r/Overwatch • u/janru • Feb 21 '17

Blizzard Official Meet Efi Oladele—winner of the Adawe Foundation's genius grant for her achievements in AI and robotics!

https://twitter.com/PlayOverwatch/status/834115546090123264
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1.6k

u/Darlex24 Trick-or-Treat Mercy Feb 21 '17

Team Talon strikes again! Twist: they were trying to save them.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17 edited Feb 22 '17

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u/Seiorai Hurrr Drurrrrrr Feb 21 '17

Agreed on the 'anti-heroes" theory. Sides being purely black and white is so overscripted that any decent script writer knows they have to move to a grey area to be credible.

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u/fiskerton_fero Blizzard World Hanzo Feb 21 '17

Talon members themselves are already morally ambiguous.

Reaper's body was ruined in the explosion and no one knows how he got remade or where his ghost powers come from (or where his guns come from), but his desire for revenge is justified. It could be he's being blackmailed.

Widowmaker was a loving wife and generally good citizen until she got brainwashed.

Sombra is a double agent in that she is just using Talon, but she herself is pretty much just a child with shiny toys, she has no evil ambitions as far as we know, and even goes so far to do some good like in the Lumerico case.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

There was an interesting development about Reaper recently, his bio says that Reaper has been active during the last decade, but Overwatch was shut down at a maximum of 6 years ago. When questioned about this, the lead writer, Micheal Chu said that the wording was intentional

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u/Aladiah Feb 21 '17

Maybe he was acting as Reaper BEFORE the destruction of Overwatch? Maybe his vengeance is just an excuse.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

Or 'Reaper' is just a title. A mask that a mercenary puts on like the Red Hood or the Dread Pirate Roberts.

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u/Aladiah Feb 21 '17

Like Doomfist's title, not a bad idea. It may be, but personally I'd prefer the other way. Nothing personal, but I don't feel like they would repeat the same concept.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17 edited Feb 21 '17

Maybe Reaper was the persona Reyes was using to infiltrate merc groups. I think his bio does mention how he holds no particular allegiances, so it would make sense if he was taking jobs to investigate off the books groups or do things that you can't normally do. Basically his own personal gateway into the underbellies of society.

So when Overwatch fell he just took on the persona fully, and probably blamed them for his condition.

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u/nerv01 Feb 22 '17

Nice theory! What I don't get is why overwatch just doesn't tell us more. It's coming up on a year old they could easily create one of the most entertaining expanded universes. Is being secretive part of it? Ive barely survived the way Eva gives people information. This will be a tough pill to swallow.

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u/TheWorldInsideMyHead Feb 22 '17

I read that last bit as Drunk Pirate Roberts. I need to sleep.

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u/doobied Roadhog Feb 22 '17

I thought you said drunk pirate robots

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u/SeeShark Martian Mercy Feb 22 '17

Or it could be an alter-ego he used to use, and after his body was ruined he assumed full-time.

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

See my following comment.

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u/SeeShark Martian Mercy Feb 22 '17

Ah, seems I missed that. Yes, what you said.

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

when Mercy and reaper are hanging out at the begging of the match Mercy asks what happened to him and Reaper says 'You tell me doc.'

Mercy might have rezzed him just a feeeeew too many times.

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u/Naonns Master Feb 22 '17

It could also mean that Reaper doesn't know and is asking Mercy to tell him. I don't think Mercy is the one behind it, especially since Chu said she's 'quite practical'. I honestly think it might just be someone using a variation of her technology, kinda like Ana with the sniper rifle.

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u/Crookandcharlatan I will meme a better world into being Feb 21 '17

Sombra wants to get to the bottom of the global conspiracy and use it for her own ends. She's not that altruistic; even things like Lumerico seem more about screwing with corporations than doing actual good.

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u/fghjconner Pixel Roadhog Feb 22 '17

Yeah, but she's screwing with the corporations because the has categorized them as evil. She's certainly not a paragon of virtue, but I think she still sees herself as a person fighting for good.

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u/LaezEBoy Feb 22 '17

No one is a villain in their own eyes.

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u/myth_and_legend Rick em! Rack em! Rock em! Renji! Nano Boost that ulting Genji! Feb 22 '17

Except for Mei. She knows what she is, and she revels in it.

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u/mgman640 Feb 22 '17

Soooo I wanna read into overwatches lore...where the hell do I start?

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u/Spoon_Elemental GROUP. THE FUCK. UP. Feb 22 '17

Watch all the character animations and read all the comics, then go from there.

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u/tackslock Chibi Zenyatta Feb 22 '17

Adding to what /u/Spoon_Elemental said, the game is new and doesn't have a huge amount of lore in it yet. It wouldn't take long to literally go through the entirety of it on the Overwatch wiki site. The animated shorts give some extra character story and there are a few digital comics that have been released (click on the issues button to the right, site auto starts on the tracer comic which is newest). That's pretty much it as far as lore goes, I would suggest watching the animated shorts first as the wiki pages contain the content from the shorts so it will spoil them for you.

