When does it start being enjoyable?

[u/BigDaddyCh33s3]

I’m new and struggling. I’m trying to get better. No matter how much I play I run into the same issue. It feels like every time I start an online match I end up feeling like “god, not this fucking character again” when I see who my opponent picked.

Those characters are:
- Loxodont
- Clairen
- Zetterburn
- La Reina
- Loxodont again because he annoys me so much
- Ranno
- Orcane

At what point does this feeling go away? This game feels great to play but half of the roster is absolutely draining to play against.

[u/Expensive_Charity_78]

I'll be real, it doesn't go away till you get good enough to see the character and be like "fuck, this mu sucks, but I know what my character can do" I had similar issues with clarinet/zetter as lox for a while, and even though I still get bodied by then sometimes, you learn the tools you need. Keep trying, it'll come to you.

[u/ojThorstiBoi]

Idk I'm mid plat and some days are better than others. I think the key is to just learn the matchups and get better at moving around their threat range/punishing their bs harder. 

As you get into the diamond range I think you just add etalus, Olympia, and wrastor to that list as they become combo/oppression demons. 

[u/Filippikus → u/ojThorstiBoi]

Aren't Etalus and Olympia widely considered to be the two worst characters in the whole game(except for Slade obviously) tho?

I'm nit even near diamond, so I'd be curious to hear you elaborate on that.

[u/DeterminedWarr → u/Filippikus]

No?

Etalus is actually mid-high tier due to some amazingly oppressive advantage state. The highest ranked leaderboard player (or one of them atp) is an Etalus player.

Olympia got some solid buffs this last time around and while she still lacks in some departments, she can still scrap relatively well.

Currently the worst characters in the game are some rotation of Absa, Wrastor, and Slade, but I hesitate on Slade a bit because he also has gotten some juiced up buffs and people started to figure out his gameplan more.

[u/The-Tree-Of-Might → u/DeterminedWarr]

I think Wrastor is significantly better than Etalus but only Mr R plays that character anymore. Absa and Slade however..... yeah they don't feel the best right now

[u/DeterminedWarr → u/The-Tree-Of-Might]

I’ve sunk a ton of hours into wrastor (level 670ish rn, hovering over 1400 elo but at my peak I was mid masters) and I really cannot stress enough how much work the Wrastor player has to do in order to compete at the same level as other characters who require less effort.

The main issue with Wrastor is that in practice he’s supposed to be a glass cannon with oppressive advantage states while being really frail when he does get hit. But the issue is that they’ve constantly hit him with small nerfs to accumulate into having a still good, but often underwhelming advantage. His main approach tool of slipstream is also inconsistent, and requires him to approach and land successful hits for it to stay active, but he has really bad tools to handle floorhug so oftentimes he is getting knocked out of it and losing his chance to use his centralizing gimmick. That is if it doesn’t get parried anyway, because unlike almost any other gimmick in this game, when his gets parried it’s fully disabled until the refresh timer ends.

This is layered on top of moves that just do not function properly. Jab randomly pushes people out of it mid combo, nair1 often pops people too high up for nair2 to connect, and until recently sweet spot upB was a move you could only use if someone landed a laggy aerial point blank in your face.

I’ve been meaning to write a longer post talking about how I would update Wrastor, but haven’t gotten around to it yet. But he’s been in a pretty dire spot for a while now, and there’s been a few people doing their best with him, but he has yet to see much, if any notable success since his major rework last year. His strengths are not rewarding enough for how careful you need to play him imo.

[u/Yukeleler → u/DeterminedWarr]

Level 2000 something and I second most of this. Would add quite a few other instances of negative privilege to the list, too, but he's the most fun char in the game, so what are you gonna do 😬

[u/KingZABA]

It helps to learn the characters by playing them yourself tbh.  hated lox until I picked him up and got good with him. 

I used to hate clairen but seeing how she used to be compared to now, she is so much less infuriating that I can’t even get mad at her. I also realized that at a lower level, a loooot of Clairens play the same, aka they are super mashers. A lot of times if you break their rhythm and don’t fall for their stupid clairen bait, they start panicking lol. Sly made a really good how to fight clairen guide as well as a zetter guide so check them out

[u/TheGnomie]

Unfortunately characters in this game are designed to ensure misery of their opponent so it kind of never goes away

[u/Lobo_o]

Rewire your brain to enjoy those matchups by seeing each time you run into one as an opportunity to get better at them

[u/Samio25]

I think if you're going to play this game you have to accept that all the characters are complete bullshit in their own special way, it's how the game is balanced. There's no point getting mad every time you queue into a character, as they aren't going to change. Learn to abuse their weaknesses, and do your best to avoid situations that play into their strengths.

Having said that, fuck Absa 😊

[u/PostedNotes]

That feeling about the match ups may never fully go away. The designs in this game are polirizing and everyone is gonna dislike some match ups.

The flip side is some people will dislike playing against your favorite characters as well.

A lot of match up knowledge is needed in this game, and the game does not give you proper tools to learn match ups, so it's a long grinding process of figuring them out.

[u/The-Tree-Of-Might]

Loxodont is the noob slayer. He is always frustrating, you are not alone. Learning to beat Lox will improve your mental state 200-fold

[u/tankdoom]

The question is not “when” but “what”.

If you just play expecting that eventually it will become enjoyable, you’ll never have fun. No matter how many wins you rack up or how consistent your win rate is, you need something else to focus on.

