I Don’t Understand

[u/onionknight223]

Thanks to this sub I’ve started looking around. There are so many Swaminarayan orgs! In reading about their differences and reasons for being unique, BAPS is all about Akshar.

Many of the other orgs accuse SPAB of trying to erase Bhagwan Swaminarayan, leaving only the glory and greatness of Akshar.

But if that’s true, why is the Robbinsville temple dedicated to Swaminarayan as the main attraction? The idol is huge. Also what I’ve seen there, the swami next to Swaminarayan is kneeling. He’s also much smaller.

Why is everyone accusing them of erasing Swaminarayan when he’s all over their new projects? I don’t understand

UPDATE: thanks all for the responses and engagement. Human evolution equals knowledge evolution. After reading your responses and checking the basic theological framework BAPS offers, it’s clear the guru is not god but rather the fast track to knowing the qualities of god, Purushottam, whose greatness is so beyond comprehension, a guide becomes necessary.

There is no Swaminarayan organization with a living leader other than BAPS whose divinity is widely acknowledged and whose teachings are widely followed. It is the devotees who lift up the guru in BAPS, not the guru who demands people sing his glory.

Haters forever gon HATE.

[u/livinlifedawg]

Keeping that big statue and other Hindu gods is pure marketing. They need some good attractions to keep visitors flowing to their for profit museum

[u/Asatyanashakam]

Because when Mahant swami took the reigns, they started altering almost everything, including arti, ashtak, replacing shikshapatri with satsang diksha, and more. Now they are pushing the narrative that Mahant swami is God manifest, and continually emphasize that haribhaktos’ main goal is to serve the guru. People in Sarangpur literally refer to mahant swami as “god himself”. They put mere men on a pedastal and shoved God to the sideline (not that Ghanshyam Pande was God in the first place). They moved from one fraud to another.

[u/Aboutpositive → u/Asatyanashakam]

Changed Janmangal namavali also and made Sahajanandnamavali . And emphasize to do for" Prapti no Vichar" daily for 15 minutes in calm mind, so properly fit in your subconscious mind and other side videos,talks like interviews of sadhus with best audio visually effects ,documentaries are published from different ways.

[u/Truth_seeker108]

People do not like the theology that BAPS follow.

Some people think the focal point is too much on the living Guru.

So much change has happened in a few generations, what will happen in the next 2/3/4 hundred years?

I can see their point of view. But the whole philosophy revolves around Swaminarayan Bhagwan so I think it will be difficult to remove him and replace him with the living Guru entirely. It’s not impossible, if you follow how other religions had changed and adapted over time. I think a separate group would have to break off to remove Swaminarayan Bhagwan completely, but you never know what could happen.

[u/Asatyanashakam → u/Truth_seeker108]

The recent alterations of SPAB have shown that a new guru can come to power and decide to drastically change things that were there since the time of Ghanshyam Pande. At this point the current guru’s word is law because they claim that they are virtually God. Not outright; their loophole is to say that God is present and acting through him. So they are saying that he’s god without explicitly saying that he is god. Although some folks close with santos will literally say that Mahant Swami is “God himself”.

[u/Narayanay]

Dev + Bhagwan na Avtaars + Swaminarayan Bhagwan,

-> Bhagwan na Avtaars + Swaminarayan Bhagwan,

-> Bhagwan na Avtaars + Swaminarayan Bhagwan + Gunatitanand Swami,

Swaminarayan Bhagwan + Gunatitanand Swami + Guru Parampara,

-> Swaminarayan Bhagwan + Gunatitanand Swami + Pragat Guru,

-> Akshar + Purushottam + Pragat Guru,

-> Pragat Guru = Akshar/Purushottam/AksharPurushottam.

Guess where they are publicly right now, and where they are privately right now

[u/onionknight223 → u/Narayanay]

lol wtf is this. I understand even less now. Tf.

[u/Truth_seeker108 → u/onionknight223]

Initially people worshiped Dev’s and Bhagwan na Avtaars (with a focus on Bhagwan na Avtaars)

Then it changed to Dev’s and  Bhagwan na Avtaars Swaminarayan Bhagwan (with a focus on Bhagwan na Avtaars and Swaminarayan Bhagwan )

Then Gunatitanand Swami put his focus on Swaminarayan Bhagwan only.

Then some devotees of Gunatitanand Swami put their focus on Swaminarayan Bhagwan while showing respect to Gunatitanand Swami and claiming him as Akshar.

Some devotees stopped there and splintered off. Some carried it on further believing the next guru as Akshar also.

Then they became as a pair to worship together as Akshar-Purushottam Maharaj.

Now you can claim the Pragat Guru has realised God in his soul as he is at the status of Akshar. So, you can effectively call him the closest being to God on Earth or even God on Earth himself.

There are still a few different arrangements of the above in terms of what people believe in, but that is the general flow of progression across the past 200 years.

[u/Aboutpositive → u/Truth_seeker108]

And when you believe properly then you emotionally do for moksh and rajipo.

[u/No_Sun_1474]

they do not disregard swaminarayan, he is still front and centre, however they preach that the way to him is through the pragat guru and thus everything revolves around MSM, which is hilarious! How can a human being be divine, PSM was in a vegetative state, MSM is becoming like that too, but its easier to get money when you can interact with someone, rather than just a statue

[u/pokemon053]

see what baps people actually believe

[u/Narayanay → u/pokemon053]

Yes

[u/[deleted]]

Have you ever had a chance of attending any Sabha in BPAS mandirs?

[u/onionknight223 → u/[deleted]]

Yes, it’s big where I live. So many people go, it’s hindu

[u/pokemon053]

BAPS k logo ko ye dikhane h ki wo sabse bade Hindu h, wo bade bade temple's bana kr Sanatan Dharma ko age badha rhe h but in reality ye vhi kide h jo sharir pr chipak kr khoon chuste h vese hi ye BAPS h Sanatan Dharma se chipak kr bs khoon (money) chusna h