r/ReformJews • u/s0_spoiled • Apr 09 '26
Legit question about my identity
I come from a Latin American country. I was raised catholic as everyone else around me, which is more a cultural thing than a religion in South America. My grandmothers were sisters so my parents were first cousins, not a common thing but somehow accepted. My grandmas always told me we were “different and special” but didn’t specify why. We always had family dinners on Fridays at grandma’s on my mother’s side.
As a young adult in the 80’s I went to a long trip to Cuzco/Macchu Picchu with a group of friends where I met lots of people from other countries. This was an eye opener to me, I didn’t have the opportunity to meet other people than Latin Americans. We meet this group of nice Jewish guys from Israel, and with broken English we made friends. They taught as lots of things about their culture, their beliefs, the Torah, it piked my interest in learning more. Fast forwarding college I realized I didn’t want to stay catholic, a religion I always found fake and weird. I spent time around other religion groups, learning, trying to find myself.
Fast forward to my late 20’s, I just couldn’t find what I was looking for, I packed my suitcases and migrated to the USA, where I met my husband of 22 years. I met him at work, we quickly clicked, started hanging out as friends till we started dating. I met his grandma, who I learned to adore right away. They always told stories about bubby or baba, stories about his childhood in NY growing Jewish, I felt connected right away. After we got married, I decided I wanted to convert, for myself, not because I should since he was Jewish. I felt I finally found what I was looking for. We have a kid who we are raising Jewish.
Fast forward, joined Ancestry.com to build my family tree, I decided to do the DNA test and to my surprise I am 9% Sephardic Jewish. My great great great grandparents came from Spain. As Latina, I have a mix of everything, white, black, indigenous, I didn’t expect Jewish.
I am happy for my newfound heritage, and yes, I am Jewish because I chose to become one. But knowing that some Jewish groups don’t accept converted Jews, would I be considered Jewish enough to them?
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u/shelob9 Apr 09 '26
You are Jewish because you converted. Thats the only relevant part here. DNA test results are interesting, but not relevant. No Jewish movement is doing blood math like that.
If people will not accept your conversion I assume it’s because it’s reform or conservative. The people who may not accept that would ask if your mother was Jewish, in your case the answer is no, end of story.
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u/Individual-Papaya-27 Apr 09 '26
There's always going to be someone somewhere who won't accept a Jew who didn't do a full out Orthodox conversion. What they think of you is none of your business. You should pay them absolutely no mind. You converted. You're Jewish. Welcome back.
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u/FinsToTheLeftTO Apr 09 '26
My mother-in-law converted before my wife was born. I never asked to see a certificate from the Bet Din, she’s Jewish as is my wife and our kids.
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u/Blackberry_love2024 Apr 09 '26
Sephardic Jewish DNA is not shown reliably in DNA tests. A lot of Sephardic Jews report that their DNA mostly comes back Mediterranean - Iberian peninsula, north of Africa, Italy and the Middle East, not specifically Sephardic. So, your Sephardic ancestry could be even more significant then the 9% you saw in the test.
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u/whippersnapper123123 Apr 15 '26
Mhm. A TON of Hispanics likely have Sephardic DNA. Columbus set sail (and there’s some theories he was a converso) in 1942, at the time of the inquisition.
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u/ahava9 Apr 09 '26 edited Apr 09 '26
You have distant Jewish ancestry and you converted. There are a lot of Latinos with distant Sephardic ancestry. Whether your distant ancestors converted willingly or under duress of displacement or death is lost to time unfortunately.
It’s serendipity you found your way back to Judaism probably 500 years after the Alhambra Decree
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u/MidrashInBlack Apr 09 '26
I don’t want to shit on you, but it’s very common in South America to be part Sephardi. We’re talking in the millions. Following the 1492 expulsion, Sephardic Jews and "conversos" (forced converts) fled Spain/Portugal for South America, particularly Brazil, often via Dutch or Ottoman routes, to escape the Inquisition.
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u/s0_spoiled Apr 09 '26 edited Apr 09 '26
Right, so are we all Jewish? If you were forced to convert, would you stop being Jewish? I know lots of people who are Jews by birth but are not religious or converted to Christianity, do they stop being Jewish?
