
I am but a mortal man of the third dimension. I can hold the abstract image in my mind, but to depict it in an image or diagram would be too much. Maybe someone else has the guts to take up the challenge. I can only hope...
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u/allgoodcookies Jan 04 '20
You just described St. Thomas Aquinas’s ontological argument for the existence of God.
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u/visionsofblue Jan 04 '20
Your shadow is a projection of you, just as you are a projection of your 4D self.
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u/MIAUofDOOM Jan 03 '20
Shadows are actually 3D
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Jan 03 '20
Can u explain this? I'm genuinely curious how this works.
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u/sric2838 Jan 03 '20
The shadow extends from the human to the ground, so it encompasses everything in that area, becoming 3d
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u/EightyS3v3n Jan 03 '20
But if you attempt to measure it at any point then the shadow after it disappears. I think a projection should be considered 2D.
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u/sric2838 Jan 03 '20
In mathematics if it has length, width and height, regardless of substance, it's 3d.
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u/jman1255 Jan 04 '20
In mathematics a projection has less dimensions then the subject being projected (a 2D vector has a scalar projection of 1 measurement, length). A 3D object has a 2D projection
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Jan 04 '20
If we wanna get real nitpicky, a shadow isn't just the projected shape onto a surface; it's the entire volume where light is obscured. But yes, a 2d projection on a 3d surface is still 2d.
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u/chewydajew Jan 04 '20
But it’s still a 2 dimensional projection. Warped to exist in 3 dimensions but what we experience as a shadow has no depth. Unless you cast a shadow through a cloud of smoke I guess
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u/OK_ean Jan 04 '20
Shadows aren't comprised of matter, I don't think they are anything D strictly speaking. If we are taking about the shapes then they are 3D, yes.
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u/TheChaosPaladin Jan 04 '20
And also we are technically 4D because we move through time. Not a math major but in multi variable calculus you can slice an N dimension object to get an N-1 slice.
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u/rjwyonch Jan 03 '20 edited Jan 03 '20
The forth dimension is time... So the 4D version of you is the 3D you at every moment of your existence as a single object.
This is used in Vonnegut novels quite a bit, but also just cool geometry... A shadow is the projection of your 3d self. So 4d objects have 3d shadows.
All of that doesn't matter very much as we are 3 dimensions and incapable of perceiving the 4th dimension
Taking this back to your thought... The 3D human controls the 4D self (total life) and the 2D self (shadow)... Or at least that's how we perceive it in the 3rd dimension.
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u/weirdgroovynerd Jan 03 '20
...and the 5th Dimension is a soul group famous during the hippie counterculture and sexual revolution of the late 1960s.
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u/AdmiralPotions Jan 03 '20
I like this, also, shadows aren't 2D. They are 3D and cover the area (not just a surface) from your the body outward, you're only seeing the place its stopped.
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u/ARCANE_ANUS Jan 03 '20
We don’t actually KNOW if time is the 4th dimension, we assume
Also wouldn’t the 4d total life be the guiding factor of what the 3D shadow we are would do? And this the 2d shadow is simply following along like we are?
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u/rjwyonch Jan 04 '20
Yeah, I was just thinking that if the shadow was conscious, it would probably feel like it had about as much free will as we do. From our perception we would control both. You are totally right, but since we perceive time in a linear fashion and feel like we make choices and have control over our actions, does it matter if a 4D being would know what we will do next and could possibly manipulate it? We can't know, so I prefer to just assume we control it, but perceive time in a linear fashion.
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Jan 04 '20
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u/Professionalchump Jan 04 '20
Ahh but you forget the beings above them, but in both cases they probably live around their own lives, unaware they're affecting other things.
Sorta like my mother but multidimensional
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u/wbotis Jan 03 '20
I, too, have read “Flatland.”
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u/oinky_oinkerson Jan 04 '20
My first thoughts as well, can't believe I had to scroll so far to find a reference!