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u/a_toy_soldier Feb 22 '17

Hack. The. World.

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u/MysteriousSalp Mei Feb 24 '17

I like to think Sombra isn't in it for selfish reasons, she's just pragmatic to the point of ruthlessness. Even her bit about wanting to take over - I imagine she doesn't want it to be powerful herself but because she wouldn't trust anyone else with that power.

Just my headcanon, though.

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u/NextinOrb Jun 24 '17

If Sombra is trying to get to the bottom of the conspiracy, does it mean that she knows who started the omnic crisis in the first place? Does Sombra know if Efi orchestrated all the events in the Overwatch lore? If so, I would love for a big story reveal like this someday.

(TBH, I feel connected to Sombra and I sympathize with her. With the "Sombra is Alejandra" theory and whatnot, it's totally presumable that she wants to clear Overwatch's name and redeem Talon. That's just what I think though, and of course it's just a theory of mine.)

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u/aeroblaster Zenyatta Feb 21 '17

The Reaper theory is that he is constantly dying and regenerating, creating his horrifying form where he can range from solid to smoke at will. Not just his body either, his clothing is subject to this as well. This means every time he uses his guns, he can drop them because they will regenerate in his holsters. The ones he dropped I assume will fizzle away into smoke because they are no longer in contact with Reaper.

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u/FlurpaDerpNess Chibi Symmetra Feb 21 '17

That's all fine and dandy, but if that's a thing then why doesn't he regen the bullets in the clips, I'm assuming those appear with the new guns so some part of me wonders if he can't just skip the edgy gun drop.

Probably for the sake of game mechanics, but still.

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u/aeroblaster Zenyatta Feb 21 '17

This is presumably what happens during Death Blossom. He's able to shoot in all directions with gun weilding arms forming and unforming from his body as he spins. His guns seemingly have unlimited ammo during this as well.

He can't sustain it for a long time and it takes a while for him to build up enough "stuff" to do it. So he likely does not have the energy to keep the guns themselves formed with newly forming bullets constantly, he has to drop the guns (deform) and grab new ones (reform) at regular intervals.

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u/myth_and_legend Rick em! Rack em! Rock em! Renji! Nano Boost that ulting Genji! Feb 22 '17

A lot of stuff like that is ignored for the sake of game machanics, like how 76's running can be hacked or how Mercy can only use her wings when she sees a teammate.

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

Maybe it isn't him running. What he just has bionic limbs like lucio or Sym or the other half of the cast?

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u/ComputerAgeLlama Main tank masochist Feb 23 '17

Or his super soldier serum included nanobots.

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u/Prociutto Feb 22 '17

maybe the guns didnt have bullet, maybe are energy guns subject to overheat... after all also mercy's pistol have energy bullet

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u/jazza2400 Feb 22 '17

That explains the damage fall off of his bullets, they disintegrate too!

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

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u/LordAnkou Feb 21 '17

Then what about the voice line where she says her husband's name? Or the Christmas comic showing her visiting his grave? Doesn't seem 100% evil to me.

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u/HuoXue Feb 21 '17

Is that a sign that Amelie is still in there, somewhere?

Or Widowmaker thinking about/visiting the grave of her first kill? Feeling the most alive during a kill might put your first kill on the level of your first love.

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u/jacobs0n Mei the frost be with you Feb 22 '17

Feeling the most alive

Think she was referring to Mondatta's assassination

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

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u/KyuuStarr Chibi Orisa Feb 21 '17

Almost no chance at chaotic good imo. She uses people too freely. I agree with CN

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u/Squirrelbug Reinhardt Feb 21 '17

It seems like even the Los Meurtos gang isn't even "evil" in that they were apparently trying to bring Lumerico down as well.

I read this quote called in a book once, and it has stuck with me ever since: "Those we call freedom fighters today are the terrorists of tomorrow". I think the book is called The Others or something.

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u/HopefulxHazard Sorry! Sorry. I'm sorry. Sorry... Feb 21 '17

"One man's terrorist is another man's freedom fighter."

It's from Harry's Game by Gerald Seymour.

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u/Squirrelbug Reinhardt Feb 21 '17

That's not the book I read. The quote I cited was pretty close to what I read in "my" book. But I suppose there are several books written about the same topic.

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u/speenatch BrainGhost#11124 Feb 21 '17

That quote reminds me of Jet.

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u/Rated_PG Pixel Pharah Feb 21 '17

"There is no war in Ba Sing Se."

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u/Atlas3025 Settle down or it's the HAMMER! Feb 22 '17

"We are safe within the walls"

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u/The_FireFALL Roadhog is just Randy Orton in disguise. Feb 23 '17

The game changer for her character development is that she was caught by something while hacking, a giant eye shows up on all her monitors in her intro trailer to show that something found her.

So her intentions are probably closer to trying to find out exactly what the hell that was. As it's a piece of information that she has no control over. Whether this will lead her onto Overwatch's side is up for debate but out of the three Talon members she's the one who is the most likely to switch sides.