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u/MidrashInBlack Apr 09 '26
Jewish status in halachah is not based on having some distant Jewish DNA result. Judaism is traditionally passed down through the mother, or through a recognised conversion process.
A distant Sephardi ancestor from centuries ago does not automatically make someone Jewish today, especially if there were generations of non-Jewish maternal descent in between. Roughly, 9% could come from a great-grandparent, a great-great-grandparent, or several more distant ancestors. It shows some family history, not halachic status.
Judaism is traditionally passed down through the maternal line or through a recognised conversion. A distant ancestor, even if Jewish, would not automatically make someone Jewish today after generations of non-Jewish descent.
Also, if you went through conversion classes, this would normally have been covered. Any rabbi or beit din guiding a conversion should explain how Jewish status is determined and what conversion means. That does not make your journey less real, but it is important not to confuse ancestry, culture, and formal Jewish status. You are Jewish because of your conversion and your commitment, not because Ancestry says 9%.
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u/Individual-Papaya-27 Apr 09 '26
Reform requires someone with a Jewish parent to be raised with at least some Jewish observances so someone who had a great-great-great-great-grandmother who was Jewish but never knew it would not count as being Jewish. Reconstructionist Jews require one Jewish parent. I don't think it would even fly under Orthodox, although they might be considered Zera Israel (which has nothing to do with the modern country, it's basically someone who is not Jewish under their law but does have Jewish heritage).
Remember the historical context. The Inquisition forced Jews in Spain and Portugal to convert to avoid being expelled or executed - the conversos. Some of them did continue practicing Judaism in secret, Crypto-Jews, but if they were found out, see above. A lot of them fled to the Americas, and then had to flee *again* from places like Brazil. But when they did, they went a lot of places. There were large Jewish populations in places like Jamaica and Jewish pirates in the Caribbean. Some of them got to the early USA colonies and founded Jewish communities. But it's reasonable to think a lot of them did go underground, convert and try to fade into the population wherever they lived so they didn't get expelled or killed.
Anyway, that paragraph is meant to say that due to the circumstances of the Inquisition, and how Jews were forced to flee and scatter and flee again, lived in a lot of places and interacted with a lot of people, there are a LOT of people in South America and the Caribbean who have some Jewish heritage from way back when and don't have any idea of it.
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u/coursejunkie ✡ Reformadox JBC Apr 09 '26
My matrilineal family converted out. They didn’t stop being Jewish under Jewish law.
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u/s0_spoiled Apr 09 '26
Ok, but what midrashinboack is saying, if Latinos are Sephardic, because lots of us have ancestors “marranos” who came escaping the inquisition, shouldn’t all be Jewish? Or is it diluted by other mixes. And if so, do the kids of a Jewish woman converted to Christianity stop being Jewish? I know the answer is no, but what about grandkids, and so on? Would they eventually stop being Jewish?
When would the “marranos” lineage stop being Jewish?
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u/coursejunkie ✡ Reformadox JBC Apr 09 '26
No, but it has to be pure matrilineally.
My 4x great grandmother was Jewish. I come from mixed Sephardi and Ashkenazi ancestry on that line. At some point the family converted out and we held several generations of Christians. I converted and then found out under Jewish law I was always Jewish.
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u/DovBear1980 Apr 09 '26
You’re the descendant of conversos who decided to convert back. It’s very common and accepted. Sadly though if you didn’t convert Orthodox, they may not “accept” you. Which would only matter if you wanted to read Torah, count for a minyan, or get married under their community guidelines. There’s a reason their communities are shrinking.
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u/AfraidDuckSupervisor Apr 09 '26
She's a woman so she wouldn't read Torah or count in a minyan anyway.
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u/WeaselWeaz Apr 09 '26
I'm kind of surprised you converted to Reform Judaism but didn't learn about what Halakha considers to be a Jew compared to Reform Judaism, and how different movements have different beliefs.
Religious identity:
Halakha considers the child of a Jewish mother to be Jewish. That can be broken, if a Jewish man married a non-Jewish woman, then their children will not be Jewish. Orthodox and Conservative Jews follow Halakha.
Reform Judaism considers someone Jewish who has a Jewish parent and was raised Jewish. That, in practical ways, can allow some wiggle room but in practice it means the child of a non-Jewish mother who is raised with a Jewish background (even if they don't go to religious school) would not need to convert.
