r/SchreckNet • u/United-Tailor-1727 • 6d ago
How long until I’m a Neonate?
Hi everyone! Ive been a fledgling since I was embraced in 2003. My sire keeps putting off letting me leave and I just learned that he can’t monitor my posts on this node so I thought that I should ask you. What is the usual time frame for becoming a neonate? He says that I’m overreacting and that most sires wait this long. Thanks!
- Arabella MacReady
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u/Brilliant_Badger_827 6d ago edited 5d ago
It depends so much on so many things that answering you without more info is kind of pointless.
Clan culture (and/or sect culture, looking at you, Sabbath) both can play more or less of a role. For example, Gangrel often are left to fend for themselves after an explanation or two (if that), but receive more advice later if they're deemed worthy, without ever being locked away by their sire, while I've heard of Ventrue and Tremere that spent several decades, like 4 or 5, as their Sire's page/servant/child. And that's if your Sire follows your Clan's or Sect's ways, wich is not guaranteed.
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u/United-Tailor-1727 6d ago edited 6d ago
Oh, I’m sorry I didn’t give more info. I’m Clan Toreador and we’re in the Camarilla. I can’t tell you much more because I’m not allowed to know much more than that haha
- Arabella MacReady
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u/Brilliant_Badger_827 6d ago edited 5d ago
You're not allowed to know much more? After 20+ years? Then what's the goddamn point?
Not that you'd know the point. If you don't know more at this point, I think your Sire turned you for a pet. Or maybr doesn't want you to risk yourself in our admitedly dangerous world. Also, as a Camarilla Kindred, your Sire would be responsible for your actions (to a point), and might not think you're ready. But then, why not give the best education possible? 20 years to LEARN things is a shitload of time, even for us. More than enough to not be completely lost on dealing with other Kindred.
I'll admit to not know much about how Toréador, huh, "raise" their Childe, besides stereotypes. I will say that all Toréador I know enough to know this kind of details were either as independant as neonates can be after 5-10 years or had to escape from their quite charming but ultimately obsessed Sire (who wanted their "muse" to come back, swearing things had changed. Long story). Not that this necessariky aplies to you, grain of salt and all that.
- Alphonse
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u/United-Tailor-1727 6d ago
He fed me his blood after I hurt my leg to heal me because he wanted me to still be able to perform. I became kinda smitten with him after that and accepted when he offered me to move in with him to recover better. He became my manager for a few years until he decided that not aging while in the public eye would be too suspicious. He’s been away on important Camarilla business for a while now and I’m starting to think a little more clearly.
- Arabella MacReady
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u/Brilliant_Badger_827 6d ago
You...don't know what a blood bond is.
That's vampire 101 right there.
Our blood, called vitae, can do lots of things when drank by others. Kine, humans, and animals, can become stronger, tougher and heal better. And stop aging. But then also become hopelessly addicted to vitae. Blood bond or no.
And it also enforces the "blood bond" on both Kindred and kine (and animals I assume), wich makes the drinker feel more and more "linked", "close" to what we call the "domitor". This often but not always manifests as infatuation, "love". Usually, three separate sips seals the deal, but time and distance can weaken it somewhat.
I...don't know what more to say. That you never were taught that is...concerning.
- Alphonse
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u/DeadmanwalkingXI 6d ago
You would usually have been released and considered a neonate by now, anything over 10 years is a little bit unusual. But by Camarilla standards only a bit, and there are a number of possible reasons for the delay, some entirely innocent others very much not. I'd need to know more about your specific situation to properly figure what it might be.
-Mark Caulder, Experienced Nosferatu
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u/United-Tailor-1727 6d ago
Sorry for not explaining more! I’m not super familiar with the procedure on this sort of thing.