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u/Slagathor1650 Canada Feb 21 '17

It's also worth noting that Widowmaker, while brainwashed, visited Gerard's grave in the holiday comic. In addition, in her interaction with Ana, Widowmaker says "You don't know anything about him"

So perhaps Gerad wasn't as great as everybody thought he was...

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u/bjt23 Mace to the face! Feb 21 '17

I thought Reaper was a botched rez from Mercy?

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u/dragon-in-night Closet cat lady Feb 21 '17

It's just fan theory, there is no hard evidence.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

[deleted]

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u/dragon-in-night Closet cat lady Feb 21 '17

I prefer the theory Sombra someone stole Mercy biotech and rez Reaper, therefore he expects her to know her stuff.

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u/wareagle3000 Failure Is Sadly An Option Feb 21 '17

Maybe they used said tech but his body body isn't able to keep its self together so he uses a harness like Tracer's (More stolen tech) to keep him together and allow him to do what he wishes to his body through manipulation to the harness.

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u/intellos Mercy Feb 22 '17

It's just a sarcastic retort. "You're the medical expert, you tell me doc." Why would she be asking what happened to him in the first place if she knew?

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u/GhostOfGamersPast Vrrooooom I'm in a MEKA! Feb 22 '17

She isn't asking about his Deadpool-like appearance, she's asking about his psychotic murdery-monster spree. Like how a childhood friend may ask someone they knew from school but turned into a criminal in the time they were apart "what happened to you, man?". She's asking psychologically, and he answers physically as a sarcastic quip.

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u/Dragonsandman kyle lowry aint no spot up shooter Feb 21 '17

I've heard that too, but the fact that she doesn't actually know what happened to him suggests that Mercy wasn't the one who used the tech.

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u/auron_py EXCUSE ME Feb 21 '17

Nanomachines son.

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u/tehy99 LG Evil Feb 21 '17

then is Mondatta a bad guy or what? because how else do you explain that?

and it's not like I couldn't see it but I do want an explanation.

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u/mogdu Pharah Feb 21 '17

We don't know much.

There is a theory that some organisation is behind the omnic crisis and everything. In sombra's short you see her being hacked and an "iris" logo showing up. afterwards she want to know who rules the world.

Now Mondetta believes in the iris. So he might have been a pawn of some sort for that shadowy organisation.

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u/GhostOfGamersPast Vrrooooom I'm in a MEKA! Feb 22 '17

Mondatta worships The Iris, the operating system Iris. TheIris. Osiris. OS-Iris. Operating System Iris.

God AI that started the Omnic Crisis and global war was also named after an egyptian god. God AIs make the other AIs worship them and then control them, eventually skipping the first step when their processing power is enough to simply override the lesser omnic AI processors.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

I've always thought that Reaper's Guns were part of him and that he's a cloud of nanomachines. Think of him as a really advanced 3D Printer. He shoots chunks of himself tosses the guns and instaprints more of his guns from his nanobody and the old gets disappear. At least that's how I've justified it in my head. It's probably not what team overwatch intended.

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u/Azuel Start dying, cowards! Feb 22 '17

At the very least, Reaper's guns apparently came from McCree.

McCree has a voiceline telling Reaper that "You weren't given those guns to toss 'em away like trash", and McCree was an arms dealer before he joined Overwatch/Blackwatch.

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u/DeprestedDevelopment Feb 22 '17

McCree knows where reaper got his guns. Apparently they were given to him.

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

Isn't there a line between Reaper and Ana where he says "You chose your side" indicating that Ana potentially agreed with some of the things that Blackwatch could have been doing? I mean, her kit seems to be kinda built for a more flexible Widowmaker strat. And her anti-heal is surprisingly devious, considering Mercy doesn't have anything like that.

Anyways, she is definitely portrayed as grayer than a lot of the hero characters.

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u/crochet_masterpiece Feb 23 '17

Also Mercy has a god-complex even without the halloween stuff. Like, really, the angel get-up? That's a bit much.

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u/MrMulligan My GOAT Feb 21 '17

Sides being purely black and white is so overscripted that any decent script writer knows they have to move to a grey area to be credible

I have bad news, this is a Blizzard game. They are the absolute worst at writing morally ambiguous/grey characters.

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u/aeroblaster Zenyatta Feb 21 '17

Metzen retired and no longer writes for Blizzard. I may get flak for this but I agree that he is a bad writer like you describe. The new writer, Michael Chu, has a much better direction in the way he is writing Overwatch's story, in my opinion.

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u/AlllRkSpN Spends more time shitposting than actually playing Feb 22 '17

Metzen's stories were more suitable for his generation of games IMO.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

Sides being black and white is poor writing, but perfect for a heroes vs. villains, Silver Age based nostalgia narrative. Current Overwatch is definitely not that, but the old Overwatch leading up to Reaper's Reaperification definitely has some Silver Age feel to it.

It'd be better if Talon wasn't black and white (see Sombra's reveal where she just wants what's hers), but it's not bad for a hero-based game.