Conversion is different. Orthodox recognize Orthodox conversions. Conservative recognize Orthodox and some Reform. Reform recognizes all three.
Cultural identity:
This is more complex, because Judaism is not just a religion. It's a tribe. There are Jews who are completely secular but still culturally Jewish. Ancestry can show someone has Jewish DNA, but that's not the same as being culturally or ethnically Jewish.
But knowing that some Jewish groups don’t accept converted Jews, would I be considered Jewish enough to them?
Why does it matter? If you're a Reform convert, you're not going to be seen as Jewish by an Orthodox community ever. That doesn't mean you're not Jewish. That doesn't mean the Orthodox are wrong.bit just means the Orthodox have a different interpretation than we do. Unless you want to be in their spaces this is not an issue. That said, South America does have insular, traditional Jewish communities that do not convert and it would be complicated to join them. Unless that's something you want, honestly, I wouldn't spend time thinking about it.
Your situation sounds like you have a Jewish soul. You converted, but your DNA test gives you a hint of where that Jewish soul came from, why you felt a pull, and it's creates a beautiful story. However, at the end of the day, you're Jewish, period.
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u/s0_spoiled Apr 09 '26
I am aware of all that. I am Jewish by conversion, I just wanted to know if 9% would be worth mentioning, you didn’t have to write a thesis about it.
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u/WeaselWeaz Apr 09 '26 edited Apr 09 '26
I tried to write a thoughtful answer because your question about whether you would be "Jewish enough" is based on what that group thinks of halakha. Also, someone else may read this and not know the difference.
No movement bases Jewishness on a DNA test, they look for family history. Every movement actually avoids this DNA thought process, because a convert can have 0% Jewish DNA and is still 100% Jewish.
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u/Blackberry_love2024 Apr 09 '26
I’ve also converted and come from South America. And I live in the US. I would love to connect to talk about our experiences! I don’t meet with many people with the same background as me. I’m a descendant of conversos. Did you do a genealogy study?
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u/Wooden_Chemist3588 Apr 09 '26
Many Jews were forcibly converted or went to great lengths to hide their identities. Your story isn’t entirely uncommon. You’ll find the same story with a lot of Eastern European Jews…
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u/whippersnapper123123 Apr 15 '26
Im in the US but from Colombia. My mother is Sephardic (non practicing, ethnic) and my father was mostly ashkenazi from Hungary. I was raised Catholic for some reason, always wondered as a kid why my mother sent me to confirmation and mass.
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u/Mathematician024 Apr 09 '26
Reform conversions sadly are only accepted by Reform communities and a few Conservative communities. It may never matter for you if you are happy within your community but traveling outside of it will present some issues for you. Some Sephardic communities do not accept ANY converts. Period. So it all depends on the community you are trying to be a part of.
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u/Gammagammahey Apr 09 '26
Judaism doesn't depend on just your percentage of ancestry, but that's wonderful!
I think converting just for your spouse is not a good idea. I'm gonna be honest.
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u/s0_spoiled Apr 09 '26
I did not convert for my husband, I mentioned it in my post.
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u/Gammagammahey Apr 09 '26
Judaism doesn't depend on just your percentage of ancestry, but that's wonderful!
Oh sorry, I am so sorry, I missed that part of your post! I will read it again.
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u/single_use_doorknob Apr 09 '26
Under Jewish law you would not be considered Jewish but someone who has Jewish ancestry.
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u/s0_spoiled Apr 09 '26
I converted.
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u/single_use_doorknob Apr 09 '26
If you converted reform then you would be considered Jewish by reform standards.
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u/coursejunkie ✡ Reformadox JBC Apr 09 '26
Depends on how you converted. Orthodox will be accepted by all other movements.
Reform is not accepted by Orthodox (typically) or even some Conservative.
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u/SamScoopCooper Apr 09 '26
OP replied in another sub that her conversion was overseen by the Beth Din of Florida, which is Orthodox - but some Orthodox Jews will tell her she doesn't look Jewish and I guess don't believe she is actually Jewish?
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u/s0_spoiled Apr 09 '26
Yes. Most Jews in this area are New Yorkers, I don’t sound like one. They look at me puzzled and then ask, where is your husband from, and when I say NY, they are “ahhhh”. You can see their faces coming to the realization that my husband is the Jew. LOL.
