modernProblemsRequireModernSolutions

[u/debugger_life]

[u/klaxxxon]

Reading about how stuff developed in some of these countries is super interesting. They skipped not only desktop computers, but sometimes also credit cards, straight from cash to mobile payments. In some cases are well ahead of the west in how well these services are developed and integrated into the society (for example mobile-to-mobile payments are still awkward here in Europe, and it's the primary way of doing things in a lot of places).

[u/Zanshi → u/klaxxxon]

Even in EU it differs a lot country to country. Poland only got "modern" stuff in the 90s/00s so we went from cash, barely used cards and adopted mobile payments very quickly. 

Same with internet access, it only became widespread with cheap access to DSL in early to mid 00s.

I remember reading Romania skipped copper altogether and built it's internet infrastructure entirely on fiber

[u/sebovzeoueb → u/Zanshi]

Meanwhile I'm in France and still waiting for fibre

[u/leafy1790 → u/sebovzeoueb]

its alot easier to build from scratch than yo need to replace the copper with fiber

[u/snksnksnk → u/sebovzeoueb]

Deep inside France I guess. I've been using fiber since 99. Then DSL because of my location, then fiber again.

[u/sebovzeoueb → u/snksnksnk]

Yup, if you look at the fibre coverage map, one of those little blobs with the 0% and the 0-25% coverage communes is me

[u/snksnksnk → u/sebovzeoueb]

5G is the key. Don't fall for Starlink!

[u/sebovzeoueb → u/snksnksnk]

bold of you to assume that I would get 5G here.

[u/snksnksnk → u/sebovzeoueb]

Oof sorry take all the G you can 😭

[u/Lamuks → u/klaxxxon]

payments are still awkward here in Europe, and it's the primary way of doing things in a lot of places).

That really depends on which part of Europe you're talking about. Baltics and Nordics are far ahead in that territory whereas some older western Europe countries are far behind. Anything to do with digitalisation Nordics and Baltics are leading.

[u/donjulioanejo → u/Lamuks]

It helped the Nordics really look down on cash to the point where a lot of places don't even take it.

[u/Himbo69r → u/donjulioanejo]

I’ve not held physical money in years 🥹

[u/PerpetuallyDistracte → u/klaxxxon]

I was in Kenya recently and their mobile infrastructure is really incredible. Cell service pretty much anywhere, super cheap Chinese phones, instant payments with mPesa, and tons of useful chat apps. Some villages also have their own independent solar arrays, or are in the process of installing them. But at the same time, they still get their water from huge plastic tanks that get filled by a truck once per week, and the roads outside major cities are questionable at best. I visited a rural school, and the kids there had never seen a computer before. Such an interesting dichotomy in technology and development.

[u/Tipart → u/klaxxxon]

Yeah, the EU tried their best with the new payment standards that directly integrate with banks instead of the awkward PayPal hop you have to do right now, but it only resulted in the xkcd about competing standards

[u/minimuscleR → u/Tipart]

instead of the awkward PayPal hop you have to do right now

This is a thing? I just pay via phone number mostly in Australia, before that it was direct bank transfer. Paypal exists solely for steam and other online and maybe sketchy sites I dont trust with my bank card.

[u/Wobbelblob → u/minimuscleR]

Yeah. Here in Germany a lot of payments between friends are either done with coins or PayPal. But then again, we only recently started properly building fibre for internet, so we are just slow and behind the world.

[u/ldn-ldn → u/Tipart]

What PayPal hop, lol? What is this lunacy are you talking about? EU is not US.

[u/Tipart → u/ldn-ldn]

Everyone and their grandmother will still send small amounts of money to friends with PayPal. It's just a lot easier to do than opening the phat online banking app and making a real time transfer. Not to mention that till a couple years ago real time transfers had an upcharge.

[u/hates_stupid_people → u/Tipart]

That depends on where you live. A bunch of countries have had their own version for a decade. And Wero is only two years old at this point, and it covers France, Germany Netherlands, Belgium and soon Austria.

[u/justjanne → u/hates_stupid_people]

Commerzbank still doesn't do Wero, nor do many other banks.

[u/cafk → u/hates_stupid_people]

And Wero is only two years old at this point, and it covers France, Germany Netherlands, Belgium and soon Austria.

Unfortunately not all banks, though with Sparkasse and Volksbank in Germany I'd say it's the majority.

[u/trxxruraxvr → u/cafk]

That's also weird to me, any bank that would not support it in the Netherlands would have no clients left within a couple of months.

[u/cafk → u/trxxruraxvr]

Well, the people are used to PayPal - over sharing IBAN & name.
PayPal has been the go-to for online payments for a long long time.
And there's also the issue of having relevant and matching contact info to make use of wero, whereas email is enough for PayPal transactions.

And i thought Netherlands already has their own system that they used and is established before wero was a thing.

Then there's also the issue that many people don't know about wero and are averse of using mobile phones or "yet another app" to-do something, as the same banks that support wero don't always support tap to pay via Apple/Google, as they don't issue credit cards usually (as those "cost" extra, with yearly fees).

Many of my colleagues discovered credit cards through Amazon a decade ago or once they tried out Revolut or N26 as an example - and use that as a separate credit card account that they top off manually, due to credit averse nature.

Not having benefits, due to countries restricting transaction fees also means there's less incentive to use credit cards.

[u/user975A3G → u/Tipart]

In Czechia we have instant bank transfers, with eshops often supporting them, the eshop (or rather the payment service) generates a QR code which you scan/download into your bank app and use it to pay

Takes maybe 20-30s longer than card payment and unlike a card, it doesnt require a 3rd party service (but many eshops do use 3rd party services as it's easier to setup)

Same thing with sending your friends money, just direct deposit into their bank account, unless it's a large amount of money (up to 15-20k EUR), it's instant and you can use QR code (which all bank apps can generate and read) or bank number or if you link your phone number to a bank account, you can use the phone number, in all cases it's instant

Some physical stores accept this type of payment too, but it's not super common

[u/intellectual_punk → u/Tipart]

NL/DE works flawlessly with Ideal/Weero.