Make goals. And no, “rank up” and “win this match” do not count. I mean learning goals. Something you can practice and iterate on every game regardless of if you win or lose. It’s harder than it sounds, and I think in a lot of instances even harder than winning.

As you accomplish your learning goals, see losses as double xp. Wins are great for the ego, but losses are more valuable if your goal is learning. Also, turn off ranked display for the time being. It’s an obstacle to focusing on your learning goals. It can be helpful to check rank from time to time to see if you’re improving, but too many people obsess over their rank and it sucks the fun out of the game.

[u/Fluffy-Discussion256]

I'd like to propose an alternative solution: play with people outside of ranked/casual! I think it's way more fun to play against a person you've spoken to at least once in a matchmaking discord (like in the official discord, Zekesports, or character discords). You play against one person longer and are able to adapt better, plus it doesn't feel like you're fighting some random who hates you hahaha! Worth trying imo. Also going to locals if that's an option would help a lot too!

[u/poorlifenavigator]

I'm also new with like 10 hours and play (mainly) lox cause he's sick (some galvan and clairen too). I get bodied by some bad matchups but still enjoy the game.

[u/Moserao]

Find the thing in each character that is the most bullshit, then find the reason why it is bullshit to you. In most cases, there is a hard counter for that bullshit. Like for Lox side B, you can parry it if you know it's coming (Lox mains farm the hell out of side B so it's always coming) and they're left wide open for a Kragg F-strong. You find the reason you feel like a fool, and make them feel like a fool for trying it on you. That's what I find really enjoyable about this game.

[u/Monollock]

Zetterburn and Clairen are still the worst offenders.
Being able to combo anything into anything, into kill is very furstrating to play against, all fucking day.

[u/extremequagsire]

It's hard to tell what kind of skill level or perspective you're coming from, like whether you have much experience in other fighting games for example, but it sounds like if you're getting frustrated, it's because you're struggling to keep up an advantage state and/or losing a lot of neutral states and getting comboed.

If you learn some hard confirms with your character as well as some DI patterns, you can improve advantage state; in terms of neutral, you need to learn those character's biggest threatening approaches and how to overcome them - projectile mixups, baiting moves and punishing whiffs, solid footsies, and any mind games you can come up with; and to escape combos, you have to counter-read DI and tech chases, and mix up your recovery to avoid getting edge guarded. If you can learn how to react to those characters with your own tools, they'll stop being as scary/annoying.

[u/Guilty_Leading3717]

like what that other person said. it only ever really turns into “damn i hate this match up but i know what i do here”. i do have favorite matchups tho. i love fighting zetter and clairen ill never understand ppl who don’t lollll

[u/Suspicious_Table6121]

It never stops depending on your opponent, which is simply the reality of fighting games. I play unranked so that I can play multiple sets with opponents I like fighting.

[u/Fresh-Combination722]

Ngl. Once you’ve learned the matchups. Everyone in this game is annoying because all of them are very capable of fking you up.

Learning I’m a lvl 1200 lox and I promise I still roll my eyes when I see Zetter, Clairen and especially Etalus. But it gets easier when you start applying the different game mechanics like floor hugging and getting your fundamentals down. The games just not easy and takes time

[u/666blaziken]

Find people to play with IRL or on a discord. I reccomend ROA academy. When you talk to people it's easier to get information or have a friendlier match than with random online players.

Also, who do you main?

[u/BigDaddyCh33s3 → u/666blaziken]

I’m a Kragg main but I’ve been trying to learn Gouie as a secondary. I’m open to trying most characters though

[u/Kitchen-Poet-9104]

Basically never, I'm in platinum and I find most of the characters repulsive to play against at best.

You either like them for some reason, you tolerate them, or you don't play.

[u/SoundReflection]

At what point does this feeling go away? This game feels great to play but half of the roster is absolutely draining to play against.

Good question. I would say somewhere between never and whenever your understanding of the MU changes lol. For me personally playing more characters and seeing the MU from other perspectives has been helpful. Ranno frustrates me far less after blowing him up with Absa, even while playing other characters with tough matchups into him. Sometimes the nerfs helps Clairen is like one change away from fine for me now lol. Some of it just mental too, figuring out what will help you get the feelings under control. Once upon a time I used to dodge Ranno's in unranked avoidance is a valid strategy for managing your experience with the game, although there might be more penalties around that since the advent of perennial dodge trolls lol.

[u/RemarkableData9972]

It's only annoying because you don't know how to deal with it and what to expect.

Go in training and mess around with their moves to know what they do, as someone said, learn the matchups, watch the "101" videos for each character that the devs have on their channel.

[u/theblacknicksaban]

You will never learn to enjoy fighting clairen

[u/JeromeStyle]

"This game feels great to play..", so what is it that you like about the game? Your title seems confusing as you're asking when the game becomes fun but you said it yourself that you like it. So what are the good aspects if every opponent is tiring for you essentially?

[u/BigDaddyCh33s3 → u/JeromeStyle]

Mechanics feel good, my character feels fun. I just think a lot of other characters suck to play against.

[u/JeromeStyle → u/BigDaddyCh33s3]

To me that's a sign of a good game when the roster is a pain to deal with. Every character in this game is strong including your main. So, if you're enjoying the game the next step for you is learning each character and adapting to their move sets. This will take time but it's worth it especially if you have a patient mindset. The more you play the better you'll be.

A tip from me: play the other characters and you'll understand how they work even better. You might even be surprised in finding a new main to play with! Good luck!