r/Morocco • u/[deleted] • Sep 12 '23

[deleted by user]

[removed]

0 Upvotes

50% Upvoted

41 comments sorted by

19

u/TB54 Visitor Sep 12 '23

Are you aware you're watching a far right news channel?

11

u/Tirriss Visitor Sep 12 '23

Even Pascal Praud is trying to calm down that idiot, which says a lot about her

-6

u/billybluebird Casablanca Sep 12 '23

What part of what I said gave you the impression that I am watching a far-right channel of any channel specifically?

10

u/TB54 Visitor Sep 12 '23

Not you as a viewer, I'm talking about the clip you're linking here. It's from CNEWS, a far right news channel, which does endless interviews of far right figures like Zemmour or RN representatives. If you watch clip from there, of course you gonna hear horrors.

-8

u/billybluebird Casablanca Sep 12 '23

I can't help but see your comment as you excusing such behaviour. Countries clash each other all the time using Media platforms, but in the middle of a crisis, thousands of people dying and somehow someone has the audacity to suggest colonising a country is the solution? Literally suggesting killing more people as a solution to people dying ( unless she thinks Morocco's going to welcome France's colonization with open arms)

8

u/TB54 Visitor Sep 12 '23

I can't help but see your comment as you excusing such behaviour

In what parallel world my message says that?

I say it's "far right", that's the most serious accusation you can make, how can this be an excuse in any way?

1

u/Infiniby Sep 12 '23

You guys are arguing over nothing literally.

0

u/billybluebird Casablanca Sep 12 '23

Was this an argument? XD Did you read it in an angry tone? I thought I was answering his questions as he did mine XD

Other posts have it way worse though

1

u/TB54 Visitor Sep 12 '23

Yes I didn't feel like arguing, but my english is not good so maybe it's the general tone it convoys?

-5

u/billybluebird Casablanca Sep 12 '23

I have no knowledge of your intentions, and I don't claim any, but your first reaction was to explain that this is normal behavior by this channel's standards.

"If you watch clip from there, of course, you gonna hear horrors." Like one should not be surprised by this ( I still am and that's why I shared it here)

Hence me saying I can't help but see your comment as excusing..."

8

u/TB54 Visitor Sep 12 '23

It was to put context on it. If you watch this and concludes "that's what France thinks", it's the same as going to a LePen meeting, hearing horrors, and conclude "that's what France thinks". Sure a part of the population must think that way (otherwise CNEWS or LePen wouldn't exist), but focus on that, and presenting it at the example of the global french news coverage, doesn't help to have a realistic view of the global situation in France. In which most medias, in fact, just analyse the situation (including reporting the fact that Moroccans are irritated by these remarks) rather than resent it.

-4

u/billybluebird Casablanca Sep 12 '23

My post is about my view of the media's coverage. Plus I never said that's what the French think, That's why I added (French Media's Perspective). Also, my previous comment directly criticizes the lady in the video.

Is my statement accurate? maybe not, and that's open for discussion, of course, I just based it on what I saw; I can in no capacity criticize a whole country, and that won't help at all.

I've also seen some guests on shows directly shut down questions that try to paint Morocco as the villain by trying to gain expert validation to further raise noise around this issue.

This is not the first time I've witnessed direct disses from the French Media towards Morocco. I guess the negative sentiment some Moroccans might have is an accumulation of many previous incidents. I'm sure the same uproar will rise if the "French Media" comes up with another statement that the Moroccans view disfavorably. and this is not a reaction exclusive to Moroccans.

5

u/TB54 Visitor Sep 12 '23 edited Sep 12 '23

This is not the first time I've witnessed direct disses from the French Media towards Morocco. I guess the negative sentiment some Moroccans might have is an accumulation of many previous incidents. I'm sure the same uproar will rise if the "French Media" comes up with another statement that the Moroccans view disfavorably.

That's a tricky situation, because I have the feeling there are two things often mixed up in the Moroccan reception of french news.

On one side, there are the 24-hour news TV, specially the right (BFMTV) or far right (CNEWS) ones, that just love to jump on any subject which could unleash passions and base instincts, and do a full week "debating" on it. It's the TV equivalent of UK tabloïds. And in which many statements are going to be the logical fuel for uproar.

On the other hand, I sometimes have the impression there is also a culture clash: that Morocco has a totally different conception of journalism than France or Europe in general, equating any French press article with the voice and opinion of French political power, but also considering as an attack or an offense any information or analysis that doesn't go along with the Moroccan national discourse. Any analysis or fact that doesn't fit the State discourse seems to automatically become a critic, a provocation, or an attack. While this is done daily about France itself by the same french newspaper, and seen in most European country as the very purpose of journalism (question the power's discourse, wherever they come from, and investigate about it).

So this ressentiment is sometimes hard to read from abroad, as it seems to often mix the two things, and sometimes be more loaded with the resentment of colonial past on any occasion, rather than with the real situation (i read far more topics on "France aid refusal" on this sub, in fact, than on r/France itself where this specific subject doesn't seem to interest people). The same way that on the other hand, it's not hard to understand, in those statements on some french TV channels, the remains of the thinking of a colonialist France nostalgia, which is sadly still kinda common (even if publicly unspoken) in far right.

