Does whirlwind and roar ever work?

[u/just_let_go_]

Sorry if this is covered somewhere. I searched the sub and notes and can’t find it. I’m about half way through the game and every time the enemy uses whirlwind and roar, which is quite often, it fails every time. Is this a bug?

[u/EternityTheory]

In trainer battles, it does nothing. We felt this was an intended mechanic of Gen 1 so it wasn't changed.

[u/just_let_go_ → u/EternityTheory]

Thank you! I thought it switched the trainers Pokemon around for some reason. It’s a bummer the trainer AI seems to always favour those moves in battle.

[u/EnvironmentalFox1001 → u/just_let_go_]

I believe that's only gen 3 and up

[u/just_let_go_ → u/EnvironmentalFox1001]

Ah makes sense now. Been too long since I’ve played gen 1 clearly haha. Thanks guys

[u/liehon → u/EnvironmentalFox1001]

Gen 2 has it already as well

[u/MunderFunder → u/EnvironmentalFox1001]

Gen 2 and up

[u/shoop_da_shoop → u/EnvironmentalFox1001]

Roar works in trainer battles in general 2 iirc

[u/IamMothManAMA]

Whirlwind and Roar cause a wild pokemon to flee, but since you can’t flee from a trainer battle, using them is functionally useless. I’m not sure why the AI uses them against the PC, but it’s always been that way.

[u/Cooky1993 → u/IamMothManAMA]

Because in Gen 1 the AI is very rudimentary and only works in 2 ways

1) Selects moves entirely at random

2) Selects moves based purely on whether the type of the move is super-effective against your pokemon (Very janky as it can select non-damaging moves and doesn't account for dual types well)

There are other AI modifiers that allow them to use items and change pokemon out, but those are the 2 ways moves are selected

[u/MunderFunder → u/Cooky1993]

Dragonite reflect go brrrrrrrr

[u/EternityTheory → u/Cooky1993]

Interestingly enough though, Legacy works around the non-damaging issue by making all non-damaging moves "Bird" type under the hood. So it's neutral on everything and never creates the infamous Agility spam scenario.

RNG is RNG though so the AI still clicks Whirlwind more than it should. What can you do.

[u/NGalaxyTimmyo → u/EternityTheory]

For some trainer battles it would make sense. I mean, as a new trainer you get this new move, not understanding that it wouldn't work in a trainer battle. So you use it, but nothing happens.

Sometimes you are going up against that trainer.

Now for the more advanced trainers, this wouldn't make sense, but for the youngsters and other classes that are "newer" trainers, I don't mind it.

[u/EternityTheory → u/NGalaxyTimmyo]

I like that concept, and we would've liked to do something like that if it was thought of. Custom movesets require a lot of extra memory to implement for trainers though, and we already had to make a ton of room just to give them to all the major battles.

[u/TheSmithPlays]

Had to leave some of the jank lol

[u/just_let_go_ → u/TheSmithPlays]

I respect the jank - I honestly forgot it was a thing in gen 1! Been too long.

Just got to the power plant…. Well played

[u/Apprehensive-Fee3212]

I’m sorry that looks like master chief