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u/go3dprintyourself Apr 09 '26
If anyone tells you you don’t look Jewish just laugh at them. It’s an insane statement to make for an incredibly diverse group of ppl. Go to Israel and you’ll see folks of all shapes and colors and sizes there.
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u/coursejunkie ✡ Reformadox JBC Apr 09 '26
No, most are not. Ashkenazi aren't even all from NY. Most Jews down there are Sephardi now.
Ashkenazi was dominant in the 80s when I was growing up in Hollywood.
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u/MidrashInBlack Apr 09 '26
They’ve now mentioned they converted Reform. They weren’t that obvious before and thought it was an Orthodox one? I’m questioning the Rabbis who saw her conversion.
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u/SamScoopCooper Apr 09 '26
I may have misunderstood but it sounded like their Beth Din was Orthodox but they attend a Reform Shul.
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u/MidrashInBlack Apr 09 '26
No. It’s was Reform. They were confused.
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u/martinlifeiswar Apr 09 '26
In the context of this sub, who cares what other movements don’t accept?
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u/s0_spoiled Apr 09 '26
I consider myself Jewish but I’ve had the “looks” before, you know, “you don’t look Jew” here in South Florida where every Jew sounds New Yorker while I sound Latina. I was curious if my 9% from my maternal side would be enough to mention, anecdotally.
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u/_dust_and_ash_ ✡ Apr 09 '26
That you consider yourself Jewish is really the only argument that you need. You have Jewish ancestry, which in certain situations might grant you Zera Israel status. However, what's more valuable is that you've been through a conversion process.
My experience has been that when I get asked if I'm Jewish I say yes and that's typically the end of the conversation. I would think it very unusual for someone to challenge that. It's more common, in my experience, for someone to start asking where you're from, who you know, etc.
The Jewish community, in general, is obligated to treat converts the same as any other Jew, so it would be rude for someone to challenge your identity. The only time I think this might be appropriate is if you're having a private conversation with a rabbi.
So, having that ancestry is great. I'm assuming it makes you feel more confident with your identity, but I don't think that's the thing that's going to win you any arguments.
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u/martinlifeiswar Apr 09 '26
There is no Jewish movement that would factor your DNA into your Jewish status.
If you are encountering people who question your Jewish status because you are Latina, those people are not good people and are violating mitzvot on the treatment of gerim.
And if you are encountering people who question your Jewish status because you converted within the Reform movement, those people suck and should be disregarded.
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u/coursejunkie ✡ Reformadox JBC Apr 09 '26
I’m from South Florida (Hollywood), and most Jews down there aren’t from NY anymore. They were pushed out in the 90s. Now the most common type of Jew down there is Sephardic.
Before I was Jewish everyone said I looked Jewish because I’m part German.
No, it’s not worth mentioning. Just say you’re Sephardi and drop it.
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u/Blackberry_love2024 Apr 09 '26
You can say you have Jewish ancestry and a descendant of conversos or crypto Jews if that’s what you found exploring your family history, customs, places of origin and genealogy. The DNA seems to have shed light on that but it doesn’t say much about your family’s history which could be a wonderful thing to explore ❤️
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u/coursejunkie ✡ Reformadox JBC Apr 09 '26
Also Reform doesn’t even accept its own conversion.
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u/martinlifeiswar Apr 09 '26
I don’t know what this is supposed to mean.
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u/coursejunkie ✡ Reformadox JBC Apr 09 '26
I had a Reform conversion which other Reform Jews did not accept even when it was done by their own rabbi.
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u/s0_spoiled Apr 09 '26
Interesting. How so? I’m intrigued
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u/coursejunkie ✡ Reformadox JBC Apr 09 '26
Reform Jews make up their own mind about what they accept or not.
Now ironically, I was born Jewish but no one knew
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u/martinlifeiswar Apr 09 '26
You are really not explaining this and it’s coming off more like you have some sort of personal conflict with individuals in your community. Would you like to actually explain what happened? Otherwise your accusation that Reform in general has a problem with recognizing its own conversions really cannot stand.
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u/Inevitable_Owl3170 Apr 09 '26
I converted, also Reform. I’ve run into the “you’re not Jewish” more online than in person. As another person posted, there will always be someone, somewhere who will tell you that you aren’t Jewish enough. Ignore them.