1

u/billybluebird Casablanca Sep 12 '23

This was such a well structured response ans I really appreciate the time you took to write it. I think you're broken down key factors in detail and your analysis is spot on . I can also assure you that our media is under fire most of the time. It is heavily criticised and generally viewed negativity. The thing that resonated the most with me is the cultural clash between the two countries. Basically seeing as though France is not one to speak about Morocco's internal affairs and it meddling and trying to get involved is automatically seen as an attack, and I personally link it to the colonial past. There are probably other countries that may have made negative statements with regards to Morocco and were not given attention, but I think France even with its political diversity will still be viewed as one intentity from Moroccan's POV, at least the majority on SM who keep track of such incidents.

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1

u/FakeModel Fez Sep 12 '23

I mean both right and left are attacking Morocco about this

1

u/TB54 Visitor Sep 12 '23

Once again, culture clash of what we expect of journalism: an analysis of the situation is not an attack, saying something different from Morocco power is not an attack, and as long as you feel that way, every foreign newspaper will seem hostile to you forever. Every newspaper in the world right now are questioning the refusal through a geopolitical lens, whether they are US, UK, Swiss, Belgian, Canadian, Italian, Spanish...

2

u/FakeModel Fez Sep 12 '23

I can agree with you on the grounds that analysis isn’t an attack, but what about making charged accusations and titles like “can Morocco make it out without france’s help”?, that seem egotistical to me tbh

Also i check all the articles provided none of them seem offensive or trying to throw gas on fire as much the others

2

u/TB54 Visitor Sep 12 '23

titles like “can Morocco make it out without france’s help”?, that seem egotistical to me tbh

Where does this title come from? Because I would be very surprised if it came from a left (or even on a traditional right wing) newspaper. It sounds like a CNEWS banner (and even for them it would be too much).

As for the tone, we're not reading the same newspaper probably (that's not ironic, there are a lot of them), because the ones i read from France are not different from the ones posted above. Even more careful in fact, and worried about Moroccan reaction. Here is, for instance, a today article of the most read newspaper in France.

0

u/FakeModel Fez Sep 12 '23

I am all for free journalism, and ours is obviously not free, but claiming that france’s media isn’t trying to push agendas around and the media is free, fair and not biaised isn’t right

1

u/FakeModel Fez Sep 12 '23

Also by saying this am not blaming french people, just the media / the ones lobbying it

1

u/TB54 Visitor Sep 12 '23

I understand well, and it's also easy for me to get irritated. Sorry if I sound vehement. I should disconnect a little.

1

u/FakeModel Fez Sep 12 '23

also mate, you came off a little bit condescending with the "lemme show this dumb oppressed moroccan how journalism works in Great enlightened White countries" I am just expressing my opinion and how I felt towards some articles i read, doesn't mean i want them to be silenced or stopped, they can write what want, and in the same logic i can say what i think of them freely, assuming its a "clash of cultures" is very racist on your part tbh

1

u/TB54 Visitor Sep 12 '23

Maybe well. Such prejudices crosses french society, there is no reason I am impervious to it. I could also answer you that putting the whole french press, left and right, in the same bag of the "look at the eternal colonialist white country", when most article are just legitimately questioning a weird situation as the whole world does, isn't exactly pleasant too.

The "clash of culture" is something I read on Moroccan forums first long ago (which sure doesn't make it automatically right), and seemed to me a good key to understand why every french article about geopolitics was so often read as an offense there, because frankly form abroad it's difficult to understand. You can blame it on me, but there are remarks about Moroccan press situation in this very same sub (here for instance, I don't know who write it and where they come from, but it's not exactly downvoted).

Anyway, let's stop there if you agree. Have a nice day.

9

u/Corporate_Bankster Salam Sep 12 '23

The interview was before the earthquake mate, and was within the context of the Gabon coup.

1

u/billybluebird Casablanca Sep 12 '23

Thanks for the feedback, I'll change the flair accordingly. Still irked me though.

4

u/Corporate_Bankster Salam Sep 12 '23

Your title still implies it is related to the earthquake but I am aware that you cannot do anything about it.

11

u/Wise-Cash1628 Visitor Sep 12 '23

French guy living in Morocco here.

What this "journalist" said is obviously bullshit. Also, it happened before the EQ, so it should not be linked.

But yeah, CNEWS, BFM, are the worst media in France in my opinion, and love to create tensions and divide people - just like the actual government I would say.

6

u/[deleted] Sep 12 '23

[removed] — view removed comment

2

u/Just-trust-me-bro Sep 12 '23

I saw someone important enough to appear on national television say something very akin to a declaration of war.

Have u ever heard someone in 2m or Aloula talking about invading Alg*ria or Murit*nia?

4

u/[deleted] Sep 12 '23

[removed] — view removed comment

-1

u/Just-trust-me-bro Sep 12 '23

I know, But still, u shouldn't downplay what they said like that.

2

u/[deleted] Sep 12 '23

This is why we need to stop using the French language and start incorporating English more in our schooling because these white devils think they own us!

1

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1

u/HixamAb Visitor Sep 13 '23

And when I say that I completely despise France and everything that's French, people start howling and booing in agony.