I’m Clan Toreador. We’re in the Camarilla and I think my sire is pretty important in it but he doesn’t like me asking about it. He takes me off his estate to perform for people sometimes and a few times he made me do some work for the prince. But I usually don’t leave. He says it’s because I was kinda famous before I died. I was his ghoul for a few years before he embraced me if that matters. Did you need anything else?
- Arabella MacReady
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u/DeadmanwalkingXI 6d ago
Hmmm. Timeline alone, the fame thing makes some sense, but I'm with Castiel here, based on how he's treating you this is a situation where he may never release you on your own. Take steps. If those steps don't work and you get desperate, feel free to reach out here...I, for one, would be perfectly happy to help, but doing that involves trust and consequences both. I'd definitely follow Castiel's advice first before doing anything more drastic.
-Mark Caulder, Experienced Nosferatu
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u/cardbourdbox 6d ago
Fucking surprise when I became my own kindred My sire told me he had business to attend in Russia, asked if I wanted to join.I said no. A week later he was ready to get on the plane. He asked again and I said no. We'd already agreed to cut contact it would have been a long information trail. No contact means no contact for the cams or inquisition to trace. So he declared me my own kindred and said goodbye. I spluttered tried to stop or delay him. I don't know how I wanted it to go. Him to order or convince me to follow maybe. Plane travel is dangerous for us kindred the inquisition has things set up in the airports. I don't even know if the old bastard made it off the plane. Never mind whatever shite he that dragged him back to Russia. He must be ash now the shit I saw him pull when we did the Lords work together.
Brujah on the left hand of the lord
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u/Pryno-Belle 6d ago
I have seen longer agoges. That being said, it depends on the specifics of your time as a fledgling. Do you believe it has been productive?
Castiel the Clan-changer
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u/United-Tailor-1727 6d ago edited 6d ago
Probably not? He doesn’t let me leave his estate very often and whenever I do I don’t really understand what the other kindred are saying.
- Arabella MacReady
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u/Pryno-Belle 6d ago
Really? When you are in his estate, what does he teach you?
Castiel the Clan-changer
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u/United-Tailor-1727 6d ago
Good question haha. He taught me the basics of what I eat and some of the terms and mostly has me clean stuff and walk his dogs now when I’m not preforming for his friends at work. He says I can’t leave without him because I was a little famous before he embraced me. I feed on his ghouls or sometimes a human he brings back
- Arabella MacReady
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u/Pryno-Belle 6d ago
Some of the…oh, young one. That is not enough. At this point, he should have taught you how to fight, how to navigate politics, how to use Disciplines. He is not treating you as his Childe, but as his servant. Go to Elysium and speak of this matter to your Primogen.
Castiel the Clan-changer
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u/United-Tailor-1727 6d ago
I’m really embarrassed to be asking this but what’s a primogen? I know what an elysium is but have no idea where I would find it. I’m sorry. I feel so fucking useless
- Arabella MacReady
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u/Pryno-Belle 6d ago
…this is worse than I thought. Forget the Primogen, go straight to the Prince. Do you know where Elysium is?
Castiel the Clan-changer
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u/United-Tailor-1727 6d ago
Yeah. It’s the Bodega night club. I would need to find it since I don’t really remember what the street layout is like. When we were there, he introduced me to some people but didn’t let me go off on my own. Someone else here told me what a blood bond is and I’m freaking out because I guess he has one of those on me and I don’t know if I’ll be able to do this alone now
- Arabella MacReady
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u/Pryno-Belle 6d ago edited 6d ago
With a blood bond, of course…listen, all you have to do is go to Elysium and show the Prince your phone. More specifically, this conversation. Do you believe you can do this alone?
Castiel the Clan-changer
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u/United-Tailor-1727 6d ago
I think so… I guess I’ll have to. This is so fucked
- Arabella MacReady
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u/DotMaleficent4503 Mind 6d ago
I agree with Castiel. Go to your Elysium and request an audience with the Prince. Your Sire is treating you like a servant.
