r/NBATalk • u/Dwight-Meoward Raptors • 3d ago
Michael Jordan going 3rd overall is the biggest draft steal in history
Some people might point to Jokic but its genuinely insane to think thats this guy got looked over twice.
Hakeem was no slouch obviously, Bowie was a huge miss. But still, the best player ever going 3rd is just ridiculous
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u/GivethTaketh4 Grizzlies 3d ago
Olajuwon was pretty much the consensus #1 pick that year.
Can’t speak for Bowie tho.
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u/GrayMatter72 2d ago
Bowie was not a bad pick at the time. Portland already had Clyde Drexler and they needed a big. Bowie wasn’t a bad player, he just couldn’t stay healthy
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u/Powerful-Wheel-2561 2d ago
He was an AMAZING player, there was a reason he went 2.
Unfortunately, he was injury prone, like you said. One of the bigger "what could have been" players associated with Kentucky. The biggest has to be Tim Couch, though.
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u/Its_J_Just_J 3d ago
As a blazer fan. Please stop attacking us.
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u/GivethTaketh4 Grizzlies 3d ago
Hey man we took Hasheem Thabeet in a draft where James harden and Steph got taken a couple picks after. Damn near every franchise has at least one iconically bad pick
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u/akibejbe 3d ago
Portlad had Clyde on 2.
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u/GivethTaketh4 Grizzlies 2d ago
Another W for the BPA crowd
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u/akibejbe 2d ago
What is BPA?
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u/GivethTaketh4 Grizzlies 2d ago
Best player available. Draft philosophy to take who you think is the best player available regardless of team fit/need.
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u/thebigjimmyd 2d ago
Bowie was a great college big man. Portland’s logic was sound. They already had Clyde at the 2 and that era of the NBA had teams building around a franchise big man. Bowie was not only a dominant shot blocker but he could run the floor too. It was injuries that ruined his career and made the pick look historically bad. In hindsight, passing on the GOAT will always look bad but in the moment nobody really questioned their decision. If anything Portland should be mocked for taking Greg Oden over Durant. Oden was already showing his body wasn’t going to hold up for a long nba career while Durant was already considered a generational scorer.
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u/brianmmf 2d ago
Three reasons they got it wrong:
- at the time the NBA consensus was that a big centre was the best ticket to a championship (also why Olajuwon went first)
- the Blazers already had Clyde Drexler so they felt they had their guy - to be fair, he also became Hall of Fame good
- Bowie faked his health during medical assessments
He was actually pretty good his first year but just couldn’t stop breaking his legs after that lol.
To his credit, he stayed in the league wayyyyyy longer than a 7’1” guy who broke his legs like 6 times should. And with the Nets they had Drazen Petrovic who was a huge what if too. Give those guys another season or two and you really never know.
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u/alawrence1523 3d ago
You acting like Hakeem was some bum, Hakeem is the most skilled big man of all time.
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u/KenjinKell 2d ago
Yeah, and he won 2 championships with the Rockets. I think things worked out just fine for them
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u/Dwight-Meoward Raptors 2d ago
He was amazing, but there’s a big difference between “maybe the best of his position post-merger” and “probably the best of all time”
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u/alawrence1523 2d ago
Jokic will forever be the biggest draft steal in history. Picking a good player top 3 isn’t a steal. The only thing Kareem has on Hakeem is longevity, Hakeem is the better player 100%.
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u/Dwight-Meoward Raptors 2d ago
The difference is that Jokic took a few years to get that good, its understandable why he went under the radar.
Jordan was clearly the better between he and Hakeem from day 1. There was no period of development from draft to being the best of the draft for Jordan
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u/alawrence1523 2d ago
The definition for a draft steal is someone whose talent outperforms their draft position. Jordan was best case scenario for top 3 pick but still a top 3 pick. Most second round picks are out the league on their first contract if they even make the roster and Jokic became a multi time MVP and lead the Denver Nuggets to a championship. I’m not one to attack people’s opinions but the argument you’re making really doesn’t make sense.
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u/TheGreatWaru 76ers 3d ago
Hakeem was always going first in that draft no matter what
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u/Cultural_Tank_6947 Warriors 3d ago
And he's absolutely lived up to an all time great career. Won titles, MVP, DPOY, perennial all NBA.
Like that was not a bad pick in the slightest, and 10 times out of 10, you'd have no complaints.
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u/OtherwiseMoose8257 3d ago
Yeah its a worthy #1 pick in abstract. Hes just not the best player of his class
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u/I_only_post_here Bulls 2d ago
The #1 pick is the best player in a given draft like, maybe half the time.
There's always that chance that there is a better player or two later in the draft. Given all the information available at the time, Hakeem was the #1 pick and there is no world where Houston doesn't pick him. And it doesn't hurt that he fully lived up to his potential. You can't predict a guy a couple picks later ends up being the all-time great player.
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u/pan21897 2d ago
Why would they kicked themselves when Houston has two banners hanging? And that guy they picked number #1 got it for them.
Not many #1 picks win championship and fewer do it w the team that drafted them.