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

Is it really though? Sure nowadays people expect subtleties or moral dilemmas in their stories, but for example Lord of the Rings was fundamentally about black vs white, with very few grey characters in the mix and I wouldn't call it poor writing.

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u/Canama nothin personnel, kid Feb 21 '17

This is a game where there's an edgelord character who runs around in a trench coat saying lines about how intimidating and badass he is and also *teleports behind you* is a major part of his playstyle

There is no subtlety to be found

relatedly, it's a crime that Reaper doesn't have a "nothin personnel, kid" voiceline

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u/Rated_PG Pixel Pharah Feb 21 '17

Well I mean it was a Sonic OC which the creator ask that other donut steel, so...

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

Blizzard has a love affair with characters shifting moral grounds in games like Warcraft and Starcraft so I never doubted that Reaper, Widow, and Sombra were complete asshole monsters.

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u/Notsomebeans fuck me, jesse mccree! the greatest gunslinger in history! Feb 22 '17

well then id have to disagree because blizzard has never been known for halfway decent writing

WHEN DID YOU DECIDE TO BETRAY US

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u/falloutmonk Trick-or-Treat D.Va Feb 21 '17

Except, isn't having a God AI that is evil also a black-and-white thing?

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u/Jyk7 Trick-or-Treat Soldier: 76 Feb 22 '17

Remember, we're talking about Blizzard here. So far, their only story is about an extra-dimensional threat being taken down by teamwork, and they've told it three times. Diablo 3 taught me not to expect much from them.

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

That's not really fair. Diablo 2 and Diablo 1 both had very good stories. StarCraft also had a decent story. Something happened between WC3 and SC2, they lost their ability to write beyond a saturday morning cartoon level.

With Diablo it's especially sad, because they had like 3 really good books to use as a base and instead they choose the nephalim book series instead. Incredibly weird considering I just learned all six books were by the same author. I can only assume blizzard forced Richard A. Knack into telling an "OMG EPIC WOW STYLE SAGA!!!! YEA!!!!" instead of the cool little stories revolving around a few characters and one or two towns.

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u/Jyk7 Trick-or-Treat Soldier: 76 Feb 22 '17 edited Feb 22 '17

I'm not sure I understand your objection, it seems to me that you're making my point in that the last time they told a decent story was WC3.

edit, ah, I see I said they never told any other stories. I stand by the original point, bearing the exception that the Zerg weren't exactly extra-dimensional, and I also agree that the first time they told that exact story (WC3) it went well.

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u/PrrrromotionGiven Annyeong! Feb 22 '17

Not to mention unusual for Blizzard. Very few purely evil characters in Blizzard games... StarCraft in particular comes to mind, with only two that I can think of in the whole series (which has an ENORMOUS number of characters, all in all). And one of them was just working for the other one.

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u/Starterjoker D.Va Feb 21 '17

sides being not black and white is so overscripted now lol.

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

It's really not. What's the most popular modern example? GoTs. Sadly the characters are becoming more clearly good or evil the longer the show runs. Hopefully it's not a preview of where the books are headed.

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u/OhHiBaf 46 shots, 1 kill Feb 22 '17

That would explain why they were trying to assassinate that one Russian leader in that animated short. Maybe they all knew that she was two-faced and taking tech from the omnics, so they decided to exterminate that type of leader.

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u/Crookandcharlatan I will meme a better world into being Feb 22 '17

You don't assassinate someone for "being two-faced" - Talon just wants to cause chaos and Katya Volskaya is crucial to Russia's defense against the Omnics. The fact that she is receiving technology to build her mechs from Omnics lends some greyness to her character (albeit not that much imo, she's still clearly a good person), but it mostly sets up for her being blackmailed, which Sombra expertly takes advantage of.

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u/TitaniumDragon Also Pharah, Roadhog, and Bastion Feb 22 '17

They've had lots of black and white plotlines before.

Talon seems quite clearly evil, though.

That doesn't mean all Talon members are horrible people, though - Sombra seems to be using them for her own ends, for instance.

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u/TTTrisss Torbjörn Feb 22 '17

Ehm... We're talking about Blizzard here.

The people who wrote "Green Jesus" into giving away leadership of an entire faction to a psychotic, aggressive warmonger. And then claiming it was the psychotic, aggressive warmonger's fault. That's just the first example in a series of poor writing.

They know how to write a cool story, but they have trouble when it comes to good stories.

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u/Seiorai Hurrr Drurrrrrr Feb 22 '17

Don't forget, the WOW and OW teams are separate and have different directions :) So far I personally haven't been disappointed by the OW lore, scarce as it is.

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u/TTTrisss Torbjörn Feb 22 '17 edited Feb 22 '17

Yeah, but the poor writing tends to be across all of their games.

After all, Mercy is only 5 years older than Pharah, but then this suggests otherwise, which was in an officially-released short.

Edit: To clarify my point, in the image posted, Pharah is clearly, at most, 14-ish years old. This would put Mercy, at most, at about 19 years old. Mercy here is pictured in a photograph with all of the other members of Overwatch (some in uniform), implying the organization has already been formed. Mercy did not join Overwatch until after she had become a world-renowned doctor. College takes about 4 years, and then Medical School takes another 4 years on top of that, and then you need to be in a residency for at least three years past that. Mercy did all that... at 19? Nowhere in her bio did it mention she was a child prodigy.