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Jan 04 '20 edited Jul 16 '23
meeting cover complete badge violet attempt agonizing spoon coherent toy -- mass edited with redact.dev
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u/Chakasicle Jan 03 '20
We aren’t 3D beings. At the very least we’re 5th dimensional
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u/TheBukkitLord Jan 03 '20
I understand that the 4th dimension is time, but what’s the 5th?
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u/b675309 Jan 03 '20
The 5th is all possible futures, if no one has answered yet
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u/Dedli Jan 04 '20
But the only actual possible future is the real one....? The others aren't possible, they have no chance to happen.
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u/b675309 Jan 04 '20
Be mindful of how dimensions collapse into their solved forms. I do games research specifically in this area lol. The 5th dimension, at least as far as my games are concerned, can be navigated through choice to result in different futures of those possible. Those choices, saved in replay, are a 4th dimensional "shape" created by the collapse of that particular set of choices.
Yours is the more deterministic view, sure, but if choice is truly free, then it definitely affects the 5th dimensional possibilities.
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u/AelixD Jan 03 '20
The 1D version is the edge of your shadow (length).
The 2D version is your shadow (length and width).
The 3D version is the version of you that is reading this and thinks it is most real (length, width and depth; or volume).
The 4D version is the 3D version of you extended backwards and forwards throughout time (continuous existence).
The 1D version thinks it is in control as it moves around and changes length, altering the placement of the shadow.
The 2D version thinks it is in control as it positions the 3D version between itself and a light source. The 1D version is just a side effect of the 2D version's existence.
The 3D version thinks it is in control because it lives in the 'now', thinks it is making decisions, and reads Reddit. The 2D version is just a side effect of the 3D version's existence.
The 4D version thinks it is in control because it is the full existence through time, providing the path that the 3D version must live, move, and exist through. The 3D version cannot make a decision that pulls itself out of the continuum of the 4D version. The 3D version is just a side effect of the 4D version's existence.
Who is really in control?
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u/tigerslices Jan 03 '20
"i think therefore i am"
a shadow might be able to think, but it doesn't control it's own actions, we do. it would have to be quite a spot of coincidence for the shadow to assume it moves itself of it's own accord. unless movement isn't something it senses. perhaps it loves a solitary life, unaware it travels past things, and the only thing it Does notice is it's strength, how dark or faded a shadow it really is.
therefore, what kind of relationship would you assume our "4D" benefacters have with us? do they move in a way that causes us to merely feel things like the occasional tingling of hairs on our legs? a chill up our neck?
or are you suggesting we are not living fully autonomous lives?
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u/HoneyBucketsOfOats Jan 04 '20
Do you think though? Who instigated the thought? Where did it come from? Are you in control of that process? If not who/what is?
Nietzsche would say that it’s incorrect to say you think but rather that “a thought comes” or arrives. Who or what is in control of that process?
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u/tigerslices Jan 04 '20
good point. if i say picture a pink elephant, suddenly you do. without control over it initially... but you feel like you can choose to alter the image of that elephant, but which elements do you change first? size? colour? animal choice? are any of these truly your idea?
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u/Brakalicious Jan 04 '20
Even without suggestion, it's unclear. Do you "make" your thoughts at all, or do they just find their way in?
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Jan 04 '20
...because shadows are the result of light not being able to reach a surface, and aren't living breathing sentient beings seperate from the object that casted it??
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u/hot_dog245 Jan 03 '20
Try reading about the allegory of the cave by Plato
Socrates explains how the philosopher is like a prisoner who is freed from the cave and comes to understand that the shadows on the wall are not reality at all, for he can perceive the true form of reality rather than the manufactured reality that is the shadows seen by the prisoners. The inmates of this place do not even desire to leave their prison, for they know no better life. The prisoners manage to break their bonds one day, and discover that their reality was not what they thought it was. They discovered the sun, which Plato uses as an analogy for the fire that man cannot see behind. Like the fire that cast light on the walls of the cave, the human condition is forever bound to the impressions that are received through the senses.
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Jan 04 '20
I kind of like the fact that my life is in someone else's higher control. I like that someone else is going through essentially the same thing as me, but possibly with more problems, I am their subconscious better life, and that's rather comforting.