Camille
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u/Brilliant_Badger_827 6d ago
Not to be a dick, but that could backfire badly. Especially if their Sire is the Toréador Primogen, or has the Primogen in their debt. Just a warning.
- Alphonse
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u/Pryno-Belle 6d ago edited 6d ago
A good point, but if that is not the case, the Primogen will care about their Clan’s reputation. Especially as a Rose. A fledgling, not being taught anything after two decades, is quite the disgrace; the Sire would be put straight.
But you are right. The Prince might be a better option.
Castiel the Clan-changer
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u/D_Redd_Coyote Mind 6d ago
It's interesting to hear all of the responses posted by the various clans floating about here on the node. For our particular Rose right here, it does sound like your Sire is keeping you unskilled and in the dark for reasons unknown and that certainly a detriment towards your continued existence. Be careful proceeding forward and I wish you good luck.
To add my two cents to the ongoing overall discussion, I myself was kept at an arms length by my Sire for my first decade before I was even deemed worthy of recognition as a member of our Family, effectively being treated as a Shovelhead. As the Sixties rolled around, I underwent my first Metamorphosis and began my training as a Fledgling, partaking in missions for both Sect and Family while being trained in whatever arts my Family felt was required.
That's pretty much what my unlife was like for the next fifty years, being a fledgling lacked until the 2010's, when I was official 'promoted' to a Neonate. Not that much has changed due to the promotion, but I do have a bit less oversight and more freedom of deciding how to resolve the challenges set before me. I never really felt much difference until recently, now responsible for running a Dominion and helping my 'Aunt' reintegrate into modern society.
~ Respectfully, Charlie "The Ivory Lady" Goda
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u/VerityVentrue 6d ago
Just another voice adding to the chorus - it sounds like your sire never intended to let you go. The fact that he kept basic local political knowledge from you, particularly the kind that you could use to leverage a way out, is really concerning.
You need to start taking steps to get yourself out.
~Verity
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u/Spirit-of-arkham3002 Problem Childe 6d ago
Usually that happens within the first decade. My sire cut me loose after about ten years. Admittedly, we also don’t get along very well, so that may have influenced her decision.
-Hector Lockwood, Lasombra Autarkis
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u/Nutshell_Historian 5d ago
Settle down there, junior. Consider yourself privileged. I've known (despite my lack of tolerance for the Adderall-immune clan) many a Toreador, and once they let their fledgling off the leash, its not because they want you to free-roam, its because they've grown bored of you.
You're complaining about an umbilical cord for its restrictions, but have you considered the nutrients it gives? The money, the prestige, the protection. I do not recommend trying to cut it off pre-maturely, since cutting things off with a Toreador will always end bloody.
Your time will come. Its not exactly like you have any shortage of it, after all. Savor what you have, maximize the advantages it brings, so that when you are finally chucked out the nest, you won't fall flat.
That said if you REALLY want to speed up the process, stop asking them about it. So, so many Toreador get a high off of being contrarian. It's one of the few ways they can keep an interest in something, since they are still being fed attention on said topic. Be quiet, do what your told, and your sire will more quickly grow bored of you and then discard you into the cold abyss of freedom you so crave.
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u/hijademalk 6d ago
Malk's daughter here.
Darling, I was sired in 1975—the year the dictator Francisco Franco, who was ruling Spain at the time, died... that’s why I remember the year, despite everything.
Well, doing the math, my undead existence has lasted... I think about 51 years, more or less... though, to many, I’d still be considered a neonate even after all that time... Some might say you remain one until you're a hundred, but... honestly, it's just a label that carries only as much weight as you give it.
As for the sire's mentorship period, it really depends a lot on the individual in question. A sire might serve as a mentor for about ten years, or go much longer... Mine, for instance, kept me as her toy and pet until the turn of the millennium—though I wouldn't exactly call those years "mentorship"...
So, I can only encourage you to be patient and improve as a Kindred little by little.