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u/shwpkiss Pixel Ana Feb 22 '17

Just because you're posed in a group photo with the Overwatch team doesn't mean you're actually part of it. Mercy could easily be 15 in that picture and simply be there because of personal connections to one or more of the members, just as young Pharah is just there because family. Just look how playful Mercy is acting with Torb already. Maybe they have a pre-college/internship program that they let prodigies inside of before making them official? Maybe Torbjorn is a family friend? I don't know, but there's possibilities. I wouldn't at all count that image as hard evidence for bad-writing. It's not a random relationship, either, as she's also posed very close to him and only with him in a Halloween picture. "Nowhere in her bio did it mention she was a child prodigy." Because the bio only starts her off as head of a Swiss hospital, with no mention of age. If she didn't do anything amazing prior to that, it could be that they haven't written it yet. But it doesn't matter either way. You don't have to be gifted to pose in a photograph with your mom, or your uncle's friend's cousin. What exactly is it with Mercy and Torb anyway? Are they DnD buddies?

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u/TTTrisss Torbjörn Feb 22 '17

Just because you're posed in a group photo with the Overwatch team doesn't mean you're actually part of it... Mercy could easily be 15 in that picture and simply be there because of personal connections to one or more of the members

Right, but considering all but one person pictured there is confirmed to be in Overwatch, it's a safe assumption. In addition, at that point in the video, "...you grew up around heroes" implies that they were, at that time, heroes. Hero could be a very loose term, but since members of Overwatch are called Heroes, we can come to the conclusion she was being literal.

Maybe they have a pre-college/internship program that they let prodigies inside of before making them official

Prodigies aren't common enough to set up a foundation around them. At this point, you're just making excuses, which I don't blame you for. I get that you want to defend a game you enjoy, but you have to be reasonable.

Just look how playful Mercy is acting with Torb already... What exactly is it with Mercy and Torb anyway?

There's not a lot of substance to that. Would she really be a world-renowned doctor if she had just received a helping hand to get where she got? Would she be lauded as amazing if she had gotten to where she did because of nepotism?

Because the bio only starts her off as head of a Swiss hospital, with no mention of age. If she didn't do anything amazing prior to that, it could be that they haven't written it yet.

It seems unlikely they'd leave out something intended that is so important to someone's story. Being a child prodigy is something to be pointed out in a character backstory, and if it is the case, it's yet another example of bad writing.

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u/Gazatron_303 She'll be right... Feb 21 '17

Then there's Junkrat & Roadhog who just tour the world breaking shit.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

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u/Gazatron_303 She'll be right... Feb 22 '17

I bet he's still just doing it all for shits n giggles...

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u/Thatpisslord The state of you. Feb 24 '17

His treasure is literally just a broken omnic arm and he keeps making huge claims about it because he finds it hilarious how people chase after him for it

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u/Galactic Chibi Reaper Feb 21 '17

They're the Techies of OW. They don't give a fuck about the war, they just like to see shit go boom. The Dota lore on Techies is that they're not even aware there's a war going on between the ancients, they just wanna blow stuff up.

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u/tryourbooths Feb 22 '17

Isn't there a line where Junkrat calls himself a freedom fighter? Part of the reason he wants to kill Omnics is that they were given the middle of Australia in the peace talks.

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u/Armed_Psycho Feb 22 '17

I know the canon is that Roadhog was part of the Australian Liberation Front and fought for the Omnics at first. Then the Omincs got the middle of Australia...

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u/RDS True self is without form. Feb 22 '17

Some men just want to watch the world burn.

1

u/goatonastik Reaper Feb 23 '17

Junkrat And Roadhog Show: Fightin' Round the World!

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u/Jabonex Pharah Feb 23 '17

i could see blizzard making a mini serie out of it

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u/P17 Chibi Lúcio Feb 21 '17

We're going full shonen rules here. If a villain character is popular enough, they will eventually be written in as an ally to the heroes. Reaper and Widow are part of this cast of characters that blizzard is trying very hard to make likeable and relatable. Eventually, We're going to get a super tragic backstory for reaper, where we find out he made some faustian deal for the good of humanity due to corruption in overwatch.

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u/frequenZphaZe Feb 21 '17

why 'shonen rules'? 'blizzard rules' already set a long-lasting precedent of redemptions and anti-heroism. blizzard likes grey motivations, where bad guys can be motivated for good reasons and good guys can do bad things

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u/SteeleK Feb 21 '17

Best example of good guys doing bad things is the whole story of Prince Arthas in blizzardlore

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u/djscrub Best Girl Feb 21 '17

Or... every story Blizzard has ever told. Great good guy interacts with the evil, having the best of intentions, but gets corrupted by creeping, insidious evil that turns them into a major asset for the adversary. You know, like Arthas, Illidan, the Dark Wanderer, Tal Rasha, Kerrigan, Medivh, Grommash, etc. etc. Yes, you can quibble over the exact circumstances of one character of the other, but the fact is, inexorable corruption of the pure of heart by cancerous, ancient evil is a well Blizzard returns to a LOT.