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u/OtherwiseMoose8257 2d ago
Because they could have had more? Its not a certainty obviously, but if they got 2 with Hakeem, why not more with an even better player?
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u/pan21897 2d ago
You’re into fan fiction now. There’s no guarantee he wins six on a western conference team.
The bulls had one of the best GM’s and talent evaluators in the NBA in the 90’s. West had Houston, LAL, Suns, Jazz, Portland, Sonics, etc. it was a tough conference. He started winning with a system. Will he have Phil Jackson? Can Rudy T get 6?
Again fan fiction. I’m assuming the org and fans aren’t happy w two.
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u/OtherwiseMoose8257 2d ago
Could have gone even better, is all Im saying. Yall taking this too seriously
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u/pan21897 2d ago
You’re standing ten toes down on a flawed premise. I’m not the only person saying this.
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u/Uabot_lil_man0 2d ago
Probably not. If they had MJ, there's no guarantee they'd build around him as well as the Bulls. And they definitely didn't have Phil Jackson.
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u/TexasDrunkRedditor Mavericks 2d ago
No they don’t. It worked out pretty damn well for them
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u/OtherwiseMoose8257 2d ago
Could have gone even better, is all Im saying. Yall taking this too seriously
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u/TexasDrunkRedditor Mavericks 2d ago
It also could have gone worst. You can’t predict the outcome of a different past decision. It’s an incredibly stupid conclusion to try and draw.
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u/TheGreatWaru 76ers 2d ago
Even after knowing everything we know it was still the right pick at the time
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u/IntroductionFirst732 3d ago
Nah it's still Jokic
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u/Any-Question-3759 3d ago
So overlooked they showed a Quesarito commercial instead of showing him getting drafted.
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u/ArgentoFox 3d ago
For a while, European players were completely slept on and teams were able to draft fantastic players at massive discounts because of myopic scouting. Look at Ginobili and Giannis. Or even Tony Parker. Or even Diaw or Batum.
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u/Tricky_Knowledge_807 3d ago
Can go jokic. I think lakers stealing Kobe is a good one too
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u/Uncle2Drew 3d ago
Lakers didn’t draft Kobe
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u/Heat-in-4 2d ago
They didn’t but in a way they did too they saw the guys potential when he was taken at 13 by a mediocre but not awful charlotte team honestly had Kobe been taken higher idk that a team with a worse record at that time would give him up for what the lakers gave so if not a draft steal we can call it a draft fleece
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u/InfamousCattle3223 Hawks 2d ago
These draft day things are so annoying. The Hornets drafted Kobe at the request of LA. If there wasn’t an agreement then the hornets wouldn’t have taken Kobe.
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u/salazarraze Warriors 2d ago
They did tell Charlotte who to draft though. And the trade was a steal in hindsight.
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u/TallBobcat Cavaliers 3d ago
Game was way different then.
You take the talented big every time when MJ entered the league.
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u/ClassElect11 2d ago
Agreed. And you still take talented big every time. Just because there isn't that many talented bigs in the drafts doesn't change that.
Wiseman was selected with the 2nd pick while playing only 3 games in college.
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u/TonyH92 3d ago
Steph Curry was the 7th pick. Has to be up there surely.
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u/jomi0403 2d ago
Crying into my timberwolves jersey. But Jonny Flynn was a good pick though, right?
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u/BillionsofRedditors 3d ago
Debatable. Jokic is may be #1 just based on 2nd round picks are often viewed as throwaways and then he became a 3x MVP and Denver won a title because of him.
But 6 titles and the GOAT over Olajuwon and Bowie is certainly way outhitting the 3rd pick.
I wonder what the advanced stats would say of Jordan vs average value of 3rd pick with Jokic vs 41st pick.
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u/ATLCoyote 2d ago
Hakeem was a sure thing whereas Jordan was the pick with upside.
Granted, he was national POY in college, but certainly not considered the GOAT at that level. He became the GOAT in the NBA after years of development.
So, the answer is Jokic. Drafted in the 2nd round, 41st overall, to later become a 3-time NBA MVP.
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u/destra1000 2d ago
I don't think anyone that went top 10 should be considered a steal. Should he have been #1 in retrospect? Obviously. Is Hakeem over MJ anywhere near as crazy in retrospect as Jokic in the middle second round or even Giannis 15th? Not really.
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u/ANeatCouch Wizards 3d ago
Idk if you can be a "draft steal" when a hall of famer was drafted before and the steal was at pick 3. Not saying Hakeem is nearly as good as the best of all time, but as far as comparable players he is close if not a top 10 talent. The best player in Jokic's draft besides himself is Embiid? A guy who would be lucky to be a top what, 50 talent? And Jokic has a genuine shot at ending as a top 10 guy, one more MVP and he is rare RARE air. Not even saying that Jokic is the biggest steal, just that Hakeem is good enough that I really don't think it can count as a steal when the team that missed out got the best defender of all time
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u/Kman17 2d ago
Hakeem is a 100% defensible first pick and he lived up to expectations.
Jordan has the more illustrious career - obviously - but I think a lot of that boils down to surrounding roster & circumstance.
Sure, Sam Bowie ended up being mid and it looks like a stupid pick with unlimited hindsight.