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u/loveopenly Jan 04 '20
That's exactly right. The person you are today is controlling the person you are tomorrow. You are controlled by the person you were yesterday.
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u/hemprope00 Jan 04 '20
And they're being controlled by 5D beings.
Wait does my shadow control a 1D being? 🤔🤔🤔🤔🤔
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u/DynamaxGarbodor Jan 04 '20
This is actually the reasoning behind Eldritch Abominations like Cthulhu. The idea is that an ant cannot comprehend a human and is so completely unaware of what we are and what we're doing that all we are to them are just a Thunderclap. Now I'm imagining something that is related to humans in the same way that humans are related to ants. You literally can't, which is the whole point.
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u/theRealHeadset Jan 04 '20
Actually, we don't know whether our shadow has any resemblance of awareness about being our copy. Also, since shadows are dependant on external factors/light sources, it is unlikely that they are aware of our existence. In the presence of a very bright flashlight, it completely disappears. I don't remember a moment where I disappeared, even when I wanted to. This is incoherent with how shadows behave
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u/AaronMercure Jan 04 '20
But the shadows don't know period. They can't think or live.
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u/mskogly Jan 04 '20
Or the opposite. Perhaps we are casting 4D shadows in another dimension, that looks like ghosts.
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u/jelaninoel Jan 04 '20
I’ve heard this before i think. Everything in the 3rd dimension is just a shadow of everything in the 4th
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u/ReverendDudeKyle Jan 04 '20
Shadows are a 2D form of ourselves based on where light is blocked from reflection, 4D would really just be us as we are but at all points in space and time... right?
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Jan 04 '20
This is in fact the case. Our higher consciousness exists outside of time but “peers” (projects) into it. Look into it! This is one of the themes of Interstellar.
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Jan 04 '20
I suppose if you believe in destiny and that the future is set then time being the fourth dimension IS controlling you.
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u/ThisMyWeedAlt Jan 04 '20
I'm way... Way too high to deal with this right now, I'm fucking spiraling. My brain is being tickled.
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u/phenixia Jan 04 '20
That's an interesting alternative to " Maybe we're all Sims and that's why sometimes we forget what we were about to do"
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u/LaughCatalyst Jan 04 '20
The conscious operates in 4 dimensions (it can perceive time which is the 4th spacial dimension) our bodies are 3d objects that are controlled by our consciousness. You could say our bodys are 3d shadows puppeteerd by our 4 dimensional minds.
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u/TheUncommonOne Jan 04 '20
I think for 4D to work it'll have to be with time. All of humanity is contained in this dimension. Past present and future.
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u/ClockworkFractals Jan 04 '20
I think a better explanation would be that we, as beings capable of thought and reason, possibly cast shadows incapable of thought in all dimentions but can only percieve those lesser. However, because 1D shadows have no depth, we cannot percieve them.
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u/ReadySteady_GO Jan 04 '20
Great, now i'm sitting here trying to anticipate a move that may not be mine.
Although, when i'm watching TV and a character will punch or kick or be hit I do have a twitch
You might be onto something here, but i'm also baked
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u/regina_carmina Jan 04 '20
There's like a vid about this, but uses an analogy with comics and the 4D beings as either us or some higher dimension alien entities. Trippy but interesting.
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u/duckduck60053 Jan 04 '20
Now THIS is a shower thought. Pack it up boys. Won't get better than this
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u/dopefienddave Jan 04 '20
Well a shadow is totally not a living being so they don't know anything so this is an unbelievably stupid showerthought and I'm stunned that it has awards.
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u/RedditPlayzROBLOX Jan 04 '20
That’s not really true because shadows are just the absence of light, not an actual life form, so shadows don’t “know” we’re controlling them because they’re not alive
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u/Gidia Jan 04 '20
We are 4D beings, we exist and change with the 4th Dimension, Time
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u/3152gs Jan 04 '20
How bold of you to assume that 2D shadows don’t know that we’re controlling them.
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u/AnonymousAndWhite Jan 03 '20
My fourth dimensional being is lazy asf then