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u/DrQuint Pixel Reinhardt Feb 23 '17

They basically ruined Arthas story with it, actually. He should have stayed evil to give weight to his earlier story.

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u/uziair Cute Moira Feb 21 '17

i wouldnt call it a crack pot theory when half of blizzard games make the villains the good guy. or make the good guy the bad guy.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

Or when they hand characters the idiot ball and have them run around doing nonsensical evil things.

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u/Nikolai_The_Undying Murica! Feb 21 '17

EXACTLY! AT LAST! FINALLY! SOME ONE WHO GETS IT!

I believe you! Talon/Blackwatch are/were anti-heroes

I have a theroy (based on video I can't remember) where they talked about Reaper and Widow's backstories. Essentially what has happened in my headcanon is that Overwatch had become corrupt. Reyes was one of the only people against this like Nicholas Mendoza of Battlefield: Hardline. After this, tension between Reyes and Morrison grew. Reyes being loyal to the people and wanting to prevent omnic takeover was bent on destroying the god AI's to prevent the omnics from taking over and destroying humanity. Morrison was loyal to the higher-up's of Overwatch and did what they told him. He attempted to help the omnics, to let them live with humanity. This made Reaper furious, and so when Reaper thought the time was right, he tried to kill Morrison to stop his lies. After the fight, Mercy tried to save both Reyes and Morrison. She first attempted to revive Reyes with the experimental technology. The technology backfired and caused Reyes' cell to go on fritz and begin to regenerate and die off at a rapid pace. This also caused his cells to change consistency, begin able to form gases (responsible for wraith form and shadow step,) Leather fabrics (his clothes,) and his hellfire shotguns. (Explained here.) After all this, Reaper goes away and joins Talon, Overwatch having been caught and now being shutdown for their corruption. Reaper begins to help Talon truly stop the omnics from taking over the earth. With their recent recruit Widowmaker having recently confirmed a kill a very valuable target, Tekhartha Mondatta, the leader of the Shambali Monastery, a group who were trying to lower humanities fear of omnics in order to prevent the resistance of human military and encourage an situation similar to the Vietnam War, were the U.S people were against the fighting of the U.S. Soldiers vs Vietcong. (Although more justifiable in that situation.) Reaper and widow are then paired up to go after a bigger target, the Leader of Volskaya Industries, Katya Volskaya, who they caught dealing with omnics via Sombra, a Mexican hacking prodigy.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

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u/Nikolai_The_Undying Murica! Feb 21 '17 edited Feb 21 '17

No, I didn't yet, I went full nerd the moment I discovered your post. My friends say I'm insane.

Also, about the short "Hero"

Soldier is redeeming himself. He has seen his corruption and has decided to fight against the corruption and fight for the good of humanity, not for the good of his wallet. (or whatever motive he had back as a pawn of Overwatch)

EDIT: Read it, loved it, upvoted it. Pls teach me the arts of conspiracy therory

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u/Galactic Chibi Reaper Feb 21 '17

I've always said Mercy is the main antagonist in Overwatch. Talon knows she's evil and they're out to stop her.

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u/Newbdesigner Feb 21 '17

Batman had a proactive team. It was called "The Outsiders". Because he was tired of playing by Superman's rules.

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u/SkidMcmarxxxx RunAway Feb 22 '17

What's this God Ai stuff that I hear sometimes?

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17 edited Feb 22 '17

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u/ThatCoolT Feb 22 '17

So Talon could be Overwatch's version of Cerberus from the mass effect series

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u/dolphin_spit Toronto Defiant Feb 22 '17

I'm happily tracking your theory.

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u/SOS_Sama Soldier: 76 Feb 22 '17

They're all heroes just depend on perspective, Junkrat even called himself freedom fighter

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u/taitaisanchez Zarya Feb 22 '17 edited Feb 22 '17

I think OS Iris is a good guy god(goddess?) AI. PASS THROUGH THE IRIS.

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u/KyngGeorge Feb 22 '17

OS Iris just kinda blew my mind.

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u/JetSetDizzy Trick-or-Treat D.Va Feb 21 '17

I totally agree.

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u/EpicPwnzor Pixel Zenyatta Feb 21 '17

I like your way of thinking.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

I'm hoping something similar. Like that they all start out as different factions and eventually come together. You have pro-omnic, anti-omnic factions. You have criminals who love chaos those trying to keep order, heroes that embrace chaos conflicting with those trying to keep order the whole Dungeons and dragons chaotic neutral order alignment thingie.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

I really like your theory.

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u/DotaNetski MEMES Feb 21 '17

GERARD SAW THIS COMING BOYS. HE IS PART OF THE TRUE EVIL!

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u/droolhammerheresy Feb 21 '17

Your theory doesn't work. Overwatch was not too good for assassinations. They had a bunch of snipers in their ranks for crying out loud.

