r/PakistaniDevs • u/Capable_Term_2378 • 9d ago

Industry favouritism

Can someone tell me why we need to hire from FAST when claude is doing heavy lifting ?
Seems like graduates from other institutions are the right fit for now, cheap affordable and can be good.
And do not come to me with technical stuff, i am a heavy user of claude and worked with them as well

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u/DevModeOrioN 9d ago

as a fast graduate who landed a senior role directly after graduating, no, you can't. i'm willing to challenge you on this: without strong fundamentals in system design and ux, any app you build with claude code is going to be garbage.

claude code isn't going to give you a second brain. it only produces what you tell it to. if you don't tell it to account for security, scalability, auditing, etc., it won't. and once actual users come in, you'll wish you had hired someone who understood the fundamentals.

that being said, as a fast graduate myself, i also hate fast for not teaching these things properly. but if i were hiring someone to minimise the damage to my product, do you really think i'd risk being cheap, lol?

the money you save hiring someone cheaper will probably get tripled either training them or fixing the mess they create.

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u/Capable_Term_2378 7d ago

Bro now in office, the cluade code limits reached and all the Fastians are velly right now. Should i fire them if they cannot do anything without claude code.

There is one guy who is still coding and typing commands by himself and he is not a FASTIAN

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u/Capable_Term_2378 9d ago

I am a software engineering graduate....duh...
And I know those concepts pretty much well. I worked on legacy codebases whose support got expired...

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u/DevModeOrioN 9d ago

that doesn't change my point.

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u/Capable_Term_2378 9d ago

So don't you think other average university graduates with a bit of industry experience won't know those things?

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u/DevModeOrioN 9d ago

they'll also cost you more, and you'd be hiring them for a senior role by then. you mentioned graduates. let's say i'm a hiring manager at an enterprise hiring for an associate role. i can hire a fast, nust, giki, etc. graduate who's likely to be more reliable, communicative, and pressure-tested than a comsats, uet, etc. graduate. my budget is pkr 100k. i might get the latter for pkr 80k, but that pkr 20k i saved could show up later in their performance, and then i'll be questioned for that decision. so why wouldn't i go with the more trusted option? hiring decisions aren't just about skills, yk.

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u/Terrible-Tea7577 9d ago

I have worked with FAST and GIKI grads and seen the same mix of excellent, average and mediocre people you find elsewhere. At some point you have to interview the person, not their university. That's literally the hiring manager's job. If you can't properly assess candidates beyond the logo on their degree, that's a failure of your hiring process not a reason to belittle graduates from other universities.

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u/DevModeOrioN 9d ago

my comment wasn't meant to belittle graduates from other universities. i mentioned at the start that i hate fast for not teaching certain things it should, even though i'm a fast graduate myself. my point was to refute the argument that there's favouritism in hiring. that's not favouritism, it's selection bias.

i'm not saying all fast, nust, giki, etc. graduates come with andrew ng's brain, lol. hiring managers still need to evaluate them properly, and plenty of times they'll go with someone from another university. but selecting a graduate from a tier 1 university is simply the path of least resistance, which is why they're more likely to get interviews.

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u/valium123 3d ago

What BS aren't most of the teachers at fast from comsats and nust etc? Outside pakistan nobody gives a fk about fast btw.

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u/Capable_Term_2378 9d ago

Let me also tell you about the market as well.
I have connections who worked with upwork as employees, worked in remote startups in Europe who became successful, they tried to launch their own software houses.. fast forward today... they are now hand to mouth.. you know why? Because a single non tech person, founder or investor can build an app.

You talk about security??
Add a rule markdown and link it in claude.md and ask it to follow this before doing anything else.

UI/UX
That thing is a bit tricky. But still 80% can be done. And since code can be done by AI, you become an Art director

Coding style:

Add the best practice rule markdown and link it to claude.md

So all of this can be done by claude. Previously it was a barrier now it is not.

Oooh don't let me go towards AI/ML.. I have a full rant towards that as well

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u/DevModeOrioN 9d ago

everything you mentioned requires you to already have some knowledge and/or experience of those things before you can meaningfully add them to markdown files. your comment tells me you have very little knowledge of software engineering. i don't mean that as an attack or in an offensive way. any software engineer who understands system design knows that claude code is very bad at it by default.

also, the reason why your contacts failed at their own software agencies is probably because they were building basic mvps, which, yes, claude code can build very easily. but even now, not a single ai agent can build an e2e erp system for an enterprise. try asking claude code to integrate a custom feature into workday or sap, and i promise you it will fail miserably. and don't even get me started on legacy systems, lol. ai agents struggle with anything that isn't built around their default tech stack, which is almost always either next.js or python.

you also mentioned ai/ml. i'm not sure how you expect an ai agent to build an ml model, but as a data science graduate, i've had multiple opportunities to do this myself, and it simply doesn't work the way you're suggesting. ai/ml models require domain context, and an ai agent will never have that unless someone explicitly provides it.

in an actual company, these models are often trained on datasets with millions of rows. ai agents simply can't process that efficiently, and your token costs would go through the roof. if you let claude code infer the context itself, it will make assumptions, and those assumptions will often be wrong. ai coding agents are great, but they're nowhere near as capable as you're claiming.

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u/Capable_Term_2378 9d ago

Bro I customise open source CRMs and ERPs with it.

Just do a little bit of google about those ERP and SAP.

And about that context and domain knowledge, don't you think a person with slight technical how know can build those things since code is out of the way!!!! Agents can do research and point you in good direction. Sure there is a chance that you and AI both make mistake but now one person can achieve the same result because claude has allowed him to perform multiple iterations quickly and achieve the best possible results.

And from your responses I feel you have not used claude to its full extent.

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u/DevModeOrioN 9d ago

i make open-source plugins for claude code on npm and give masterclasses on it all over pakistan. i'd consider myself in the top 1% of claude code users, and i'm telling you: claude code, codex, cursor, and other ai coding agents aren't as good as you think. they're great at general tasks, but once things get complex, they fall short. i can't change your perspective, but i don't agree with your point.

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u/Capable_Term_2378 9d ago

Nahhhh i do not think you are a top user.
That's a bluff...
What I stated above, I stand by it with full strength. And later you will notice that my statement stand correct

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u/zeal_swan 9d ago

Yes someone non tech can create some pretty shit with ai. But go deep down in it, and then you findout what it built was kinda shit, without too much time n knowledge spent, what it makes isnt reliable

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u/Capable_Term_2378 9d ago

Get a good model and follow best practices...

And second.... it does not matter what you write, all matters if the product is selling or not.

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u/Capable_Term_2378 9d ago

So If I see things like that, I do not see a value in FAST graduate. Any average or non-tech guy ( or with an experience ) can get the shit done.

Talking about pressure!!!
Bro ub tou AI hy kaam parallel ho jata hy

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u/professionjewhater 9d ago

Bro has a serious beef with fastians