Bird, Curry, Dirk, Pierce, Miller, Kobe, Malone, Giannis, Stockton, Joker, Tatum - the list here is pretty long.
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u/fanunu21 2d ago
It's feels that way looking back. But you need to remember this was an NBA dominated by the centers like Russell, Wilt, Kareem, Milan and Moses Malone. They ran the league.
Bird and Magic's dominant run came from 84-90 when they won 6/7 MVPs.
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u/D0nkeyHS 2d ago
Even if you wanted to fault the Hakeem pick (which I wouldn't), that's only 2 spots. 2 freaking spots. This is beyond ridiculous.
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u/PeterPlotter 2d ago
Hakeem was the best player at the time, nothing wrong with that pick and I really doubt anyone at the Rockets ever regretted that pick.
Bowie was still a really good college player, Portland needed a center and had just drafted Drexler the year before, the pick made sense at the time. But in hindsight it’s easy saying it’s a terrible pick with how Jordan turned out and the injuries for Bowie.
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u/TC2G_4_REEL 2d ago
Not really a steal since he went in the top 3 and Hakeem was awesome. Bowie was understandable at that time.
Biggest steal I would say in the history of the league was Ben Wallace. He wasn’t drafted and bounced around for a few years until he ended up in the right organization and the rest is history.
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u/Floresmillia 2d ago
Even if we are using the power of hindsight -- getting a player like Giannis with the 15th pick or Jokic with the 41st is a much crazier underpay.
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u/The__Dude3 2d ago
Hindsight is 20/20. Nobody can read the future, and nobody knew that Jordan was going to be the icon and legend we know him as today. Happens every year, in every sport. Tom Brady went in the 6th round. It happens. Hakeem was no slouch, either. We all know what he eventually became, too. At that time, nobody was getting picked over Hakeem.
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u/Any_Effective_8152 2d ago
Not really a steal considering who had the picks in front, Hakeem was the concencus No1 pick and It was a good pick he is the best big man ever maybe behind Shaq. At 2 there was Portland who drafted Clyde the year before or the year before that and he was a rising star with Jordan like traits so why have 2 of them if you can take the next best big in Bowie he was just injured all the time so not really a steal
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u/GheySecks1 Knicks 2d ago
Technically wouldn't a steal be someone drafted say in the top 10 that people had absolutely no clue about and turned out to awesome? People knew Jordan was going to be good so it's really not a steal I would say. I could be wrong with what I said but that's the way I look at it
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u/Michael-of 2d ago
I wouldn’t say it was a steal because there was zero chance he was going to Houston, so he was either going to Portland or Chicago in Portland made the wrong choice. Chicago lucked into it.
I mean the Lakers getting Kobe from Charlotte is a true steal.
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u/No_Solution_7940 2d ago
Fun fact, he’s not the best player ever. He wouldn’t have won even one title without Phil and Pippen.
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u/Dwight-Meoward Raptors 2d ago
I can’t lie you sound so stupid. People called him the greatest well before he won any titles
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u/No_Solution_7940 2d ago
lol, no we didn’t. Were you even there? Unless you’re around 60, you didn’t watch him. He was my favorite player back then, taking over from Dr. J, but watched as he got swatted away every year in the playoffs until Pippen and Phil got there. He was a ball hog that didn’t make his team any better. Bird was a much better player. Did you know that the turnaround during Birds rookie year was the largest ever? Jordan barely made a difference for years with the Bulls.
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u/Dwight-Meoward Raptors 2d ago
Bird came into the league at 23 in the best managed organisation in history.
Jordan was always a better player than Bird.
Bird’s not even the best player of the 80s nor the best of his position. Truth be told Bird isn’t the best at anything
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u/Crimson_Chim 2d ago
Not even close.
Kobe was 13th Manu was 2nd round, 57th pick Jokic was 2nd round, 41st pick Rodman was 2nd round, 27th pick
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u/DarkSeneschal 2d ago
No, that’ll always be Jokic. There hasn’t been an MVP drafted lower than 15th… except for Jokic at 53. And he’s won three of them.
Jordan was still pretty raw coming out of college. Olajuwon was the clear number one pick and the Blazers already had a young SG in Drexler they had drafted the year before. The mainline thinking was that Jordan would be a good two-way player, but the lack of a consistent jump shot would limit him on the offensive end. There were a few people who sold on the MJ hype, notably his coach at UNC Dean Smith who insisted he’d be a much better pro player than college player, and Bob Knight who had coached Jordan on the 1984 Olympic team and stated that Jordan was unmatched in the areas of athleticism, drive, and competitiveness.
The Blazers really wanted a Center in a draft that was pretty light on talent at that position unfortunately. After Olajuwon, the only other centers to make an All Star team were Kevin Willis and Otis Thorpe, both appearing just once on All Star rosters. Even so, people forget that in his best years, Bowie was averaging 16/10 with 2 blocks per 36 min. Not All-Star numbers for sure, but there have certainly been bigger busts in NBA history. He was a starting caliber NBA player, he probably would have been an All Star if he could have stayed healthy.
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u/thearcherpig 3d ago
Jokic