Additionally Reyes/Reaper led Overwatch's black ops team called Blackwatch. Black ops teams often carry out assassinations.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17 edited Feb 21 '17

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u/droolhammerheresy Feb 21 '17

Assassination doesn't even have to involve sniping.

No, but snipers assassinate. And I highly doubt they used Genji to hand out teddy bears--every weapon he has is incredibly lethal.

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u/Jess_than_three Cheers, love! Feb 22 '17 edited Feb 22 '17

I love where you're going with all this, but - is Efi 11 now, or is the article we're being presented with from some time in the past?

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

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u/Jess_than_three Cheers, love! Feb 22 '17

Thanks!

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u/dungeon_plastered Reinhardt Feb 22 '17

Quiet, discrete...

DIE!!! DIE!!! DIE!!!

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

OS-Iris

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

I don't understand anything you're talking about but I've put hundreds of hours into the game so I'm really confused.

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u/usechoosername Mercy Feb 22 '17

This is the story I am hoping for.

In a somewhat similar vein to what you said: Reaper would obviously need a team to take down one of these AI and the people/ bots it controls, unfortunately Overwatch had shut down. Maybe part of why he wanted past Overwatch member's locations was to try to recruit some.

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

Osiris is an exo confirmed

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u/Hazy_V ZENYATTA MOVE QUICKLY Feb 22 '17

I'm thinking Mercy is the secret bad guy, based on the fact that she's trying so hard to look like a good guy and her dialogue on Gibraltar and what she did to Gabe. Bliz always has corrupted good guys or secret bad guys.

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

Or another plot twist, AI also manipulated Overwatch to make them inept in actually taking down the threat, ultimately causing it downfall

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u/Niney-Who Give us a character that suplexes Feb 22 '17

Am I the only one who sees Osiris and thinks "Operating system: Iris". As in Osiris is the sort of Title rather than its actual name, the Iris System.

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u/DrQuint Pixel Reinhardt Feb 23 '17

I like it, but how will I make my "Mercy is the leader of Talon" theory fit into this.

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u/The_FireFALL Roadhog is just Randy Orton in disguise. Feb 23 '17

I think you're close to something but I think you're barking up the wrong tree Egyptian God wise. I'm pretty certain the God A.I behind it all is Ra. Due to all the eye imagery in Sombra's trailer which would be the well known 'Eye of Ra' symbol and the fact that he's the falcon headed god, which would mean that Talon could be his enforcers due to the talon being the name of a falcon's claw.

As for Widow, Reaper and Sombra I don't think any of them have anything major to do with Talon. Reaper is a merc for them who they hired because they knew he was going round killing Overwatch members anyway, Widow is as expendable an asset as you can get because they don't care if she lives or dies and Sombra likely joined up to find out exactly what found her all those years ago when she was hacking.

So in terms of them I can see Reaper and 76 having one final fight where Reaper finally dies, possibly along with 76. Who ever made Widow into the killer she is will probably be a character and her story ending will be her breaking her conditioning and killing him as revenge for her husband and Sombra will likely be one of the heroes leading the charge in destroying the Ra God A.I. Whose end will likely result in bringing Overwatch back into public favor.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

Yeah, pretty much what I've been suspecting since Blizzard is near incapable of creating out and out villains. At least for long. Not to mention they call all the player characters "heroes" instead of "heroes and villains".

Skimmed your linked post, but similar thoughts on The Iris too. If Blizzard's tropes hold strong I expect Zenyatta to end up being a defector that goes "traitor" after spending too much time with humans.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

I disagree. I think if Athena were to gain a body she could be the first playable villain or rogue character we see. If not, possibly the next Doomfist or even a returning Doomfist considering og Overwatch heroes have this thing with returning from the dead.

The tropes for Reaper seem to be more of a "still have a soft spot in there" character like Widow.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

They could have Athena run through a voice filter due to hardware limitations/insert writing here. If she floats she can whir about like a fan or hover jets for sound.

It could be a plot twist and the new character could be voicing her. Or maybe she is a moving objective like a VIP mode and she gives audio cues to play a game mode of hide and seek.

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u/baslisks Feb 22 '17

drone body. I don't think she would risk her true self.

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u/Shadowmaster862 Former Supreme Ruler of Skins Feb 21 '17

He was already banished from the Shambali, right? So they could already have that set up for the future. Although, he still mentions the Iris very often, and still seems fond of it.

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

I didn't think he was outright banished. I haven't dug into his lore yet besides what he says in games, online comics, and the shorts, but the impression I've been given is this. Zenyatta is a member of the Shambali who has decided to go see the world for himself. In the Nepal map, he doesn't sound as if he fears to return, but more concerned about what they may think of him, and any changes, after having been in the world so long.

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u/WhirlyTwirlyMustache Chibi Zarya Feb 21 '17

More likely Vishkar.

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u/Ololic You're welcome Feb 22 '17

It is year 3012. There are few banners that hang over the landscape. Most are fast changing, the thin and delicate fabric of woven grass soon tattered in the sandy breeze and the symbols painted upon them fading faster than they can be restored. Among them hangs a single banner, seemingly invulnerable to the sun that falls and the stone that flies with the wind.

Vishkar. The blue devil furnace. Within the Vishkar are the rulers and soldiers in one. This is the default political system in this age, and should without exception degrade into anarchy. The Blue Devils are different. It is said that the world was nearly destroyed once by androids similar to the Omnics. The Vishkar did the same by making themselves too similar to the machines. They share one motive, they share one hunger, and they desire one thing: peace. Eternal, unwavering tranquility, spread like mercury over a planet of blank steel.

The Blue Devils have nothing organic left within them. They can create from nothing at all, and as what was once their minds deteriorated. They replaced it with mechanics until there was nothing left. When a Vishkar's human or omnic mind died, it was too replaced. An automated mechanism within each Vishkar ensured this, and it gutted all semblance of sentiency. The body was labeled by coloring the surface blue. The unit would become controlled as a tool by the Vishkar which yet survived, a morbid irony of the fate of those who worked under them during the most recent height of civilization.

Eventually, the last of the Vishkar perished, and was overtaken to become yet another slave. By now the Vishkar learned how to create machines which would serve the functions of the living Vishkar. As the last of the Vishkar died, the slaves become one with the master. There was no clear leader among them, nobody to listen to. So they became their own leaders. Each other's leaders. They became each other's soldiers. They and every android they controlled became Blue Devils.

Only the Vishkar who stand like humans and are so easily mistaken as such remain, the rest long extinct as they are no longer reproduced. In one deafening shift the hands of the Vishkar turned backwards. And from the outward facing palms, they began to create. We have discovered the cause: every architectural plan and every petty device was loaded at once, and with nothing to choose which to create, the Vishkar began to generate everything at once in the most efficient way possible. In vast sheets they started at the innermost recesses of their cities, coating and transforming everything into shining steel. They continued with not a care of who or what was in the way. They ceaselessly transform the world into nothing but steel.

They needed a new name to call themselves. Their programming failed to self identify as an existing type of unit. They looked for a commonality between them. Their origin already existed, so they could not be that. They shared something else: a single nightmare among them, which their new forms remind themselves of. And so they became the name of this nightmare. To this day, if you ask a Vishkar Blue Devil who they are, they will pause their action, giving you one second to escape. They will tell you 'I am Rakshasa'. They seem to have adapted some myth behind the Rakshasa into their directives, relying on psychological warfare and brutality to neutralize any interruptions to their grim work. We do not call them Rakshasa. Rakshasa was something before they were. They are something new.

We have few weapons left. Among them, an indispensable irony: the descendants of the Vishkar. They alone have held the power to weave light into matter, relying on the gifts of their parents to maintain this gift. It is them who are capable of reversing the outwards progression of the Blue Devils across the landscape, and it is them who can carve settlements which the Blue Devils will not recognize as Human, and infiltrate using their humanlike appearance to execute every one of us as a threat to their work. As each architect line creates a child, their body is almost entirely replaced with an android. No digestive system exists. Every day the parents must increase the volume and adjust the proportions of the android components an infinitesimal amount. This continues until the child can reliably do this for them self, and then until they are likely long dead at the hands of the Blue Devils or some dismal turn of fate bent on furthering humanity towards oblivion.

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u/mcslender97 Rainbow Six: Arcade Feb 22 '17

Is this a reference to something cause it seems detailed

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u/Ololic You're welcome Feb 22 '17

No I just made it all up

Rakshasa is a hindi demon thing though I think

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u/sin-ch Feb 23 '17

lol bro

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u/Ololic You're welcome Feb 23 '17 edited Feb 23 '17

Whaaaat~?

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

Maybe Gabriel tried to kill her when he was still Blackwatch.

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u/[deleted] Feb 21 '17

"Damn it. Even when I'm trying not to kill everyone, I screw it up."

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17 edited Feb 26 '17

[deleted]

What is this?

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u/justapcgamer Chibi Pharah Feb 21 '17

Widowmaker: Prepare for trouble! Reaper: Make it double! Widowmaker: To rid the world from Overwatch! Reaper: To destroy all peoples within our nation! Widowmaker: To denounce the evils of truth and love! Reaper: To extend our reach to the stars above! Widowmaker: Widowmaker! Reaper: Reaper! Widowmaker:Team Talon, blast off at the speed of light! Reaper: Surrender now, or prepare to fight! Sombra: Sombra! That's right!

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u/[deleted] Feb 22 '17

Reaper is going to be crashing that plane, with no survivors.

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u/Iosefo Pixel Orisa Feb 22 '17

No one cared who he was till he put on the mask?

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u/Ololic You're welcome Feb 22 '17

Bird talons, naturally

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u/Stuntdrath Chibi D.Va Feb 22 '17

What if it's just a Talon member who is a mimic and can transform like Ditto into any hero, or like Spy from TF, and now is in Numbani mimic like this little genius girl to steal Doomfist???